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What exactly is impressive? Leaf has more than that in prod already.

by chirau 7y ago

travbrack 7y ago
Nissan had a bit of a head start on Tesla.
TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
This article claims Tesla is the first to have made 1 million electric vehicles. Is this incorrect?
- thordenmark 7y ago
  The way it is stated "No other automaker has achieved that kind of volume when it comes to producing long-range electric passenger cars." gives them some wiggle room in their claim. Still, it is a very impressive feat for an automobile startup.
  - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
    Ah, I see, it’s the somewhat subjective claim long-range. You Jamie for pointing that out.
    - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
      That should have said "Thank you for pointing that out", but my new phone seems to like changing ordinary phrases in to nonsensical words.
standardUser 7y ago
Per Wikipedia... "Global sales totaled over 400,000 Leafs by March 2019" That is awesome and the Leaf is a fantastic vehicle only limited by its range. But it does not sound like one million Nissan Leafs have been produced. And the Tesla milestone still carries extra significant because all of its models are reasonable replacements for ICEs in most households. The Leaf is suited to a much smaller set of use cases.
CriticalCathed 7y ago
I can understand critiquing Tesla's business models, their claims about the cars, their financial status, or even Musk's character. But calling what Tesla has done over the last 10 years unimpressive makes no sense to me.
- ltbarcly3 7y ago
  They produce great cars that people love, but people generally love high-end very expensive cars. A Nissan Leaf is not as nice of a car as a Tesla Model 3 in pretty much any way, but it also costs 3/4 of the price. Meanwhile, the Leaf is profitable per-car, and the base model Tesla Model 3 is barely break-even per-car, even with the very aggressive accounting that Tesla uses. Tesla can't keep producing base Model 3's at the price they are selling them for (even at over $40k), they are a loss leader to look competitive on price, the profitable version is well over $50k without government subsidies that will end this year (and the performance model is over $60k). A leaf is around $30k.
  - sabertoothed 7y ago
    What is your point?
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
283627283637 7y ago
You're getting a lot of flak but this was my reaction too. The mistake was comparing it to the leaf instead of all cars the company produced and confronting the futurist hype train head-on. This is 2020, a million cars isn't impressive. Fuel efficient hybrids have done more to help the climate than Tesla has. Just look at Europe, electric cars are so practical and efficient that countries are working to ban their competition.
- enchiridion 7y ago
  Tesla basically created the electric car sector. Almost every major car company has or will have an electric out in order to compete.
  - ltbarcly3 7y ago
    Whoever invented lithium batteries created the electric car sector (In fact he won a Nobel prize for it, https://news.uchicago.edu/story/john-b-goodenough-shares-nobel-prize-invention-lithium-ion-battery https://news.uchicago.edu/story/john-b-goodenough-shares-nob...). Everything else has existed since the 1800s (although it has been refined over time). There were even attempts at electric cars in the 1800s. In fact, almost 40% of all cars in 1900 were electric! If they had lithium batteries in 1890 we would have been driving electric cars for the last 130 years. GM had a great electric car in the mid 90s that couldn't compete due to lead acid batteries being heavy and having poor energy density (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1). Put Lithium batteries in an EV1 and people still wouldn't have wanted it because oil prices were low, but it beat the Model S to market by nearly 20 years and again given a better battery technology like lithium would probably have led to a majority of cars being electric today.
    - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
      Why do designers seem hellbent if making electric cars look strange. The tide seems to have turned... a bit.
  - 283627283637 7y ago

What exactly is impressive? Leaf has more than that in prod already.

by chirau 7y ago

What exactly is impressive? Leaf has more than that in prod already.

travbrack 7y ago

Nissan had a bit of a head start on Tesla.

TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago

This article claims Tesla is the first to have made 1 million electric vehicles. Is this incorrect?

thordenmark 7y ago
The way it is stated "No other automaker has achieved that kind of volume when it comes to producing long-range electric passenger cars." gives them some wiggle room in their claim. Still, it is a very impressive feat for an automobile startup.
- TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
  Ah, I see, it’s the somewhat subjective claim long-range. You Jamie for pointing that out.
  - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
    That should have said "Thank you for pointing that out", but my new phone seems to like changing ordinary phrases in to nonsensical words.

standardUser 7y ago

Per Wikipedia... "Global sales totaled over 400,000 Leafs by March 2019" That is awesome and the Leaf is a fantastic vehicle only limited by its range. But it does not sound like one million Nissan Leafs have been produced. And the Tesla milestone still carries extra significant because all of its models are reasonable replacements for ICEs in most households. The Leaf is suited to a much smaller set of use cases.

CriticalCathed 7y ago

I can understand critiquing Tesla's business models, their claims about the cars, their financial status, or even Musk's character. But calling what Tesla has done over the last 10 years unimpressive makes no sense to me.

ltbarcly3 7y ago
They produce great cars that people love, but people generally love high-end very expensive cars. A Nissan Leaf is not as nice of a car as a Tesla Model 3 in pretty much any way, but it also costs 3/4 of the price. Meanwhile, the Leaf is profitable per-car, and the base model Tesla Model 3 is barely break-even per-car, even with the very aggressive accounting that Tesla uses. Tesla can't keep producing base Model 3's at the price they are selling them for (even at over $40k), they are a loss leader to look competitive on price, the profitable version is well over $50k without government subsidies that will end this year (and the performance model is over $60k). A leaf is around $30k.
- sabertoothed 7y ago
  What is your point?
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]

283627283637 7y ago

You're getting a lot of flak but this was my reaction too. The mistake was comparing it to the leaf instead of all cars the company produced and confronting the futurist hype train head-on. This is 2020, a million cars isn't impressive. Fuel efficient hybrids have done more to help the climate than Tesla has. Just look at Europe, electric cars are so practical and efficient that countries are working to ban their competition.

enchiridion 7y ago
Tesla basically created the electric car sector. Almost every major car company has or will have an electric out in order to compete.
- ltbarcly3 7y ago
  Whoever invented lithium batteries created the electric car sector (In fact he won a Nobel prize for it, https://news.uchicago.edu/story/john-b-goodenough-shares-nobel-prize-invention-lithium-ion-battery https://news.uchicago.edu/story/john-b-goodenough-shares-nob...). Everything else has existed since the 1800s (although it has been refined over time). There were even attempts at electric cars in the 1800s. In fact, almost 40% of all cars in 1900 were electric! If they had lithium batteries in 1890 we would have been driving electric cars for the last 130 years. GM had a great electric car in the mid 90s that couldn't compete due to lead acid batteries being heavy and having poor energy density (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1). Put Lithium batteries in an EV1 and people still wouldn't have wanted it because oil prices were low, but it beat the Model S to market by nearly 20 years and again given a better battery technology like lithium would probably have led to a majority of cars being electric today.
  - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
    Why do designers seem hellbent if making electric cars look strange. The tide seems to have turned... a bit.
- 283627283637 7y ago