8 ms·

Data Submitted by the Italian Civil Defense on COVID19 in Italy, Updated Daily

49 points by illo 7y ago

hncynic23 7y ago
Unless you have a very weak immune system or you are an elderly (50+) I wouldn't worry to much about this.
- jfkebwjsbx 7y ago
  "Elderly". People work until their 70 in modern society.
- danharaj 7y ago
  This is frustratingly short sighted. I suppose you dont have anyone you care about over 50?
- onetimemanytime 7y ago
  do you really think that Italy and China wanted to put a stop to their economic activity with quarantines for no reason?
  - dnautics 7y ago
    Sometimes politicians look good for having "done something" because there is no counterfactual to compare against to create accountability.
    - jeromegv 7y ago
      Well China has cut their number of cases so they did something that worked.
      - dnautics 7y ago
        That's a broken window fallacy; how many people have perished because of degradation of infrastructural services? I don't think we'll ever know.
    - baq 7y ago
      but there is Wuhan before January 23rd and after, so what is it exactly that you have in mind?
- interestica 7y ago
  50+ is elderly now?
- whateveracct 7y ago
  By that logic, if you are going to spend time with anyone 50+, you should be equally concerned, yeah?
- Scarblac 7y ago
  They need to create new IC beds at a rate of 200 per day right now. If you have anything else that requires IC, like say a ruptured appendix, you're just as dead if there are no beds than if you had ncov19. Also, I still have one parent and don't want to lose her.
- mrighele 7y ago
  More than one third of the Italian population is 50+, so if you are Italian there is probably reason to worry
- TeMPOraL 7y ago
  Beyond the aspect that you probably have relatives that are 50+, observe how countries try to limit the spread of the virus, and consider what it does to the economy. And what it will do to your local economy. All of us will suffer from this virus one way or another, even those who manage to avoid catching the disease itself.
- late2part 7y ago
  50 is elderly? Oy vey. /me is boomer, apparently...
- doopy1 7y ago
  Going to break the rules here and call you a fucking idiot.
  - danharaj 7y ago
    king behavior
lbeltrame 7y ago
Bear in mind that the totals may "look odd": they are cumulative totals of current cases + deaths + recovered.
- TeMPOraL 7y ago
  All sources I've seen so far have been showing primarily that cumulative, so it's not odd, it's standard.
noodlesUK 7y ago
What I don’t understand is why the US still doesn’t have widespread testing. If the government lifted restrictions on testing and let people other than CDC and health authorities test for it, most research hospitals and universities (and many other private labs) would be able to test for this disease very easily. The reagents are commercially available, and most other countries are rolling out (or have already rolled out) very widespread testing. I am not an expert in this, so if someone with more understanding wants to chime in I’d love to hear it. Edit: the FDA has reduced the restrictions on clia regulated labs https://www.fda.gov/media/135659/download https://www.fda.gov/media/135659/download
- Anon84 7y ago
  The number of cases doesn’t increase if you don’t test for it.
- spectramax 7y ago
  People are not getting to the bottom of this. Virus goes from one host to the other via the means of aerosol/droplet particulates. There is some evidence that it can stay "active" while on a surface such as a door knob. Everything else is external. So, whether you test or not, the fundamentals of aforementined mechanism most likely won't change. Cleaning public areas with disinfectant, educating the public of detailed ways of how this virus spreads (I mean really detailed information... not just what the media is doing currently) and doing everything to make sure there is no shortage of sanitizing supplies. I can't seem to find exact details of experiments or academic research on how this virus mechanically moves from one body to the other. No newspaper is publishing information about it. Turns out a lot of academic jargon can be explained to laymen if you have someone like Feynman write an article. So, if we can understand the precise mechanism of spread, we can bring down the R value close to 1 or below slowing down the exponential growth. If there is a probablistic aspect to the containment strategy, say for example, no matter what contingencies we put in place, no matter how clean the society gets, there is always some probability of propagation. That means we're not trying hard enough to understand the virus propagation and to enforce containment procedures. Ultimate goal would be to a get vaccine invented and distributed.
stevespang 7y ago
The rumor among the US health industry is they are licking their chops they are going to make a bundle off this virus, causing millions more to go into bankruptcy - - the 5% who end up in ICU on ventilators without insurance, hospitals are already lining up their ducks, remember there are only only a finite set of ventilators at every hospital, when full up, it will be like "pay us $20,000 first and we will reserve a place for you" next up. Don't think it will happen ? Guess again, take a look at M.D. Anderson in Houston, most famous cancer treatment facility. Few years ago they started admittance only on CASH UP FRONT, like serious cash down payment.
pibefision 7y ago
Why no quarantine in Germany with this numbers in Italy? Any idea?
- spectramax 7y ago
  Culture? Italians love to touch each other more than other cultures. Sorry if this is offensive to anyone, no offense is meant.
  - late2part 7y ago
    Please don't apologize for asserting your perceived facts.
    - spectramax 7y ago
      Duly noted, thanks.
- lowdose 7y ago
  Made in Italy attracted a lot more Chinese to Italy than Made in Germany.
ersiees 7y ago
I wonder if Zeit, people with machine learning background, could do to help given open data. Is there some open source project or so to contribute to that does something helpful e.g. predicting cases or areas at risk?
- newtoday 7y ago
  I'm not sure about prediction efforts, but here's a map: https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6 https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.h... BTW, I'm really thankful to those who put this together.
Jabbles 7y ago
7% of the deaths in Italy yesterday were due to Covid-19. https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/ITA/italy/death-rate https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/ITA/italy/death-rate

