7 ms·

Read ESRs blog. He has gone insane after 9/11. He thinks homosexuals are pedophile. I have the cathedral and the Bazaar at home, and I live that book, but he i

Read ESRs blog. He has gone insane after 9/11. He thinks homosexuals are pedophile. I have the cathedral and the Bazaar at home, and I live that book, but he isn't part of the healthy open source community anymore.

justinmk 7y ago
> He thinks homosexuals are pedophile. Do you have a primary source for that? This sounds like a cancel-culture rumor intended to attach negative ideas to a person in order to discredit them.
- supernintendo 7y ago
  Straight from the horse's mouth: http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=26 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=26
  - asdf21 7y ago
    >and the North American Man-Boy Love Association, actively advocating pederasty and pedophilia, is welcomed at gay-pride events everywhere. Hit "D" for doubt. ^ That being said, he never says all gays are pedos though -- he says they are three to ten times more likely to be pedos.
  - kyleee 7y ago
    After reading that entire post, I believe the above quote that: "He thinks homosexuals are pedophile[s]" is false. The rant asserts that homosexuals may be more predisposed to pedophelia and/or ephebophelia than those who are straight. Though as an astute commenter on the post pointed out that basically no evidence for the central thesis was provided by ESR.
- deleted 7y ago
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- kick 7y ago
  He's a real winner. I won't go as far as to claim he thinks all homosexuals are pedophiles because I personally can't remember the link for when I read him say that, but here's a quote that edges that line: And that brings us to the Jeffrey Epstein scandal. In particular, the widespread tagging of Epstein as a pedophile. No, Jeffrey Epstein is not a pedophile. This is important. If conservatives keep misidentifying him as one, I fear some unfortunate consequences. Pedophiles desire pre-pubertal children. This is not Epstein’s kink; he quite obviously likes his girls to be as young as possible but fully nubile. The correct term for this is “ephebophile”, and being clear about the distinction matters. I’ll explain why. The Left has a long history of triggering conservatives into self-discrediting moral panics (“Rock and roll is the devil’s music”). It also has a strong internal contingent that would like to normalize pedophilia. I mean the real thing, not Epstein’s creepy ephebophilia. Homosexual pedophiles have been biding their time in order to get adult-on-adult homosexuality fully normalized as battlespace prep, but you see a few trial balloons go up occasionally in places like Salon. The last round of this was interrupted by the need to take down Milo Yiannopolous, but the internal logic of left-wing sexual liberationism always demands new ways to freak out the normals, and the pedophiles are more than willing to be next up in satisfying that perpetual demand. http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=8415 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=8415
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silverreads 7y ago
only nutters were attracted to this work in the 80s and 90s. My point stands. We're kicking out the people that thought differently enough to make the world we now live in. Honestly I refuse to blame someone for believing propaganda when it was so strongly pressed upon them. Remember, gay content only recently became acceptable to advertisers and corporate america. Anyone with the old anti-gay viewpoints will be purged by them and their cronies to make more money. This is wrong. Only actual misdeeds should be punished. It's ok to have wrong ideas. We all have them. I'm queer, but have a LOT of empathy for the previous generation and the crap they had to put up with. Can you just imagine trying to say you were a LGTBQ ally in the 1970s when these people were in their formative years??? It was a different time. They are a product of that time. Be thankful.
- turbinerneiter 7y ago
  It's not about him no being an ally I'm the 70. It's about him conflating homosexuality with pedophilia _today_. I'm thankful for his work, but today people like him are driving away people from open source. And this is not a Linus Torvalds sometimes uses rude language kind of thing. It's about a person spewing hatred and toxic lies.
  - LiNeXT 7y ago
    What relevance does his personal opinion on homosexuality, expressed on his personal blog, have to his participation in an OSI mailing list about open source licensing?
    - turbinerneiter 7y ago
      It spills over. He is fighting against codes of conducts and diversity because he thinks its about normalizing homosexuality and he thinks that normalizing homosexuality is the first step towards normalizing pedophilia.
      - zozbot234 7y ago
        This is quite wrong[0]. ESR has credited "normalizing homosexuality" (which as a social movement only began in the late 19th century) with pushing MSM away from predatory sexuality/pederasty (the Graeco-Roman/Mediterranean model, albeit not exclusive to that milieu), and towards egalitarian, affectionate relationships. He pleads with well-meaning, egalitarian gays to remain vigilant against attempts within the LGBT movement to normalize predatory sex (including pederasty) in the future. This is probably feasible, because we managed to do it starting from the late 19th c. in the developed West. [0] http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=1063 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=1063
Ottolay 7y ago
Citation please?
canada_dry 7y ago
“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” I'd say this might be case-in-point. Banning ESR will, of course, only reinforce and further his fury and disdain for what he seems to believe is political correctness gone awry.
- kick 7y ago
  The OSI was consistent with the banning, though. He broke the rules, he got banned. Even if it drives him further into his current beliefs, it keeps him from throwing personal attacks on public mailing lists, which is what the OSI wants.
  - zionic 7y ago
    >He broke the rules, he got banned. Truth is treason in an empire of lies.
- rodgerd 7y ago
  Not seeing a lot of evidence of a great mind.
LiNeXT 7y ago
His personal blog isn't relevant.
NyxWulf 7y ago
Reading the quote from Kick https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22539826 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22539826 doesn't say that. It seems a bit off base to me, but so what? People aren't all good or all bad. They aren't an authority on everything they have an opinion on. That is what makes appeal to authority so dangerous. I don't think it's possible for any strong opinion to please everyone. To me the question really does boil down to whether freedom of speech is truly supported within the open source community. True freedom of speech allows all opinions, even the disgusting ones so that hair splitting censorship can't drown out dissent.
- tedivm 7y ago
  I'm not aware of any organization that promotes "true freedom of speech" to that extreme. I don't want the government shutting ESR down, but I would never hire someone who has said what he says about race, gender, or sexuality. The OSI has their own rights as well, and part of their own freedom of speech is that they get to chose who does or doesn't use their platform for speech.
  - NyxWulf 7y ago
    > I'm not aware of any organization that promotes "true freedom of speech" to that extreme. I don't want the government shutting ESR down, but I would never hire someone who has said what he says about race, gender, or sexuality. Promoting something isn't the same thing as supporting or allowing it. Many mailing lists have allowed a self governing style of free speech. If you don't want to hear from someone, you add then to your banlist. The extreme and consistently offensive get marginalized by each person, rather than by a singular authority. Your comment about never hiring someone who was said what ESR says about race, gender, or sexuality is a broad and unspecific brush. I've read the links provided, what specifically did he say, and when that would make him un-hireable forever?
    - tedivm 7y ago
      His comments on women along are disqualifying- > "Try to avoid even being alone, ever, because there is a chance that a 'women in tech' advocacy group is going to try to collect your scalp." In my job I regularly have to talk to women. I wouldn't hire a developer who treated half the population differently. That's just one example too.
RationalWikilol 7y ago
Is his claims baseless or grounded in reality based on accurate historical data? https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fde.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FHelmut_Kentler https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=https...

