7 ms·

It reminds me of all the Uber and Airbnb clones that didn't recognize that the primary features that created their success was the commoditized nature of the se

by slg 7y ago

It reminds me of all the Uber and Airbnb clones that didn't recognize that the primary features that created their success was the commoditized nature of the seller and the ability to tap into latent supply (and circumventing the established regulatory environment, but that is a conversation for another time). An Uber for home cleaning was never going to work because it is tough to commoditize inviting someone into your home and both the cleaner and the user have an incentive to cut out the middle man as soon as a solid working relationship is established. An Airbnb for massage therapists was never going to work because there isn't a huge supply of people who are capable of providing the service but are unable to find customers themselves. An Uber for delivering food works because no one cares who delivers the food and because it is a service that almost anyone can perform.

lastres0rt 7y ago
It surprises me that nobody's mentioned Fiverr in the same vein. I'd think "an Uber for creative work" is at least prone to the same incentives to cut out the middleman.
- slg 7y ago
  I have never personally used Fiverr. How easy is it to get in contact with each other outside of the Fiverr ecosystem? That is a natural outcome of all the other examples in which there is some contact between provider and customer in the physical world. With Fiverr everything occurs digitally so it is probably easier to prevent people from circumventing the app.
  - grogenaut 7y ago
    Super easy. You have to share documents and designs. Almost all of those design sharing systems allow messaging. Or you know google docs and invite them to read shows you the email. There's really no way for them to stop it. It's all just about if they want to deal with invoicing and other stuff themselves or go direct. Many don't want to bother. But every wall they throw up makes it more likely people will jump off after that initial aquisition. But many of these jobs ARE just one shots. Tho I usually go back to the same folks who did good work and communicated well with later tasks.
    - mattrp 7y ago
      Agreed - I like fiverr over hiring direct because I don’t really want to be in someone’s rolodex as a customer they are going to call and pester. As for maids, I feel the problem there is you rarely get anyone who is going to do more than feather dust your home. So a “service” isn’t going to radically improve that. As for glasses I really want to like WP but their plastic frames really are subpar. It’s a far better experience to buy off the rack at Costco if cheap is what you’re seeking. For years I would spend $600/year buying zero G from a small boutique until I decided maybe instead I should have five pairs of WP... so I tried that and every single one of them had something I didn’t like.. so one day I found myself in Costco and decided to give that a go and have never looked back. Heh that’s probably indicator #641 I’m turning into an old fart.
      - pnutjam 7y ago
        I buy glasses from Zenni and I've always been happy. Although Sam's club has brought their prices down to be more competitive. I'm seeing more things included that used to be extra.
- icebraining 7y ago
  The digital nature of the work means the market is global, unlike home cleaning or massages, making a matching system more valuable.
- yellowapple 7y ago
  Which is probably okay, in the same sense that companies and temporary workers (or workers otherwise sourced through a staffing agency) will "cut out the middleman" (in this case, the staffing agency) and transition to permanent direct-hire employment after a certain period (assuming said temporary worker has demonstrated oneself to be valuable enough to be worth keeping on). In the case of creative work, it's arguably less hassle to let Fiverr handle things than to sign into a bunch of one-off contracts, and reserve "cut[ting] out the middleman" for cases where someone has consistently delivered work to your standards (or, on the other side, has consistently paid well) and there's a desire to make for a more long-term arrangement than one-off jobs.
12xo 7y ago
There is a massage on demand service. In fact, there are a lot of businesses that fill the small niches. They are not and will never be Unicorns, but they are solid businesses. For example: Soothe is an app for on demand massage service. Works great.
- ghaff 7y ago
  So, once you find someone you like, why not just contract off-app?
  - goatherders 7y ago
    We use Rover all the time and usually use the same dogsitter. I don't move off app because the money I'm spending isn't enough to try and get a discount ($25 for a night out with the wife, $60 or 70 a day if we go out of town). Plus they offer pet insurance and some other protections that are worth it.
    - sharkweek 7y ago
      I use Rover all the time, we have had a number of dog sitters offer themselves as a personal dog sitter off the Rover app for a small discount. We always politely decline because of the layer of perceived security Rover offers with their insurance.
      - captncraig 7y ago
        I've offered to pay the person who watches my dog directly, and she declines exactly because of the value add of Rover insuring her. Seems a fair model.
        alharith 7y ago
        Can you not insure yourself, or insure yourself against someone else?
nmfisher 7y ago
> An Uber for home cleaning was never going to work because it is tough to commoditize inviting someone into your home and both the cleaner and the user have an incentive to cut out the middle man as soon as a solid working relationship is established. Eh, I've started using Helpling in Singapore (on-demand home cleaning service) that seems to be quite stable/successful. Of course, I doubt they're Uber-scale profitable, and I don't know how much capital they're burning (if any), but there definitely seems to be business value there.
- 7777fps 7y ago
  > Uber-scale profitable That's an oxymoron, Uber are massively loss making.
  - blaser-waffle 7y ago
    They're still hemorrhaging money, no?
  - nmfisher 7y ago
    You're right, I misspoke. I should have said "Uber-valuable".
trent_lott 7y ago
It would be interesting if a delivery service curated a customer list in the same way that housekeepers do People eat carryout often - sometimes every meal/dinner. Just pitch the service as "call Ma for dinner" or somesuch

by slg 7y ago

lastres0rt 7y ago

It surprises me that nobody's mentioned Fiverr in the same vein. I'd think "an Uber for creative work" is at least prone to the same incentives to cut out the middleman.

