6 ms·

Covid-19 reached my city but company says no to WFH so I'm looking for a new job

33 points by mattigames 7y ago

meddlepal 7y ago
What's the flu death rate vs Corona for over 70s? This feels like an overreaction.
- pmlnr 7y ago
  Its not just the death rate, it's the hospitalization ratio and the length of being out in bed.
  - DataWorker 7y ago
    Correct. The death rate doesn’t really matter. What matters is no herd immunity, high r0 and the percent of cases that are severe. I’d also add that human error and the inexplicable need to not sound alarmist and to conform to peer pressure is another huge factor. Nobody wants to take responsibility.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- SiFiPi 7y ago
  As someone who has done lab testing for a local pharma producer, I definitely do not see this as an overreaction. This is a smart move, especially considering the ones they live at home with.
- ajross 7y ago
  So... from the purely personal perspective of the author who quit: yes, realistically WFH isn't going to keep you alive. If it becomes a pandemic, eventually we're all going to get it. That's what pandemic means. But straightforward management strategies like remote work still have value, because in a pandemic the problem just that everyone gets stick, it's that everyone gets sick at the same time. So... now you have to compare the mortality rate of a serious but normal flu infection when treated at a well-equipped hospital to the mortality rate of contracting COVID-19 in a city with effectively no hospital space available. That's what we're trying to fix. And it's doable, but not if everyone (including, very frustratingly, our leaders) tries to pretend like nothing is wrong. If your office environment is plausibly exposed (and in the modern world of international geeks, almost all tech offices are), and you can WFH, you should WFH. Period.
  - perl4ever 7y ago
    "If your office environment is plausibly exposed (and in the modern world of international geeks, almost all tech offices are), and you can WFH, you should WFH. Period." I work for a government agency, and I asked my union rep about this, and was told, oh, if there are more cases, maybe they will do something then. You know, you live and die by the rules, and the rules say you can't WFH whenever you want, even though everybody has laptops, unlike when I worked in the private sector.
  - icebraining 7y ago
    It's not just the office, it's the public transportation too. I'm generally a fan, but it's hard to argue it's not an extra factor of risk in these situations.
- perl4ever 7y ago
  I hate overly precise numbers - based on what I've read, my one sig. fig. estimate for people under 50 is 0.5% mortality for coronavirus and 0.05% for the flu. So I do believe that coronavirus is ten times more lethal, but I am currently a lot more worried about the crazy things people do or may do in response. If I caught it, I would be mainly concerned about the social consequences, the quarantine, etc. On the other hand, having everybody work from home that can, why not? I mean, there are so many things that would be far more unpleasant or desperate later on, and if it reduces the spread even a little, it seems logical to do. In my workplace, they just put up posters on the bathroom doors saying wash your hands and stuff. Yes, there's one in every office,* but still...if everybody has a laptop, the person at the top needs to just say, everybody go home for the next month. They aren't going to do it until the hysteria reaches a tipping point though. *and I don't mean one poster
- icebraining 7y ago
  Frankly, I'd switch due to the lack of respect for the employees alone. He's a software developer, what great harm can come from letting him WFH for a couple of weeks if that makes him feel safer?
LeoNatan25 7y ago
"I have experience doing Unit testing, E2E testing" Is this what people search for these days? "I do tests" and everything else is a side point?
- mattigames 7y ago
  Yeah sorry, I was just trying to be succinct in the post, I been working on fixing some tests lately so I guess that's why it came to mind.
  - LeoNatan25 7y ago
    Good luck to you in your search!
- mattwad 7y ago
  Based on my experience, it's a rare skill if they can do it well. The problem is everyone says "I do tests"
- lmilcin 7y ago
  I have been interviewing candidates regularly for over a decade. What the candidate says on his resume and the actual level of his skill is not at all correlated. I have met many very good candidates that were obsessively worrying about gaps in their knowledge. At the same time poor candidates seem to be very confident thinking they are master developers but can't solve simplest task on a whiteboard.
  - LeoNatan25 7y ago
    Yes, sadly my experience is very similar. The more confident a candidate is, usually the poorer they are.
- lidHanteyk 7y ago
  At scale, some companies do employ folks dedicated to producing tests, yes.
Der_Einzige 7y ago
Good! Companies which don't allow WFH for their employees in these circumstances should be punished for their greediness and incompetence.
- tropo 7y ago
  I think it goes the other way. greediness: too cheap to provide an office incompetence: letting employees assemble spy satellites at home
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- perl4ever 7y ago
  State of NY still hasn't changed the rules for WFH for civil service.
guessmyname 7y ago
According to these news [1][2][3] the first case of COVID-19 in Colombia was in a 19-year-old student who arrived in Bogota from Milan, Italy. [1] https://www.bbc.com/mundo/noticias-america-latina-51772405 https://www.bbc.com/mundo/noticias-america-latina-51772405 [2] http://www.china.org.cn/world/Off_the_Wire/2020-03/07/content_75784101.htm http://www.china.org.cn/world/Off_the_Wire/2020-03/07/conten... [3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbl71sqE6NI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbl71sqE6NI
danielvlopes2 7y ago
Many managers don't actually know how to handle WFH well. To help with the transition we decided to give away our eBook on the subject (which is usually paid). You can download the ePub/PDF here: https://knowyourteam.com/m/managing_remote_teams https://knowyourteam.com/m/managing_remote_teams Maybe share it internally and see if they change the policy. Getting a new job now might be tricky.