justinmk 7y ago

> He thinks homosexuals are pedophile. Do you have a primary source for that? This sounds like a cancel-culture rumor intended to attach negative ideas to a person in order to discredit them.

supernintendo 7y ago
Straight from the horse's mouth: http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=26 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=26
- asdf21 7y ago
  >and the North American Man-Boy Love Association, actively advocating pederasty and pedophilia, is welcomed at gay-pride events everywhere. Hit "D" for doubt. ^ That being said, he never says all gays are pedos though -- he says they are three to ten times more likely to be pedos.
- kyleee 7y ago
  After reading that entire post, I believe the above quote that: "He thinks homosexuals are pedophile[s]" is false. The rant asserts that homosexuals may be more predisposed to pedophelia and/or ephebophelia than those who are straight. Though as an astute commenter on the post pointed out that basically no evidence for the central thesis was provided by ESR.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
kick 7y ago
He's a real winner. I won't go as far as to claim he thinks all homosexuals are pedophiles because I personally can't remember the link for when I read him say that, but here's a quote that edges that line: And that brings us to the Jeffrey Epstein scandal. In particular, the widespread tagging of Epstein as a pedophile. No, Jeffrey Epstein is not a pedophile. This is important. If conservatives keep misidentifying him as one, I fear some unfortunate consequences. Pedophiles desire pre-pubertal children. This is not Epstein’s kink; he quite obviously likes his girls to be as young as possible but fully nubile. The correct term for this is “ephebophile”, and being clear about the distinction matters. I’ll explain why. The Left has a long history of triggering conservatives into self-discrediting moral panics (“Rock and roll is the devil’s music”). It also has a strong internal contingent that would like to normalize pedophilia. I mean the real thing, not Epstein’s creepy ephebophilia. Homosexual pedophiles have been biding their time in order to get adult-on-adult homosexuality fully normalized as battlespace prep, but you see a few trial balloons go up occasionally in places like Salon. The last round of this was interrupted by the need to take down Milo Yiannopolous, but the internal logic of left-wing sexual liberationism always demands new ways to freak out the normals, and the pedophiles are more than willing to be next up in satisfying that perpetual demand. http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=8415 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=8415
deleted 7y ago
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silverreads 7y ago

