7 ms·

Even before all of this tech, if you looked suspicious you would get stopped or worse. A story was when I moved to a different state, I went out walking in my n

by Noos 7y ago

Even before all of this tech, if you looked suspicious you would get stopped or worse. A story was when I moved to a different state, I went out walking in my new area. Exploring the suburbs. I had brought a book with me, and it was starting to rain. I kept my book under my shirt to protect it. As I went home, I was suddenly stopped by four police cars; apparently a resident thought my book was a gun, and I was casing the area or something and the suburb I walked through must have been worried about crime. It was darkly funny to show them my book, which was a defense of political civility. It stopped me from walking there, though, as long as i lived there. I think one aspect of this is the surprise that an engineer would get swept up in this, but this isn't really something that can be solved by tech.

ehsankia 7y ago
There are so many stories of people becoming a suspect just because a neighbor named them, or they were just at the wrong place at the wrong time, or other kinds of random coincidence. At the end of the day, the hope is that the evidence is taken in the right context and proper investigation will catch the right person. Unfortunately, especially in this era of True Crime documentaries, we've seen it go awry one too many time, and people are rightly scared that they may be next.
maram 7y ago
>>Even before all of this tech, if you looked suspicious you would get stopped or worse. Tech is IMPROVING our lives. Software is an enabler, it solves our problems. If the software is making our problems worse, then there is something wrong with the software, we fix the software. But the issue here isn't the software, the issue here is privacy invasion. Terms of Use and Privacy Policy aren't comprehensive enough to inform users what they are doing or how and when they are collecting their personal data. From the story “I didn’t realize that by having location services on that Google was also keeping a log of where I was going, I’m sure it’s in their terms of service but I never read through those walls of text, and I don’t think most people do either.” McCoy said. Steve Jobs had a solution for this: "Privacy means that people know what they’re signing up for. In plain English, and repeatedly. I believe that people are smart. Some people want to share more than others. Ask them...Make them tell you to stop asking them. Let them know what you’re going to do with their data"
- Sean-Der 7y ago
  Software is neutral, neither good or evil. It only increases our effectiveness of what we were doing before. It has its faults, but I really loved Adam Curtis’s documentary ‘ All Watched Over by Machines of Loving Grace’. Full of anecdotes, but it is a fun watch!
  - samatman 7y ago
    I would modify this: Software increases our effectiveness at what it's applied to. Sometimes, that's what we were doing before. Sometimes it isn't.
    - 6gvONxR4sf7o 7y ago
      Sometimes it changes what we're doing enough that the old way becomes untenable, even if the new way is worse. Like if you take a crappy, mostly okay, sometimes terrible system and make it enough cheaper than the old system that always worked, most of the market may switch to the new shitty cheap thing.
      - samatman 7y ago
        Yes. I occasionally miss the quality of landline phone calls, for one example.
  - prophesi 7y ago
    I wouldn't say software is entirely neutral. As you say, they have their faults, and some are designed in a way that lends itself to evil purposes. Openness is the key, as the Steve Jobs quote in a parent comment is saying. Users need to know what's going on, and our clickwrap culture hasn't been cutting it these past two decades.
- shadowgovt 7y ago
  If it changes the phenomena that trigger false-positives of suspicion towards "was actually present near the scene of the crime" and away from "wrong skin color in the neighborhood," it can be argued the tech has improved people's lives.
rabuse 7y ago
Similar situation happened to me. There were multiple burglaries in my neighborhood, and I was coming home from school wearing a hoodie, and 2 officers jumped out of an unmarked vehicle, and slammed me on the hood, cuffed me, and began searching my backpack.
gambiting 7y ago
Tbf, my parents have been to the US in the 90s, and they keep saying that the most bizarre part of that trip was that they were stopped by a random police officer and questioned who they were and what they were doing because they "looked suspicious". So not, it's not normal by any measure. It's just America.
klik99 7y ago
>> if you looked suspicious you would get stopped or worse. Off topic, but remember when Bob Dylan was picked up by cops, mistaken for a homeless man in Long Beach, NJ when he walked up to a house for sale? https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2009/08/bob_dylan_stopped_by_cops_whov.html https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2009/08/bob_dylan_st... Not to trivialize the subject, this is literally the only funny story I've heard about this kind of thing
syshum 7y ago
You honestly do not see the difference between your story and this one? You do not see the difference between being actively observed, vs having your movements recorded 24/7 to then be gone over in retrospect weeks, months, or years later? Really, there is no difference in your mind here?

