5 ms·

It's not _that_ simple. Recycling doesn't care about shape, just material, and reusing has the problem of people putting random things in the bottle before send

by pmlnr 7y ago

It's not _that_ simple. Recycling doesn't care about shape, just material, and reusing has the problem of people putting random things in the bottle before sending it off - including toxic and/or corrosive materials, thus making reusing impossible.

smegger001 7y ago
Use glass bottles. We used reuse glass soda and beer bottles all the time, part of your charge when purchasing these products was a bottle deposit that would be refunded upon return.
- scrollaway 7y ago
  Okay, great, you solved the reuse of material problem. Now what about the difference in weight your solution creates? The added weight means more fuel consumed in transport, both from bottling to store and during recycling... I'm not saying your solution isn't better btw, I didn't do the math; just reminding you that it might not be as straightforward as "just do x".
grecy 7y ago
Tons of countries throughout Latin America, Africa and Europe reuse large glass bottles for soda and beer and whatever else. The bottles are thoroughly cleaned and sterilized between uses. It is that simple. Make it a law, get on with it.
- Mediterraneo10 7y ago
  The problem with this solution is that washing and sterilizing makes a heavy demand on the country’s own water sources, which may already be facing depletion. It works well in, say, Northern Europe which is very wet, but in Peru or India such a system is not so environmentally friendly. There, it may be better to use plastic containers that are recycled at a facility elsewhere.
  - 0_____0 7y ago
    How much water is used to clean/sterilize a bottle? Compared to resources consumed making the container from scratch or attempting to crush/reprocess it? FWIW India already has a robust bottle return and reuse system.
    - Mediterraneo10 7y ago
      > Compared to resources consumed making the container from scratch or attempting to crush/reprocess it? Empty containers can be loaded onto container ships, where they can be recycled elsewhere, and new containers delivered the same way. While that may still not be environmentally optimal on a world scale, at least it would consume no extra water in regions that are arid or facing groundwater depletion. > FWIW India already has a robust bottle return and reuse system. The soft-drink industry in India has already been castigated for depletion of groundwater, so again, washing and sterilizing all these bottles only compounds the damage.
      - PinkMilkshake 7y ago
        I feel like we are stuck in a loop. Perhaps we need question whether or not it still makes sense to transport food and drink in small, individual containers. One solution might be to transport in bulk. You could take your own bottles to the supermarket that are whatever shape and material you desire and fill them up.
        Mediterraneo10 7y ago
        How do you preserve the carbonation of soft drinks, then? In order for drinks to stay fizzy, the container has to be filled under pressure. Even if you offer customers some fancy machine that can fill their bottles under pressure, you still risk issues with customers bringing in old, flimsy containers that cannot withstand those pressures.
        PinkMilkshake 7y ago
- justanotherc 7y ago
  Not only does re-use take large amounts of water in the cleaning of containers, but glass is orders or magnitude more expensive to ship product in. You're shipping a ton of glass around when you could be using that weight to ship product. It drives up cost and increases fuel burn. It is not that simple. Unfortunately.
  - Symbiote 7y ago
    Then refill plastic bottles, as is common in Germany.
  - ssivark 7y ago
    > glass is orders or magnitude more expensive to ship product in That sounds like nonsense. For a filled ~300ml container of soda, a glass bottle would be ~20% (ballpark) heavier than an aluminum can. Even if shipping costs increased by a similar proportion (actually less, but whatever) and we include the cost of cleaning bottles, it seems we would still end up ahead compared to the song-and-dance of recycling, which is incredibly resource intensive.
    - justanotherc 7y ago
      Not only weight, but due to the breakable nature of glass you also need more protective packaging, and you still get more breakage than plastic, which drives cost up even more due to lost product. With plastic, throw some shrinkwrap on them and you're good to go.
      - LadyCailin 7y ago
        I’m not concerned about price for non essential items like soft drinks. Having a functioning ecosystem is far more important than whether or not you have to pay an extra dollar for your coke.
  - wdb 7y ago
    Can’t you recycle the water?

by pmlnr 7y ago

smegger001 7y ago

Use glass bottles. We used reuse glass soda and beer bottles all the time, part of your charge when purchasing these products was a bottle deposit that would be refunded upon return.

scrollaway 7y ago
Okay, great, you solved the reuse of material problem. Now what about the difference in weight your solution creates? The added weight means more fuel consumed in transport, both from bottling to store and during recycling... I'm not saying your solution isn't better btw, I didn't do the math; just reminding you that it might not be as straightforward as "just do x".

grecy 7y ago

Tons of countries throughout Latin America, Africa and Europe reuse large glass bottles for soda and beer and whatever else. The bottles are thoroughly cleaned and sterilized between uses. It is that simple. Make it a law, get on with it.

Mediterraneo10 7y ago
The problem with this solution is that washing and sterilizing makes a heavy demand on the country’s own water sources, which may already be facing depletion. It works well in, say, Northern Europe which is very wet, but in Peru or India such a system is not so environmentally friendly. There, it may be better to use plastic containers that are recycled at a facility elsewhere.
- 0_____0 7y ago
  How much water is used to clean/sterilize a bottle? Compared to resources consumed making the container from scratch or attempting to crush/reprocess it? FWIW India already has a robust bottle return and reuse system.
  - Mediterraneo10 7y ago
    > Compared to resources consumed making the container from scratch or attempting to crush/reprocess it? Empty containers can be loaded onto container ships, where they can be recycled elsewhere, and new containers delivered the same way. While that may still not be environmentally optimal on a world scale, at least it would consume no extra water in regions that are arid or facing groundwater depletion. > FWIW India already has a robust bottle return and reuse system. The soft-drink industry in India has already been castigated for depletion of groundwater, so again, washing and sterilizing all these bottles only compounds the damage.
    - PinkMilkshake 7y ago
      I feel like we are stuck in a loop. Perhaps we need question whether or not it still makes sense to transport food and drink in small, individual containers. One solution might be to transport in bulk. You could take your own bottles to the supermarket that are whatever shape and material you desire and fill them up.
      - Mediterraneo10 7y ago
        How do you preserve the carbonation of soft drinks, then? In order for drinks to stay fizzy, the container has to be filled under pressure. Even if you offer customers some fancy machine that can fill their bottles under pressure, you still risk issues with customers bringing in old, flimsy containers that cannot withstand those pressures.
        PinkMilkshake 7y ago
justanotherc 7y ago
Not only does re-use take large amounts of water in the cleaning of containers, but glass is orders or magnitude more expensive to ship product in. You're shipping a ton of glass around when you could be using that weight to ship product. It drives up cost and increases fuel burn. It is not that simple. Unfortunately.
- Symbiote 7y ago
  Then refill plastic bottles, as is common in Germany.
- ssivark 7y ago
  > glass is orders or magnitude more expensive to ship product in That sounds like nonsense. For a filled ~300ml container of soda, a glass bottle would be ~20% (ballpark) heavier than an aluminum can. Even if shipping costs increased by a similar proportion (actually less, but whatever) and we include the cost of cleaning bottles, it seems we would still end up ahead compared to the song-and-dance of recycling, which is incredibly resource intensive.
  - justanotherc 7y ago
    Not only weight, but due to the breakable nature of glass you also need more protective packaging, and you still get more breakage than plastic, which drives cost up even more due to lost product. With plastic, throw some shrinkwrap on them and you're good to go.
    - LadyCailin 7y ago
      I’m not concerned about price for non essential items like soft drinks. Having a functioning ecosystem is far more important than whether or not you have to pay an extra dollar for your coke.
- wdb 7y ago
  Can’t you recycle the water?