5 ms·

Tortured? I mean, some of what you describe is unpalatable, unpleasant, and maybe (IANAL) contrary to expected standards of the treatment of prisoners... but t

by mft_ 7y ago

Tortured? I mean, some of what you describe is unpalatable, unpleasant, and maybe (IANAL) contrary to expected standards of the treatment of prisoners... but tortured?

anonsivalley652 7y ago
Excuse me, solitary confinement in a supermax prison for almost a year is torture, cruel, and unjust for a simple, nonviolent skipping bail charge. This sort of thing should've been 2 months at a minimum security prison in genpop at the most. This is purely political persecution by British toadies of American hegemony. If you can't see any of this, then you are blind.
- mft_ 7y ago
  Thanks for your informative (and measured) response. To clarify, I'm no expert on the Assange case, and was responding to the previous commenter, whose account didn't mention solitary confinement in a supermax prison for almost a year. If that is indeed the case, I'd agree it sounds pretty awful.
  - k1m 7y ago
    Here's what Nils Melzer the UN Special Rapporteur on Torture had to say: > Question: At what point does imprisonment become torture? > Nils Melzer: Julian Assange has been intentionally psychologically tortured by Sweden, Britain, Ecuador and the U.S. First through the highly arbitrary handling of proceedings against him. The way Sweden pursued the case, with active assistance from Britain, was aimed at putting him under pressure and trapping him in the embassy. Sweden was never interested in finding the truth and helping these women, but in pushing Assange into a corner. It has been an abuse of judicial processes aimed at pushing a person into a position where he is unable to defend himself. On top of that come the surveillance measures, the insults, the indignities and the attacks by politicians from these countries, up to and including death threats. This constant abuse of state power has triggered serious stress and anxiety in Assange and has resulted in measurable cognitive and neurological harm. I visited Assange in his cell in London in May 2019 together with two experienced, widely respected doctors who are specialized in the forensic and psychological examination of torture victims. The diagnosis arrived at by the two doctors was clear: Julian Assange displays the typical symptoms of psychological torture. If he doesn’t receive protection soon, a rapid deterioration of his health is likely, and death could be one outcome. Source: https://www.republik.ch/2020/01/31/nils-melzer-about-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange https://www.republik.ch/2020/01/31/nils-melzer-about-wikilea...
    - anonsivalley652 7y ago
      And a 3 million euro extortion scheme as a cherry on top. This was for the surveillance videos/audio and stolen medical, legal and personal documents of Julian's that WikiLeaks EIC Kristinn worked with Madrid police to thwart Ecuadorian embassy staff from "selling" back to them. (I take it they claimed some sort of diplomatic immunity because I don't see any news regarding arrests.) This is how the corrupt elites in power maintain their position, folks; by ordering the political, legal, military, police, judicial establishments to lie, cheat, and steal in order to conduct a sham trial. It's a farce, without legitimacy.
  - anonsivalley652 7y ago
    No problem, I can never quite tell how writing comes across to be calibrated reasonably. In general, I only hope and suggest every individual determines to make themselves more informed (knowledge is literally a prerequisite of power), in depth and breadth, rather than haphazardly absorbing information to a shallow depth that is ambiently shoveled on them by commercial forces. I'm not a reporter, but I know a little about it: - Just days before Assange was dragged out from the embassy, WikiLeaks Editor-in-Chief met with would-be extortionists in Madrid, Spain (unnamed Ecuadorian embassy staff; either intelligence operatives or for personal gain) who suggested a payment of 3 million euros in lieu of releasing months/years of surveillance video & audio and stolen documents covering Julian's daily existence. On top of that, WikiLeaks collaborated with the Madrid police to conduct a sting operation that recorded audio and video of the extortion scheme, and it was referred to the Madrid's prosecutor's office. (I've checked multiple sources and it doesn't seem any of the Ecuadorian embassy staff were arrested, they probably claimed diplomatic immunity?) - Assange was holding a book, History of The National Security State by Gore Vidal, in his hand when he was being illegally dragged out by British police. - It is internationally illegal to revoke asylum once granted, unless the statements leading to its granting are disputed by new evidence. - Julian's parents support him on Twitter quite often, and were at the latest hearing. They had to threaten to walk-out in order to keep Kristinn (WL E-I-C) from being banned for no reason. - Pamela Anderson has been a vocal supporter. One could surmise that they may have "a thing." I haven't seen her in a while supporting Assange, guess she's too busy marrying and divorcing Jon Peters. ;-) - Dragging Assange out from the embassy accomplished four goals for Moreno: 1) Silenced a potential embarrassing story from misbehavior of civilian or intelligence service personnel allowing WikiLeaks to make Ecuador look bad. 2) Got rid of "a stone in [his] shoe." (That's a direct quote.) 