4 ms·

This seems like a very good example of how poor enforcement is. Child porn is very, very illegal, and gets "regular people" throw in prison for the rest of the

by magduf 7y ago

This seems like a very good example of how poor enforcement is. Child porn is very, very illegal, and gets "regular people" throw in prison for the rest of their lives just for having downloaded it and having it on their machines. Yet a big site like this can have it posted, and reposted, over and over, and that's perfectly OK. Why is there no federal prosecution of not only the site for abetting, but also tracking down these ex-bfs or whoever it is uploading the videos? Usually, producing and knowingly distributing CP results in a very, very long prison sentence in the US.

ocdtrekkie 7y ago
One of the largest issues is jurisdictional issues. These internet sites are global, but most law enforcement have fairly restrained jurisdictions. A victim may go to their local police, but the local police then have to interact with agencies potentially all over the globe to actually build a case, make an arrest, etc. Which isn't to say they don't try, but it can be very difficult and take a very long time. Even if you can track down someone's ex-boyfriend (likely to be more local) and charge them, once the video is out on the Internet, random people all over the globe can continue to share and distribute it. And large scale video platforms have little desire to put meaningful controls on uploading videos as it would negatively impact their ad revenue. Furthermore, these platforms can claim that they didn't upload it, a user did, so they shouldn't be held responsible.
- magduf 7y ago
  I don't think this applies here; from the story, it sounds like both Pornhub and the victims are in the US, and Pornhub is bound by US law on these matters (which is decidedly unfriendly to CP). >Furthermore, these platforms can claim that they didn't upload it, a user did, so they shouldn't be held responsible. Not true. They're required to take down stuff when notified it's illegal, and CP is very illegal. So taking 2 weeks to remove something this blatantly illegal sure looks a lot like criminal negligence. For comparison, how does YouTube handle this kind of thing? I'm pretty sure CP videos would never stay on YT for more than a day at the very most. And Pornhub can't claim to not have the generous resources Google has; Pornhub is a gigantic website. I wouldn't be too surprised to see some zealous federal prosecutor nail them for this stuff, especially with a GOP presidential administration.
vorpalhex 7y ago
The article states that Pornhub did comply and take down the videos. Like most companies, they also reported these cases to the FBI or other appropriate agencies. What, exactly, do you want them to do?
- Spare_account 7y ago
  Pornhub should be required to prevent illegal content (specifically in this case child porn) from being hosted on the site at all. They should be held responsible for content they make available. Presumably this would require human intervention to greenlight the video once all the necessary verification has been sought. All platforms should be held to this standard frankly. I don't understand how we've gotten to the point where it is acceptable for anything less.
  - jedberg 7y ago
    Should Hacker News be responsible for stopping you and everyone else from posting possibly illegal material? The same law that protects HN protects PornHub.
    - DanBC 7y ago
      In most of the world people have no problem with holding the site responsible for hosting images of child sexual abuse, even if those images were posted by users.
      - vorpalhex 7y ago
        And in most of the world, criticizing a leader may have criminal offenses associated. There's a reason the US is unique and that most of these companies are founded there.
        ocdtrekkie 7y ago
        > There's a reason the US is unique and that most of these companies are founded there. The fact that businesses tend to be founded in the country with the least regulation and protection for consumers and public interest is probably not something we should really be proud of. It's kinda the worst part of unchecked capitalism. Arizona proudly bragged about being the least hindrance to self-driving car testing in their state. Which is why businesses moved their self-driving operations there, an honor they can brag about. And now they also get the dubious honor of being the first to have a resident murdered by a corporation's self-driving car program.
jedberg 7y ago
DMCA safe harbor. The same law that protects this very website, and others like it. User content is a double edged sword. You want to allow the free exchange of ideas, but you also want to protect victims. It's a fine line to walk. That being said, PornHub could probably do more to police themselves, at the very least auto removing content that lists the names of people who have asked them to take content down.

by magduf 7y ago

ocdtrekkie 7y ago

One of the largest issues is jurisdictional issues. These internet sites are global, but most law enforcement have fairly restrained jurisdictions. A victim may go to their local police, but the local police then have to interact with agencies potentially all over the globe to actually build a case, make an arrest, etc. Which isn't to say they don't try, but it can be very difficult and take a very long time. Even if you can track down someone's ex-boyfriend (likely to be more local) and charge them, once the video is out on the Internet, random people all over the globe can continue to share and distribute it. And large scale video platforms have little desire to put meaningful controls on uploading videos as it would negatively impact their ad revenue. Furthermore, these platforms can claim that they didn't upload it, a user did, so they shouldn't be held responsible.

magduf 7y ago
I don't think this applies here; from the story, it sounds like both Pornhub and the victims are in the US, and Pornhub is bound by US law on these matters (which is decidedly unfriendly to CP). >Furthermore, these platforms can claim that they didn't upload it, a user did, so they shouldn't be held responsible. Not true. They're required to take down stuff when notified it's illegal, and CP is very illegal. So taking 2 weeks to remove something this blatantly illegal sure looks a lot like criminal negligence. For comparison, how does YouTube handle this kind of thing? I'm pretty sure CP videos would never stay on YT for more than a day at the very most. And Pornhub can't claim to not have the generous resources Google has; Pornhub is a gigantic website. I wouldn't be too surprised to see some zealous federal prosecutor nail them for this stuff, especially with a GOP presidential administration.

vorpalhex 7y ago

The article states that Pornhub did comply and take down the videos. Like most companies, they also reported these cases to the FBI or other appropriate agencies. What, exactly, do you want them to do?

Spare_account 7y ago
Pornhub should be required to prevent illegal content (specifically in this case child porn) from being hosted on the site at all. They should be held responsible for content they make available. Presumably this would require human intervention to greenlight the video once all the necessary verification has been sought. All platforms should be held to this standard frankly. I don't understand how we've gotten to the point where it is acceptable for anything less.
- jedberg 7y ago
  Should Hacker News be responsible for stopping you and everyone else from posting possibly illegal material? The same law that protects HN protects PornHub.
  - DanBC 7y ago
    In most of the world people have no problem with holding the site responsible for hosting images of child sexual abuse, even if those images were posted by users.
    - vorpalhex 7y ago
      And in most of the world, criticizing a leader may have criminal offenses associated. There's a reason the US is unique and that most of these companies are founded there.
      - ocdtrekkie 7y ago
        > There's a reason the US is unique and that most of these companies are founded there. The fact that businesses tend to be founded in the country with the least regulation and protection for consumers and public interest is probably not something we should really be proud of. It's kinda the worst part of unchecked capitalism. Arizona proudly bragged about being the least hindrance to self-driving car testing in their state. Which is why businesses moved their self-driving operations there, an honor they can brag about. And now they also get the dubious honor of being the first to have a resident murdered by a corporation's self-driving car program.

jedberg 7y ago

DMCA safe harbor. The same law that protects this very website, and others like it. User content is a double edged sword. You want to allow the free exchange of ideas, but you also want to protect victims. It's a fine line to walk. That being said, PornHub could probably do more to police themselves, at the very least auto removing content that lists the names of people who have asked them to take content down.