33 points by mattigames 7y ago

meddlepal 7y ago

What's the flu death rate vs Corona for over 70s? This feels like an overreaction.

pmlnr 7y ago
Its not just the death rate, it's the hospitalization ratio and the length of being out in bed.
- DataWorker 7y ago
  Correct. The death rate doesn’t really matter. What matters is no herd immunity, high r0 and the percent of cases that are severe. I’d also add that human error and the inexplicable need to not sound alarmist and to conform to peer pressure is another huge factor. Nobody wants to take responsibility.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
SiFiPi 7y ago
As someone who has done lab testing for a local pharma producer, I definitely do not see this as an overreaction. This is a smart move, especially considering the ones they live at home with.
ajross 7y ago
So... from the purely personal perspective of the author who quit: yes, realistically WFH isn't going to keep you alive. If it becomes a pandemic, eventually we're all going to get it. That's what pandemic means. But straightforward management strategies like remote work still have value, because in a pandemic the problem just that everyone gets stick, it's that everyone gets sick at the same time. So... now you have to compare the mortality rate of a serious but normal flu infection when treated at a well-equipped hospital to the mortality rate of contracting COVID-19 in a city with effectively no hospital space available. That's what we're trying to fix. And it's doable, but not if everyone (including, very frustratingly, our leaders) tries to pretend like nothing is wrong. If your office environment is plausibly exposed (and in the modern world of international geeks, almost all tech offices are), and you can WFH, you should WFH. Period.
- perl4ever 7y ago
  "If your office environment is plausibly exposed (and in the modern world of international geeks, almost all tech offices are), and you can WFH, you should WFH. Period." I work for a government agency, and I asked my union rep about this, and was told, oh, if there are more cases, maybe they will do something then. You know, you live and die by the rules, and the rules say you can't WFH whenever you want, even though everybody has laptops, unlike when I worked in the private sector.
- icebraining 7y ago
  It's not just the office, it's the public transportation too. I'm generally a fan, but it's hard to argue it's not an extra factor of risk in these situations.
perl4ever 7y ago
I hate overly precise numbers - based on what I've read, my one sig. fig. estimate for people under 50 is 0.5% mortality for coronavirus and 0.05% for the flu. So I do believe that coronavirus is ten times more lethal, but I am currently a lot more worried about the crazy things people do or may do in response. If I caught it, I would be mainly concerned about the social consequences, the quarantine, etc. On the other hand, having everybody work from home that can, why not? I mean, there are so many things that would be far more unpleasant or desperate later on, and if it reduces the spread even a little, it seems logical to do. In my workplace, they just put up posters on the bathroom doors saying wash your hands and stuff. Yes, there's one in every office,* but still...if everybody has a laptop, the person at the top needs to just say, everybody go home for the next month. They aren't going to do it until the hysteria reaches a tipping point though. *and I don't mean one poster
icebraining 7y ago
Frankly, I'd switch due to the lack of respect for the employees alone. He's a software developer, what great harm can come from letting him WFH for a couple of weeks if that makes him feel safer?

LeoNatan25 7y ago

"I have experience doing Unit testing, E2E testing" Is this what people search for these days? "I do tests" and everything else is a side point?

mattigames 7y ago
Yeah sorry, I was just trying to be succinct in the post, I been working on fixing some tests lately so I guess that's why it came to mind.
- LeoNatan25 7y ago
  Good luck to you in your search!
mattwad 7y ago
Based on my experience, it's a rare skill if they can do it well. The problem is everyone says "I do tests"
lmilcin 7y ago
I have been interviewing candidates regularly for over a decade. What the candidate says on his resume and the actual level of his skill is not at all correlated. I have met many very good candidates that were obsessively worrying about gaps in their knowledge. At the same time poor candidates seem to be very confident thinking they are master developers but can't solve simplest task on a whiteboard.
- LeoNatan25 7y ago
  Yes, sadly my experience is very similar. The more confident a candidate is, usually the poorer they are.
lidHanteyk 7y ago
At scale, some companies do employ folks dedicated to producing tests, yes.

Der_Einzige 7y ago

Good! Companies which don't allow WFH for their employees in these circumstances should be punished for their greediness and incompetence.

tropo 7y ago
I think it goes the other way. greediness: too cheap to provide an office incompetence: letting employees assemble spy satellites at home
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
perl4ever 7y ago
State of NY still hasn't changed the rules for WFH for civil service.

guessmyname 7y ago

According to these news [1][2][3] the first case of COVID-19 in Colombia was in a 19-year-old student who arrived in Bogota from Milan, Italy. [1] https://www.bbc.com/mundo/noticias-america-latina-51772405 https://www.bbc.com/mundo/noticias-america-latina-51772405 [2] http://www.china.org.cn/world/Off_the_Wire/2020-03/07/content_75784101.htm http://www.china.org.cn/world/Off_the_Wire/2020-03/07/conten... [3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbl71sqE6NI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbl71sqE6NI

danielvlopes2 7y ago

Many managers don't actually know how to handle WFH well. To help with the transition we decided to give away our eBook on the subject (which is usually paid). You can download the ePub/PDF here: https://knowyourteam.com/m/managing_remote_teams https://knowyourteam.com/m/managing_remote_teams Maybe share it internally and see if they change the policy. Getting a new job now might be tricky.