8 ms·

A few medicines of note here: Ace inhibitors are a well known treatment that reduces blood pressure. However, there are two different types of medicine undergo

• jmnicolas 7y ago
  Beware of chloroquine, I read somewhere it wasn't all that good for your health. Sorry I don't remember much, but do some research before you use it.
  • dis-sys 7y ago
    it is a 70 years old drug with its safety profile well studied.
    • rscho 7y ago
      Yes... well-studied does not mean without drawbacks. Right now on this day, OP is probably more likely to die from chloroquine administration than from the pandemic.
      • jamesblonde 7y ago
        I dont think chloroquine has 3% morbidity. And if you are a higher risk individual, the math towards chloroquine improve. By dosing in a controlled ramp-up way, you can better mitigate many known side effects such as psychosis - identify earlier and most cases resolve when treatment is ceased.
        • rscho 7y ago
          3% is as good as a number drawn from a hat at this stage of the epidemic, be it drawn from Nature, Cell or whatever. Also, those 3% assume you are contaminated. You can't compare that to a short-to-medium term run of preventive chloroquine adminstration, which has a rather high incidence of minor side effects. You are statistically comparing oranges to apples. This behaviour increases your risk of hurting yourself by a large margin compared to simply following WHO recommendations.
          • angry_octet 7y ago
            Statistically, population wide chloroquine prophylaxis would probably cause more problems than is warranted by the COVID-19 threat. Even if it works, and isn't just wishful thinking / propaganda.
            • rscho 7y ago
              I agree.
          • jamesblonde 7y ago
            I don't disagree with you, actually. Like I said, if you are in a high risk group, the math changes - but I agree that mass preventive chloroquine adminstration would not be a good idea. However, if there is a large outbreak, shortages of chloroquine or you have to wait days/weeks for your doctor to prescribe chloroquine - that is not a place i personally want to be. On another note, this is a nice thread helping me (and maybe others) inform them about side effects and efficacy of possible treatments.
    • hexl 7y ago
      Bleach has a well studied safety profile too
      • blattimwind 7y ago
        Kills cancer, prevents caries
    • DanBC 7y ago
      https://bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/chloroquine.html https://bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/chloroquine.html > Side-effects > Rare or very rare > Cardiomyopathy; hallucination; hepatitis >Frequency not known > Abdominal pain; agranulocytosis; alopecia; anxiety; atrioventricular block; bone marrow disorders; confusion; corneal deposits; depression; diarrhoea; eye disorders; gastrointestinal disorder; headache; hearing impairment; hypoglycaemia; hypotension; insomnia; interstitial lung disease; movement disorders; myopathy; nausea; neuromyopathy; neutropenia; personality change; photosensitivity reaction; psychotic disorder; QT interval prolongation; seizure; severe cutaneous adverse reactions (SCARs); skin reactions; thrombocytopenia; tinnitus; tongue protrusion; vision disorders; vomiting This "frequency not known" is listed alphabetically. There's some potentially fatal things in that list.
      • biolurker1 7y ago
        have you tried reading paracetamol leaflet under the frequency not known paragraph?
        • refurb 7y ago
          Billions of people take paracetamol with no issues at all. That's not true about chloroquine.
• romski 7y ago
  Did you buy it from somewhere that can be delivered to the US?
• d6e 7y ago
  What service did you use to sequence your genome?
  • jamesblonde 7y ago
    Dante labs. They give you the .vcf files, you have to annoy them for the .bam and .fastq files.
• nkrumm 7y ago
  Everyone is welcome to take their own health into their own hands. However, for others looking to this as advice, please be aware that: 1) ACE inhibitors (lisinopril, etc.) are generally though to be enzymatic inhibitors of ACE, not ACE2 [1]. Also, enzymatic inhibition of the enzyme does not mean that it will prevent a virus from using that protein as an entry mechanism. 2) Chloroquine is an old drug with a well known safety profile, but it is certainly not a "safe" drug-- there are many known side effects including life threatening or severely disabling ones. As an MD, I recommend always consulting with your own medical provider(s) before starting any medications. [1] e.g., https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15897343 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15897343
  • snapetom 7y ago
    > ACE inhibitors (lisinopril, etc.) are generally though to be enzymatic inhibitors of ACE, not ACE2 Correct. Ace inhibitors have shown no effect on ACE2. https://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/10.1139/y02-021 https://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/10.1139/y02-021
    • Cantbekhan 7y ago
      Some more recent research seem to at least partially contradict this statement and seem to suggest ACE inhibitors do affect ACE2. https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1440-1681.2009.05302.x https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1440-1681.... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15897343 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15897343 In addition there is also this specific recent Covid19 paper which does cautiously attract attention on this matter. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41569-020-0360-5 https://www.nature.com/articles/s41569-020-0360-5 I had a talk with 2 cardiologists and their response (this is not medical advice, talk to your cardiologist) was that it would be reasonable at least until further research is completed to for instance switch medication from ACE inhibitors to a Calcium Channel Blocker (such as Lercanidipine). At least until the pandemic gets under control and/or vaccine/treatment is available and validated. There are very few cons to this safety measure if this can prevent complications. But that's my sole opinion and again, not medical advice. This might be worth at least an inquiry to your cardiologist. Especially if you're over 60. (Sorry for by bad English, not a native speaker)
• rscho 7y ago
  Yeah, prepping is great but you might want to rethink this attitude. Truth is, we don't know what works and you must realize that many (most?) people publishing in those papers you read don't have your well-being as their first priority. You defy docs who prescribe, but why not also defy those who attempt to ride the fear wave to publish?
