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The difficulty in finding 1099 arrangements these days for tech companies is that they often want to monopolize your time, which they can't do in a 1099 arrange

The difficulty in finding 1099 arrangements these days for tech companies is that they often want to monopolize your time, which they can't do in a 1099 arrangement. Basically, back in the late 90s or so, Microsoft tried to use 1099s to avoid giving out benefits (such as unemployment insurance) and got hammered by the Labor Department for it. So now most places either put everyone under W2 or are super strict about the number of hours you can work. It basically comes down to who gets to say when you start and stop working. If the company wants to demand a certain set of hours of the day (not just an aggregate of hours during a work period), then the person doing the work is not a "contractor". Contractors are supposed to be able to make their own hours and find any number of clients they wish to fill their time. If the client doesn't like you doing that, then they are obligated to make you an employee.

cosmodisk 7y ago
The mentality of some companies are beyond weird. If I hire a contractor, especially in tech sector, I couldn't care less what hours he does as long as the job is done.If I can't measure what the guy does in x days/month- I'm a tool in here. There are still too many managers out there who think that if a person sits all day staring at the monitor that equates working.
thaumasiotes 7y ago
> If the company wants to demand a certain set of hours of the day (not just an aggregate of hours during a work period), then the person doing the work is not a "contractor". Contractors are supposed to be able to make their own hours and find any number of clients they wish to fill their time. This is not true in general; for example, security guards can have contractor status while obviously still being required to show up during their shift and not someone else's shift.
- culturestate 7y ago
  > security guards can have contractor status while obviously still being required to show up during their shift and not someone else's shift No, the IRS (assuming we're talking about the US) wouldn't allow it - that security guard would either need to be classified as an employee or provide their services to the customer as a corporate entity themselves. The guidelines[1] around this are very straightforward: "Under common-law rules, anyone who performs services for you is your employee if you can control what will be done and how it will be done. This is so even when you give the employee freedom of action. What matters is that you have the right to control the details of how the services are performed." 1. https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/independent-contractor-defined https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employe...
  - thaumasiotes 7y ago
    > The guidelines around this are very straightforward And yet your quote doesn't even mention scheduling or the concept of time. > the IRS wouldn't allow that - that security guard would either need to be classified as an employee or provide services as a corporation This is not true. Please don't spread falsehoods in public like this. See https://coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2016/03/my-new-hero-and-how-the-department-of-labor-bought-me-drinks.html https://coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2016/03/my-new-hero-and-h... and the link through, https://www.cato.org/blog/four-more-courts-smack-down-obama-administration-workplace-law https://www.cato.org/blog/four-more-courts-smack-down-obama-... . The fact that a job needs to be performed at a particular time is not sufficient to prevent contractors from performing that job.
    - culturestate 7y ago
      > And yet your quote doesn't even mention scheduling or the concept of time. If you drill down[1] on that page to "Behavioral Control," you'll find : "An employee is generally subject to the business’s instructions about when, where, and how to work. All of the following are examples of types of instructions about how to do work. - When and where to do the work." > This is not true. Please don't spread falsehoods in public like this. I'm not sure it's fair to classify a widely-accepted interpretation of the law as a "falsehood" but anyway, according to this[2] it seems that at least one court agrees that security guards are not independent contractors if they meet the above-linked criteria: "A Louisiana federal district court has granted a motion approving a confidential settlement in a collective action by New Orleans security guards under the federal Fair Labor Standards Act...They claimed that the company had complete control over how, when and where the guards performed their work; set the guards’ work schedules; and required the guards to wear uniforms with the company’s logo." 1. https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/behavioral-control https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employe... 2. https://independentcontractorcompliance.com/2017/11/06/october-2017-independent-contractor-misclassification-and-compliance-news-update/ https://independentcontractorcompliance.com/2017/11/06/octob...
  - leetcrew 7y ago
    so if I pay someone to clean my house every Wednesday morning and tell them they can't use bleach, they're my employee?
- dnautics 7y ago
  Aren't security guards usually contractors by virtue of the fact that they are employed by a company that is contracted to do the work? (Usually the company whose name appears on their patch)?
  - tonyarkles 7y ago
    Laws vary by jurisdiction. I recently learned about how it works in Saskatchewan, Canada: indie contractor guards pretty much don’t fit into our legislation. A company offering guard services must be licensed and bonded, and the guards themselves must be licensed. A guards license requires the applicant to pass a one-time exam, and their license is tied to a specific employer. If you’rea guards and want to change your employer, you have to reapply for a new license. You could set up your own Corp and offer guards services, and in that case it would be pretty clear that you’re a contractor (you’ve put up your own bond and registered your company with the province), but otherwise there’s not really any way to have a solo contractor guard.