slg 7y ago
I have never personally used Fiverr. How easy is it to get in contact with each other outside of the Fiverr ecosystem? That is a natural outcome of all the other examples in which there is some contact between provider and customer in the physical world. With Fiverr everything occurs digitally so it is probably easier to prevent people from circumventing the app.
- grogenaut 7y ago
  Super easy. You have to share documents and designs. Almost all of those design sharing systems allow messaging. Or you know google docs and invite them to read shows you the email. There's really no way for them to stop it. It's all just about if they want to deal with invoicing and other stuff themselves or go direct. Many don't want to bother. But every wall they throw up makes it more likely people will jump off after that initial aquisition. But many of these jobs ARE just one shots. Tho I usually go back to the same folks who did good work and communicated well with later tasks.
  - mattrp 7y ago
    Agreed - I like fiverr over hiring direct because I don’t really want to be in someone’s rolodex as a customer they are going to call and pester. As for maids, I feel the problem there is you rarely get anyone who is going to do more than feather dust your home. So a “service” isn’t going to radically improve that. As for glasses I really want to like WP but their plastic frames really are subpar. It’s a far better experience to buy off the rack at Costco if cheap is what you’re seeking. For years I would spend $600/year buying zero G from a small boutique until I decided maybe instead I should have five pairs of WP... so I tried that and every single one of them had something I didn’t like.. so one day I found myself in Costco and decided to give that a go and have never looked back. Heh that’s probably indicator #641 I’m turning into an old fart.
    - pnutjam 7y ago
      I buy glasses from Zenni and I've always been happy. Although Sam's club has brought their prices down to be more competitive. I'm seeing more things included that used to be extra.
icebraining 7y ago
The digital nature of the work means the market is global, unlike home cleaning or massages, making a matching system more valuable.
yellowapple 7y ago
Which is probably okay, in the same sense that companies and temporary workers (or workers otherwise sourced through a staffing agency) will "cut out the middleman" (in this case, the staffing agency) and transition to permanent direct-hire employment after a certain period (assuming said temporary worker has demonstrated oneself to be valuable enough to be worth keeping on). In the case of creative work, it's arguably less hassle to let Fiverr handle things than to sign into a bunch of one-off contracts, and reserve "cut[ting] out the middleman" for cases where someone has consistently delivered work to your standards (or, on the other side, has consistently paid well) and there's a desire to make for a more long-term arrangement than one-off jobs.

12xo 7y ago

There is a massage on demand service. In fact, there are a lot of businesses that fill the small niches. They are not and will never be Unicorns, but they are solid businesses. For example: Soothe is an app for on demand massage service. Works great.

ghaff 7y ago
So, once you find someone you like, why not just contract off-app?
- goatherders 7y ago
  We use Rover all the time and usually use the same dogsitter. I don't move off app because the money I'm spending isn't enough to try and get a discount ($25 for a night out with the wife, $60 or 70 a day if we go out of town). Plus they offer pet insurance and some other protections that are worth it.
  - sharkweek 7y ago
    I use Rover all the time, we have had a number of dog sitters offer themselves as a personal dog sitter off the Rover app for a small discount. We always politely decline because of the layer of perceived security Rover offers with their insurance.
    - captncraig 7y ago
      I've offered to pay the person who watches my dog directly, and she declines exactly because of the value add of Rover insuring her. Seems a fair model.
      - alharith 7y ago
        Can you not insure yourself, or insure yourself against someone else?

nmfisher 7y ago

> An Uber for home cleaning was never going to work because it is tough to commoditize inviting someone into your home and both the cleaner and the user have an incentive to cut out the middle man as soon as a solid working relationship is established. Eh, I've started using Helpling in Singapore (on-demand home cleaning service) that seems to be quite stable/successful. Of course, I doubt they're Uber-scale profitable, and I don't know how much capital they're burning (if any), but there definitely seems to be business value there.

7777fps 7y ago
> Uber-scale profitable That's an oxymoron, Uber are massively loss making.
- blaser-waffle 7y ago
  They're still hemorrhaging money, no?
- nmfisher 7y ago
  You're right, I misspoke. I should have said "Uber-valuable".

trent_lott 7y ago

It would be interesting if a delivery service curated a customer list in the same way that housekeepers do People eat carryout often - sometimes every meal/dinner. Just pitch the service as "call Ma for dinner" or somesuch