only nutters were attracted to this work in the 80s and 90s. My point stands. We're kicking out the people that thought differently enough to make the world we now live in. Honestly I refuse to blame someone for believing propaganda when it was so strongly pressed upon them. Remember, gay content only recently became acceptable to advertisers and corporate america. Anyone with the old anti-gay viewpoints will be purged by them and their cronies to make more money. This is wrong. Only actual misdeeds should be punished. It's ok to have wrong ideas. We all have them. I'm queer, but have a LOT of empathy for the previous generation and the crap they had to put up with. Can you just imagine trying to say you were a LGTBQ ally in the 1970s when these people were in their formative years??? It was a different time. They are a product of that time. Be thankful.

turbinerneiter 7y ago
It's not about him no being an ally I'm the 70. It's about him conflating homosexuality with pedophilia _today_. I'm thankful for his work, but today people like him are driving away people from open source. And this is not a Linus Torvalds sometimes uses rude language kind of thing. It's about a person spewing hatred and toxic lies.
- LiNeXT 7y ago
  What relevance does his personal opinion on homosexuality, expressed on his personal blog, have to his participation in an OSI mailing list about open source licensing?
  - turbinerneiter 7y ago
    It spills over. He is fighting against codes of conducts and diversity because he thinks its about normalizing homosexuality and he thinks that normalizing homosexuality is the first step towards normalizing pedophilia.
    - zozbot234 7y ago
      This is quite wrong[0]. ESR has credited "normalizing homosexuality" (which as a social movement only began in the late 19th century) with pushing MSM away from predatory sexuality/pederasty (the Graeco-Roman/Mediterranean model, albeit not exclusive to that milieu), and towards egalitarian, affectionate relationships. He pleads with well-meaning, egalitarian gays to remain vigilant against attempts within the LGBT movement to normalize predatory sex (including pederasty) in the future. This is probably feasible, because we managed to do it starting from the late 19th c. in the developed West. [0] http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=1063 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=1063

Ottolay 7y ago

Citation please?

canada_dry 7y ago

“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” I'd say this might be case-in-point. Banning ESR will, of course, only reinforce and further his fury and disdain for what he seems to believe is political correctness gone awry.

kick 7y ago
The OSI was consistent with the banning, though. He broke the rules, he got banned. Even if it drives him further into his current beliefs, it keeps him from throwing personal attacks on public mailing lists, which is what the OSI wants.
- zionic 7y ago
  >He broke the rules, he got banned. Truth is treason in an empire of lies.
rodgerd 7y ago
Not seeing a lot of evidence of a great mind.

LiNeXT 7y ago

His personal blog isn't relevant.

NyxWulf 7y ago

Reading the quote from Kick https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22539826 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22539826 doesn't say that. It seems a bit off base to me, but so what? People aren't all good or all bad. They aren't an authority on everything they have an opinion on. That is what makes appeal to authority so dangerous. I don't think it's possible for any strong opinion to please everyone. To me the question really does boil down to whether freedom of speech is truly supported within the open source community. True freedom of speech allows all opinions, even the disgusting ones so that hair splitting censorship can't drown out dissent.

tedivm 7y ago
I'm not aware of any organization that promotes "true freedom of speech" to that extreme. I don't want the government shutting ESR down, but I would never hire someone who has said what he says about race, gender, or sexuality. The OSI has their own rights as well, and part of their own freedom of speech is that they get to chose who does or doesn't use their platform for speech.
- NyxWulf 7y ago
  > I'm not aware of any organization that promotes "true freedom of speech" to that extreme. I don't want the government shutting ESR down, but I would never hire someone who has said what he says about race, gender, or sexuality. Promoting something isn't the same thing as supporting or allowing it. Many mailing lists have allowed a self governing style of free speech. If you don't want to hear from someone, you add then to your banlist. The extreme and consistently offensive get marginalized by each person, rather than by a singular authority. Your comment about never hiring someone who was said what ESR says about race, gender, or sexuality is a broad and unspecific brush. I've read the links provided, what specifically did he say, and when that would make him un-hireable forever?
  - tedivm 7y ago
    His comments on women along are disqualifying- > "Try to avoid even being alone, ever, because there is a chance that a 'women in tech' advocacy group is going to try to collect your scalp." In my job I regularly have to talk to women. I wouldn't hire a developer who treated half the population differently. That's just one example too.

RationalWikilol 7y ago

Is his claims baseless or grounded in reality based on accurate historical data? https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fde.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FHelmut_Kentler https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=https...