4 ms·

That’s true, I was mostly looking at this from a Linux-centric point of view. You won’t be running Windows or macOS on your phone.

monocasa 7y ago
What I'm getting at is that propreitary drivers has no bearing on the matter when 90+% of PCs are running propreitary drivers.
- ryukafalz 7y ago
  It does on Linux, where there's no stable ABI for drivers to use, right? Yes, that's a design decision on Linux's part, but it's one that seems to be working out just fine for PCs.
  - monocasa 7y ago
    But that's less than 10% of the market. The rest doesn't have those problems either, despite having almost entirely proprietary drivers. Therefore it's not the propreitary drivers that are the issue.
    - ryukafalz 7y ago
      Given the set of design decisions Linux has made, and assuming the Linux driver development model isn't going to change to accommodate manufacturers that want to keep their source to themselves, the proprietary drivers are part of the issue here. (The other part is manufacturers not working with the Linux community on upstreaming their drivers, even when there are free drivers.) Yes, a stable interface is another potential solution. It's unlikely to happen[0], but it would solve the issue. (Quite honestly, though, I'm glad we don't have to deal with manufacturers pulling stuff like this in the Linux world: https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1172237142485078016 https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1172237142485078016) [0] https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/process/stable-api-nonsense.rst https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/process/stable-api-...
      - monocasa 7y ago
        No, I'm not saying its a solution or a problem. It's completely orthogonal.
        ldng 7y ago
        The problem is those drivers are not maintained. And it just happen that those are proprietary. Is that what you're trying to say ?
    - tracker1 7y ago
      The market is smart phones, where the market share for a linux kernel (android) is much higher.

monocasa 7y ago

What I'm getting at is that propreitary drivers has no bearing on the matter when 90+% of PCs are running propreitary drivers.

ryukafalz 7y ago
It does on Linux, where there's no stable ABI for drivers to use, right? Yes, that's a design decision on Linux's part, but it's one that seems to be working out just fine for PCs.
- monocasa 7y ago
  But that's less than 10% of the market. The rest doesn't have those problems either, despite having almost entirely proprietary drivers. Therefore it's not the propreitary drivers that are the issue.
  - ryukafalz 7y ago
    Given the set of design decisions Linux has made, and assuming the Linux driver development model isn't going to change to accommodate manufacturers that want to keep their source to themselves, the proprietary drivers are part of the issue here. (The other part is manufacturers not working with the Linux community on upstreaming their drivers, even when there are free drivers.) Yes, a stable interface is another potential solution. It's unlikely to happen[0], but it would solve the issue. (Quite honestly, though, I'm glad we don't have to deal with manufacturers pulling stuff like this in the Linux world: https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1172237142485078016 https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1172237142485078016) [0] https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/process/stable-api-nonsense.rst https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/process/stable-api-...
    - monocasa 7y ago
      No, I'm not saying its a solution or a problem. It's completely orthogonal.
      - ldng 7y ago
        The problem is those drivers are not maintained. And it just happen that those are proprietary. Is that what you're trying to say ?
  - tracker1 7y ago
    The market is smart phones, where the market share for a linux kernel (android) is much higher.