49 points by illo 7y ago

hncynic23 7y ago

Unless you have a very weak immune system or you are an elderly (50+) I wouldn't worry to much about this.

jfkebwjsbx 7y ago
"Elderly". People work until their 70 in modern society.
danharaj 7y ago
This is frustratingly short sighted. I suppose you dont have anyone you care about over 50?
onetimemanytime 7y ago
do you really think that Italy and China wanted to put a stop to their economic activity with quarantines for no reason?
- dnautics 7y ago
  Sometimes politicians look good for having "done something" because there is no counterfactual to compare against to create accountability.
  - jeromegv 7y ago
    Well China has cut their number of cases so they did something that worked.
    - dnautics 7y ago
      That's a broken window fallacy; how many people have perished because of degradation of infrastructural services? I don't think we'll ever know.
  - baq 7y ago
    but there is Wuhan before January 23rd and after, so what is it exactly that you have in mind?
interestica 7y ago
50+ is elderly now?
whateveracct 7y ago
By that logic, if you are going to spend time with anyone 50+, you should be equally concerned, yeah?
Scarblac 7y ago
They need to create new IC beds at a rate of 200 per day right now. If you have anything else that requires IC, like say a ruptured appendix, you're just as dead if there are no beds than if you had ncov19. Also, I still have one parent and don't want to lose her.
mrighele 7y ago
More than one third of the Italian population is 50+, so if you are Italian there is probably reason to worry
TeMPOraL 7y ago
Beyond the aspect that you probably have relatives that are 50+, observe how countries try to limit the spread of the virus, and consider what it does to the economy. And what it will do to your local economy. All of us will suffer from this virus one way or another, even those who manage to avoid catching the disease itself.
late2part 7y ago
50 is elderly? Oy vey. /me is boomer, apparently...
doopy1 7y ago
Going to break the rules here and call you a fucking idiot.
- danharaj 7y ago
  king behavior

lbeltrame 7y ago

Bear in mind that the totals may "look odd": they are cumulative totals of current cases + deaths + recovered.

TeMPOraL 7y ago
All sources I've seen so far have been showing primarily that cumulative, so it's not odd, it's standard.

noodlesUK 7y ago

What I don’t understand is why the US still doesn’t have widespread testing. If the government lifted restrictions on testing and let people other than CDC and health authorities test for it, most research hospitals and universities (and many other private labs) would be able to test for this disease very easily. The reagents are commercially available, and most other countries are rolling out (or have already rolled out) very widespread testing. I am not an expert in this, so if someone with more understanding wants to chime in I’d love to hear it. Edit: the FDA has reduced the restrictions on clia regulated labs https://www.fda.gov/media/135659/download https://www.fda.gov/media/135659/download

Anon84 7y ago
The number of cases doesn’t increase if you don’t test for it.
spectramax 7y ago
People are not getting to the bottom of this. Virus goes from one host to the other via the means of aerosol/droplet particulates. There is some evidence that it can stay "active" while on a surface such as a door knob. Everything else is external. So, whether you test or not, the fundamentals of aforementined mechanism most likely won't change. Cleaning public areas with disinfectant, educating the public of detailed ways of how this virus spreads (I mean really detailed information... not just what the media is doing currently) and doing everything to make sure there is no shortage of sanitizing supplies. I can't seem to find exact details of experiments or academic research on how this virus mechanically moves from one body to the other. No newspaper is publishing information about it. Turns out a lot of academic jargon can be explained to laymen if you have someone like Feynman write an article. So, if we can understand the precise mechanism of spread, we can bring down the R value close to 1 or below slowing down the exponential growth. If there is a probablistic aspect to the containment strategy, say for example, no matter what contingencies we put in place, no matter how clean the society gets, there is always some probability of propagation. That means we're not trying hard enough to understand the virus propagation and to enforce containment procedures. Ultimate goal would be to a get vaccine invented and distributed.

stevespang 7y ago

The rumor among the US health industry is they are licking their chops they are going to make a bundle off this virus, causing millions more to go into bankruptcy - - the 5% who end up in ICU on ventilators without insurance, hospitals are already lining up their ducks, remember there are only only a finite set of ventilators at every hospital, when full up, it will be like "pay us $20,000 first and we will reserve a place for you" next up. Don't think it will happen ? Guess again, take a look at M.D. Anderson in Houston, most famous cancer treatment facility. Few years ago they started admittance only on CASH UP FRONT, like serious cash down payment.

pibefision 7y ago

Why no quarantine in Germany with this numbers in Italy? Any idea?

spectramax 7y ago
Culture? Italians love to touch each other more than other cultures. Sorry if this is offensive to anyone, no offense is meant.
- late2part 7y ago
  Please don't apologize for asserting your perceived facts.
  - spectramax 7y ago
    Duly noted, thanks.
lowdose 7y ago
Made in Italy attracted a lot more Chinese to Italy than Made in Germany.

ersiees 7y ago

I wonder if Zeit, people with machine learning background, could do to help given open data. Is there some open source project or so to contribute to that does something helpful e.g. predicting cases or areas at risk?

newtoday 7y ago
I'm not sure about prediction efforts, but here's a map: https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6 https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.h... BTW, I'm really thankful to those who put this together.

Jabbles 7y ago

7% of the deaths in Italy yesterday were due to Covid-19. https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/ITA/italy/death-rate https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/ITA/italy/death-rate