5 ms·

Meanwhile, the ancient Maytag fridge in our lab has been going for probably 20 years without fault (fingers crossed). I know there’s probably some survivorship

Meanwhile, the ancient Maytag fridge in our lab has been going for probably 20 years without fault (fingers crossed). I know there’s probably some survivorship bias, but it really does feel like appliances aren’t built to last anymore.

anonsivalley652 7y ago
My dad has a 40-year-old puke yellow Kenmoore refrigerator and 35-year-old Maytag washer & dryer. There's 2 axises of goods to think about that differ wildly: 1. the specific brand and model - some models may have regressions or design defects 2. the model year, manufacturing date and location - quality, reliability and cost-cutting measures vary with revision, manufacturing experience and who put it together (QA/QC doesn't catch every possible contingency)
berbec 7y ago
Isn't there still a light bulb burning from the 1900s?
- saagarjha 7y ago
  Only because it's being run so dim.
- vibrolax 7y ago
  Livermore CA fire station
MikusR 7y ago
Does it follow all current environmental and efficiency standards and regulations?
- yarosv 7y ago
  Is it better to have one machine that does not follow regulations, or throw away four onto the landfill, that does?
  - IAmEveryone 7y ago
    The answer to that question is less clear than you seem to expect. In terms of total energy use, it’s almost certain that a ten-year refrigerator should be replaced, for example. For something like a washing machine, it’s probably similar although amount of use obviously factors into it.
    - escardin 7y ago
      > In terms of total energy use, it’s almost certain that a ten-year refrigerator should be replaced, for example. Argh! This is such BS! I'm so sick of hearing this. My parents had a 30+ year old fridge they replaced recently. The energuide sticker on the old one said it's total annual power usage was only marginally less than their brand new one. You'll almost never make up the cost of replacing something based on power usage alone unless you're starting off really inefficient, or power costs a ton. Refrigerators have gotten better in the last 30 years, but they're not computers, they don't double in efficiency/performance every other year (which isn't true of computers anymore either). The math was probably all worked out in the 60's and it's been marginal gains from material science improvements ever since. Most appliances aren't that complicated. Fridges are insulated boxes with a compressor and a thermocouple. If you read the reliability reports from consumer reports, you'll find that the simple (cheap) fridges all have top marks in reliability. All the fancy ones, it's all their fancy parts that break. I have never understood why people just buy the idea that a major appliance that is 10 years old is so inefficient that you should replace it without consideration.
      - userbinator 7y ago
        I have never understood why people just buy the idea that a major appliance that is 10 years old is so inefficient that you should replace it without consideration. Never underestimate the power of corporate propaganda.
  - MikusR 7y ago
    It's not about throwing out the old. The question is "why are they not making them like they used to?" And the answer is "because people that worry about the environment lobbied for regulations that make it very hard or impossible to do so". Every 5 years world population increases by 400 million people. They want refrigerators.

anonsivalley652 7y ago

My dad has a 40-year-old puke yellow Kenmoore refrigerator and 35-year-old Maytag washer & dryer. There's 2 axises of goods to think about that differ wildly: 1. the specific brand and model - some models may have regressions or design defects 2. the model year, manufacturing date and location - quality, reliability and cost-cutting measures vary with revision, manufacturing experience and who put it together (QA/QC doesn't catch every possible contingency)

berbec 7y ago

Isn't there still a light bulb burning from the 1900s?

saagarjha 7y ago
Only because it's being run so dim.
vibrolax 7y ago
Livermore CA fire station

MikusR 7y ago

Does it follow all current environmental and efficiency standards and regulations?

yarosv 7y ago
Is it better to have one machine that does not follow regulations, or throw away four onto the landfill, that does?
- IAmEveryone 7y ago
  The answer to that question is less clear than you seem to expect. In terms of total energy use, it’s almost certain that a ten-year refrigerator should be replaced, for example. For something like a washing machine, it’s probably similar although amount of use obviously factors into it.
  - escardin 7y ago
    > In terms of total energy use, it’s almost certain that a ten-year refrigerator should be replaced, for example. Argh! This is such BS! I'm so sick of hearing this. My parents had a 30+ year old fridge they replaced recently. The energuide sticker on the old one said it's total annual power usage was only marginally less than their brand new one. You'll almost never make up the cost of replacing something based on power usage alone unless you're starting off really inefficient, or power costs a ton. Refrigerators have gotten better in the last 30 years, but they're not computers, they don't double in efficiency/performance every other year (which isn't true of computers anymore either). The math was probably all worked out in the 60's and it's been marginal gains from material science improvements ever since. Most appliances aren't that complicated. Fridges are insulated boxes with a compressor and a thermocouple. If you read the reliability reports from consumer reports, you'll find that the simple (cheap) fridges all have top marks in reliability. All the fancy ones, it's all their fancy parts that break. I have never understood why people just buy the idea that a major appliance that is 10 years old is so inefficient that you should replace it without consideration.
    - userbinator 7y ago
      I have never understood why people just buy the idea that a major appliance that is 10 years old is so inefficient that you should replace it without consideration. Never underestimate the power of corporate propaganda.
- MikusR 7y ago
  It's not about throwing out the old. The question is "why are they not making them like they used to?" And the answer is "because people that worry about the environment lobbied for regulations that make it very hard or impossible to do so". Every 5 years world population increases by 400 million people. They want refrigerators.