  • kuprel 7y ago
    Good point about the incentives behind publishing. That said, it would be nice if educated people could make educated risks, and the general population could learn from their successes and failures. It seems like that would be a lot faster than the current system of getting drugs approved
• tom_mellior 7y ago
  > I won't wait for docs to discuss prescribing it if i get any symptoms. I may even take it for preventative use. In addition to what everyone else said, would this even make sense in non-preventative use? By the time you show symptoms, the virus has already had several days to spread around your body. Would disrupting cell entry not be much too late at that point?
  • usrusr 7y ago
    Sure, because those cells that are already pressed into virus copy duty won't survive forever. Corona copies, being enveloped viruses, apparently can leave the host cell without killing it, but once self-infection is blocked the remaining recovery should be hardly more a victory lap.
• campercoder 7y ago
  Which company did you sequence your full genome with? How long did it take?
• deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
• forkexec 7y ago
  Chloroquine isn't a safe medication. Side-effects include irreversible macular degeneration. Check out how many other side-effects there can be: https://www.drugs.com/sfx/chloroquine-side-effects.html https://www.drugs.com/sfx/chloroquine-side-effects.html
• dTal 7y ago
  Where did you get Chloroquine from? It appears to be a semi-controlled substance, and most pharmacies won't sell it to you unless you can prove that you're traveling to one of the (very few) places left in the world where it's still an effective anti-malarial.
  • angry_octet 7y ago
    It's a ghastly beast, I wouldn't recommend anyone take it for fun. It's available cheaply in third world places, so you could probably get it online. (Doxycycline and other antimalarials are also terrible, just better than getting malaria.)
• biolurker1 7y ago
  I also got chloroquine but I think I would use it on my parents or me only if we would be sick for a long time without ER room or something. What's your plan?
  • rscho 7y ago
    That's a f###ing bad idea given the current state of knowledge about this infection. Your chance for doing more harm than good is huge.
    • biolurker1 7y ago
      why? that's a drug that has been used, and honestly if my parents are 20 days in trouble breathing and ER is full I can't see why not. Other choice is to let them die
      • rscho 7y ago
        It amazes me how people can be most defiant regarding usual care practice and so prompt at accepting the first hypothetical unverified claim that comes their way in an emergency. Truly dumbfounding. And I've been at it for more than 10 years already.
        • biolurker1 7y ago
          https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32150618 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32150618 This can change your mind
          • rscho 7y ago
            You mean the "in vitro" part?
            • biolurker1 7y ago
              I mean it's common practice at hospitals now. Using dumbfounded dumb dumb words is dumb bro
• refurb 7y ago
  Jesus! Chloroquine has side effects like hearing damage, damage to the eye, irregular heart rhythm. It’s a terribly dirty drug. This medicine may cause heart problems and changes in your heart rhythm. Check with your doctor right away if you have chest pain or tightness, decreased urine output, dilated neck veins, extreme fatigue, swelling of the face, fingers, feet, or lower legs, troubled breathing, or weight gain. You may also feel dizzy or faint, or you may have a fast, pounding, or uneven heartbeat. This medicine may cause hypoglycemia (low blood sugar), which may be life-threatening. Low blood sugar must be treated before it causes you to pass out (unconsciousness). People feel different symptoms of low blood sugar. It is important that you learn which symptoms you usually have so you can treat it quickly. Talk to your doctor about the best way to treat low blood sugar. Chloroquine may cause vision problems. It may also make you dizzy or lightheaded. Do not drive or do anything else that could be dangerous until you know how this medicine affects you. . If these reactions are especially bothersome, check with your doctor. Check with your doctor immediately if blurred vision, difficulty with reading, or any other change in vision occurs during or after treatment. Your doctor may want your eyes be checked by an ophthalmologist (eye doctor). This medicine may cause extrapyramidal disorders (eg, dystonia, dyskinesia, tongue protrusion, torticollis). Check with your doctor right away if you have the following symptoms after using the medicine: difficulty in speaking, drooling, loss of balance control, muscle trembling, jerking, or stiffness, restlessness, shuffling walk, stiffness of the limbs, twisting movements of the body, or uncontrolled movements, especially of the face, neck, and back.
  • deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
• rolph 7y ago
  this is only part of the story. protease inhibitors are a major part of what was being demonstrated here. the spike protien docks with the human ACE2 enzyme, that is for certain. this is only one part of the entry process. after docking the spike protien must be "cut loose" [primed] in order to allow the membrane fusion process to proceed. this cutting occurs at the behest of exocytic serine protease, named [TMPRSS2]. the function of TMPRSS2 is not very clear but it seems to facilitate viral entry of SARS-2, Thus serine protease interaction must be manipulated in addition to interfering with ACE2 docking. Then there is the damage. ACE2 sweeps up angiotensins I, and II and converts them into a nonactive form thus regulating the angiotensin pool created by ACE. when angiotensin II reaches its receptor [ATR] the immediate functional effect is to cause vasoconstriction and increase blood pressure to operational level. when ACE2 is disrupted from managing the angiotensin II pool there is an excess of ATR activation and this leads to a pathological state. The space between lung epithelial cells becomes reinforced with extracellular fibres leading to pulmonary sclerosis in addition to widespread cell death in lung tissue. this is where the concept of ACE inhibitor and ATR blockers come into play. the reduction of angiotensinII and reduction of ATR signalling is thought to be a method of mediating this pathophysiological consequence of initial ACE2 disruption during viral docking process. the whole picture is to block the virus ability to dock, and block virus ability to initiate the fusion process; And to mediate damages caused by the disruption of the RAS by way of ACE inhibitors and ATR blocking. that means four points of leverege in this system, require four drugs minimum and clinical care for patient management.
  • arpa 7y ago
    This makes perfect sense! Thank you!
• jv22222 7y ago
  Might be of interest: “Expert consensus on chloroquine phosphate for the treatment of novel coronavirus pneumonia” https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/32075365/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/32075365/