by Noos 7y ago

ehsankia 7y ago

There are so many stories of people becoming a suspect just because a neighbor named them, or they were just at the wrong place at the wrong time, or other kinds of random coincidence. At the end of the day, the hope is that the evidence is taken in the right context and proper investigation will catch the right person. Unfortunately, especially in this era of True Crime documentaries, we've seen it go awry one too many time, and people are rightly scared that they may be next.

maram 7y ago

>>Even before all of this tech, if you looked suspicious you would get stopped or worse. Tech is IMPROVING our lives. Software is an enabler, it solves our problems. If the software is making our problems worse, then there is something wrong with the software, we fix the software. But the issue here isn't the software, the issue here is privacy invasion. Terms of Use and Privacy Policy aren't comprehensive enough to inform users what they are doing or how and when they are collecting their personal data. From the story “I didn’t realize that by having location services on that Google was also keeping a log of where I was going, I’m sure it’s in their terms of service but I never read through those walls of text, and I don’t think most people do either.” McCoy said. Steve Jobs had a solution for this: "Privacy means that people know what they’re signing up for. In plain English, and repeatedly. I believe that people are smart. Some people want to share more than others. Ask them...Make them tell you to stop asking them. Let them know what you’re going to do with their data"

Sean-Der 7y ago
Software is neutral, neither good or evil. It only increases our effectiveness of what we were doing before. It has its faults, but I really loved Adam Curtis’s documentary ‘ All Watched Over by Machines of Loving Grace’. Full of anecdotes, but it is a fun watch!
- samatman 7y ago
  I would modify this: Software increases our effectiveness at what it's applied to. Sometimes, that's what we were doing before. Sometimes it isn't.
  - 6gvONxR4sf7o 7y ago
    Sometimes it changes what we're doing enough that the old way becomes untenable, even if the new way is worse. Like if you take a crappy, mostly okay, sometimes terrible system and make it enough cheaper than the old system that always worked, most of the market may switch to the new shitty cheap thing.
    - samatman 7y ago
      Yes. I occasionally miss the quality of landline phone calls, for one example.
- prophesi 7y ago
  I wouldn't say software is entirely neutral. As you say, they have their faults, and some are designed in a way that lends itself to evil purposes. Openness is the key, as the Steve Jobs quote in a parent comment is saying. Users need to know what's going on, and our clickwrap culture hasn't been cutting it these past two decades.
shadowgovt 7y ago
If it changes the phenomena that trigger false-positives of suspicion towards "was actually present near the scene of the crime" and away from "wrong skin color in the neighborhood," it can be argued the tech has improved people's lives.

rabuse 7y ago

Similar situation happened to me. There were multiple burglaries in my neighborhood, and I was coming home from school wearing a hoodie, and 2 officers jumped out of an unmarked vehicle, and slammed me on the hood, cuffed me, and began searching my backpack.

gambiting 7y ago

Tbf, my parents have been to the US in the 90s, and they keep saying that the most bizarre part of that trip was that they were stopped by a random police officer and questioned who they were and what they were doing because they "looked suspicious". So not, it's not normal by any measure. It's just America.

klik99 7y ago

>> if you looked suspicious you would get stopped or worse. Off topic, but remember when Bob Dylan was picked up by cops, mistaken for a homeless man in Long Beach, NJ when he walked up to a house for sale? https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2009/08/bob_dylan_stopped_by_cops_whov.html https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2009/08/bob_dylan_st... Not to trivialize the subject, this is literally the only funny story I've heard about this kind of thing

syshum 7y ago

You honestly do not see the difference between your story and this one? You do not see the difference between being actively observed, vs having your movements recorded 24/7 to then be gone over in retrospect weeks, months, or years later? Really, there is no difference in your mind here?