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[deleted]

prawn 7y ago
I don't think they're suggesting that citizens panic but that authorities take more drastic steps (as you indicate you think they should have).
ISL 7y ago
As a citizen, you can remove yourself from travel and gatherings. The scaling of an outbreak is non-linear, so the choices of individuals have an outsized effect. My wife and I have both led by example in both choosing to work from home early on and arguing strenuously that our employers should make WFH company/University policy (which has now happened). Be leading by example and staying home, you make everyone else safer. If the effective R_0 can be brought below 1, the outbreak will burn out. We must show our care for those who cannot fight this virus by staying home, connecting electronically, and practicing good hygiene.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- Florin_Andrei 7y ago
  As a citizen you can do many things. But when whole populations need to act in a concerted way, a centralized decision-making mechanism is required. Everything else is naive dreaming.
  - ISL 7y ago
    Coordination helps, but the individual is not powerless. I do not need a central authority to tell me to care for those around me. Furthermore, we can use our voices and examples to convince others to make choices that are likely to help others. It isn't perfect, it doesn't always work, but in this instance, I am certain that it helps.
    - Florin_Andrei 7y ago
      > I am certain that it helps Yes, about 1% soaking wet, with pockets full of bricks. This anti-government religion can turn pretty dangerous in situations like this.
  - greiskul 7y ago
    Well, but the things an individual citizen can do can affect that individual citizens life, right? Have your elderly family taken care of try to prevent them from getting the disease, practicing good hygiene, staying at home if possible, having a proper stock of food and any medicine that anyone in your family needs, all these things can individually help you and your family, even if the rest of the country is not doing anything.
  - roywiggins 7y ago
    Frankly, we need both. Look at Hong Kong, which spontaneously cleared the streets to fight the virus. With the protest movements, the government couldn't clear the streets. The trust in the authorities is minimal. But people chose to stay in. I have seen it suggested that this response is simply because HK remembers SARS. Quarantines are hard to enforce with brute force. Consent of the governed will make this all way, way easier.
    - ISL 7y ago
      I think China's and HK's experience with SARS made a big difference in the response. The US has no such experience in living memory, so there is no collective gut understanding that epidemics are best dealt with decisively and kept small. Once China's national government took the response seriously, the instantaneous and speedy construction of hospitals was really impressive. We see a little bit of that here in Seattle, with quarantine sites/hotels being prepared, but nothing on the scale which may be required.

[deleted]

I don't think they're suggesting that citizens panic but that authorities take more drastic steps (as you indicate you think they should have).

ISL 7y ago

As a citizen, you can remove yourself from travel and gatherings. The scaling of an outbreak is non-linear, so the choices of individuals have an outsized effect. My wife and I have both led by example in both choosing to work from home early on and arguing strenuously that our employers should make WFH company/University policy (which has now happened). Be leading by example and staying home, you make everyone else safer. If the effective R_0 can be brought below 1, the outbreak will burn out. We must show our care for those who cannot fight this virus by staying home, connecting electronically, and practicing good hygiene.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
Florin_Andrei 7y ago
As a citizen you can do many things. But when whole populations need to act in a concerted way, a centralized decision-making mechanism is required. Everything else is naive dreaming.
- ISL 7y ago
  Coordination helps, but the individual is not powerless. I do not need a central authority to tell me to care for those around me. Furthermore, we can use our voices and examples to convince others to make choices that are likely to help others. It isn't perfect, it doesn't always work, but in this instance, I am certain that it helps.
  - Florin_Andrei 7y ago
    > I am certain that it helps Yes, about 1% soaking wet, with pockets full of bricks. This anti-government religion can turn pretty dangerous in situations like this.
- greiskul 7y ago
  Well, but the things an individual citizen can do can affect that individual citizens life, right? Have your elderly family taken care of try to prevent them from getting the disease, practicing good hygiene, staying at home if possible, having a proper stock of food and any medicine that anyone in your family needs, all these things can individually help you and your family, even if the rest of the country is not doing anything.
- roywiggins 7y ago
  Frankly, we need both. Look at Hong Kong, which spontaneously cleared the streets to fight the virus. With the protest movements, the government couldn't clear the streets. The trust in the authorities is minimal. But people chose to stay in. I have seen it suggested that this response is simply because HK remembers SARS. Quarantines are hard to enforce with brute force. Consent of the governed will make this all way, way easier.
  - ISL 7y ago
    I think China's and HK's experience with SARS made a big difference in the response. The US has no such experience in living memory, so there is no collective gut understanding that epidemics are best dealt with decisively and kept small. Once China's national government took the response seriously, the instantaneous and speedy construction of hospitals was really impressive. We see a little bit of that here in Seattle, with quarantine sites/hotels being prepared, but nothing on the scale which may be required.