cosmodisk 7y ago

The mentality of some companies are beyond weird. If I hire a contractor, especially in tech sector, I couldn't care less what hours he does as long as the job is done.If I can't measure what the guy does in x days/month- I'm a tool in here. There are still too many managers out there who think that if a person sits all day staring at the monitor that equates working.

thaumasiotes 7y ago

> If the company wants to demand a certain set of hours of the day (not just an aggregate of hours during a work period), then the person doing the work is not a "contractor". Contractors are supposed to be able to make their own hours and find any number of clients they wish to fill their time. This is not true in general; for example, security guards can have contractor status while obviously still being required to show up during their shift and not someone else's shift.

culturestate 7y ago
> security guards can have contractor status while obviously still being required to show up during their shift and not someone else's shift No, the IRS (assuming we're talking about the US) wouldn't allow it - that security guard would either need to be classified as an employee or provide their services to the customer as a corporate entity themselves. The guidelines[1] around this are very straightforward: "Under common-law rules, anyone who performs services for you is your employee if you can control what will be done and how it will be done. This is so even when you give the employee freedom of action. What matters is that you have the right to control the details of how the services are performed." 1. https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/independent-contractor-defined https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employe...
- thaumasiotes 7y ago
  > The guidelines around this are very straightforward And yet your quote doesn't even mention scheduling or the concept of time. > the IRS wouldn't allow that - that security guard would either need to be classified as an employee or provide services as a corporation This is not true. Please don't spread falsehoods in public like this. See https://coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2016/03/my-new-hero-and-how-the-department-of-labor-bought-me-drinks.html https://coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/2016/03/my-new-hero-and-h... and the link through, https://www.cato.org/blog/four-more-courts-smack-down-obama-administration-workplace-law https://www.cato.org/blog/four-more-courts-smack-down-obama-... . The fact that a job needs to be performed at a particular time is not sufficient to prevent contractors from performing that job.
  - culturestate 7y ago
    > And yet your quote doesn't even mention scheduling or the concept of time. If you drill down[1] on that page to "Behavioral Control," you'll find : "An employee is generally subject to the business’s instructions about when, where, and how to work. All of the following are examples of types of instructions about how to do work. - When and where to do the work." > This is not true. Please don't spread falsehoods in public like this. I'm not sure it's fair to classify a widely-accepted interpretation of the law as a "falsehood" but anyway, according to this[2] it seems that at least one court agrees that security guards are not independent contractors if they meet the above-linked criteria: "A Louisiana federal district court has granted a motion approving a confidential settlement in a collective action by New Orleans security guards under the federal Fair Labor Standards Act...They claimed that the company had complete control over how, when and where the guards performed their work; set the guards’ work schedules; and required the guards to wear uniforms with the company’s logo." 1. https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/behavioral-control https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employe... 2. https://independentcontractorcompliance.com/2017/11/06/october-2017-independent-contractor-misclassification-and-compliance-news-update/ https://independentcontractorcompliance.com/2017/11/06/octob...
- leetcrew 7y ago
  so if I pay someone to clean my house every Wednesday morning and tell them they can't use bleach, they're my employee?
dnautics 7y ago
Aren't security guards usually contractors by virtue of the fact that they are employed by a company that is contracted to do the work? (Usually the company whose name appears on their patch)?
- tonyarkles 7y ago
  Laws vary by jurisdiction. I recently learned about how it works in Saskatchewan, Canada: indie contractor guards pretty much don’t fit into our legislation. A company offering guard services must be licensed and bonded, and the guards themselves must be licensed. A guards license requires the applicant to pass a one-time exam, and their license is tied to a specific employer. If you’rea guards and want to change your employer, you have to reapply for a new license. You could set up your own Corp and offer guards services, and in that case it would be pretty clear that you’re a contractor (you’ve put up your own bond and registered your company with the province), but otherwise there’s not really any way to have a solo contractor guard.