3) Appeased US interests. 4) Secured the $10.2 billion IMF loan package. Wikileaks Editor in chief holds press briefing 143K views - Apr 10 2019 https://youtu.be/QFq38d3Q9qY https://youtu.be/QFq38d3Q9qY Spanish police ‘recover Julian Assange surveillance footage’ [and stolen legal and medical documents] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2019/apr/10/julian-assange-wikileaks-says-spies-at-work-in-ecuadorean-embassy https://www.theguardian.com/media/2019/apr/10/julian-assange...
- JoeSmithson 7y ago
  Assange is not in solitary confinement. This has been confirmed by Nils Melzer himself. Please stop spreading misinformation.
- logfromblammo 7y ago
  I'd not put a demonstrated and notorious flight risk in minimum security. Low security, yes--not to be allowed freedom of movement until the extradition is decided. That certainly should have already happened. I don't understand any legitimate reason for the delay.
dean177 7y ago
"Torture means any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession" Yes, it is exactly torture. https://apt.ch/en/what-is-torture/ https://apt.ch/en/what-is-torture/
- mft_ 7y ago
  Again, probably depends on which aspects of his treatment you're referring to. The original quote spoke of "twice been stripped naked and searched, eleven times been handcuffed, and five times been locked up in different holding cells" - which is unpleasant treatment, but probably not hugely different from the treatment of many prisoners, fairly regularly, within our dehumanising criminal justice system. And I don't think it would constitute torture, per your definition. That said, as another commenter added, he's apparently been in solitary confinement [for up to 23 hours a day[0] ] in a high category prison for a year. This sounds pretty awful, and much closer to a definition of "torture". That said, it's hard to know: maybe prisoners of his nature are routinely interned in Belmarsh? And maybe being in your cell for 23 hours a day is routine for prisoners in Belmarsh? Would be interesting to know why it's taken a year for his case to be heard, though. [0] https://inews.co.uk/news/julian-assange-solitary-confinement-human-rights-gavin-macfayden-award-638050 https://inews.co.uk/news/julian-assange-solitary-confinement...
  - teraku 7y ago
    I mean they needed to wait for something big enough to bury it (Corona). Now's the perfect chance :kappa: In all honesty though, there is a bunch of evidence in his US court case that basically frees him of all accusations in his british court case, but the judge refuses to accept it. Although the case is about delivering him to the US. So she denies the rightfulnes of the US court system, but wants to deliver a person to this very system??? And then there is a treaty of denying political extradictions. But then the judge said that she does not care for the treaty and only honors the UK Extraction Act, which does not mention any of it.
  - dean177 7y ago
thinkingemote 7y ago
It may not be "enhanced interrogation" but...
yk 7y ago
> “The evidence is overwhelming and clear,” the expert [a medical expert accompanying the UN Special Rapporteur on torture Melzer during a visit to Assange] said. “Mr. Assange has been deliberately exposed, for a period of several years, to progressively severe forms of cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment, the cumulative effects of which can only be described as psychological torture. https://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/DisplayNews.aspx?NewsID=24665 https://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/DisplayNews.aspx?N...

by mft_ 7y ago

Tortured? I mean, some of what you describe is unpalatable, unpleasant, and maybe (IANAL) contrary to expected standards of the treatment of prisoners... but tortured?

anonsivalley652 7y ago

Excuse me, solitary confinement in a supermax prison for almost a year is torture, cruel, and unjust for a simple, nonviolent skipping bail charge. This sort of thing should've been 2 months at a minimum security prison in genpop at the most. This is purely political persecution by British toadies of American hegemony. If you can't see any of this, then you are blind.

mft_ 7y ago
Thanks for your informative (and measured) response. To clarify, I'm no expert on the Assange case, and was responding to the previous commenter, whose account didn't mention solitary confinement in a supermax prison for almost a year. If that is indeed the case, I'd agree it sounds pretty awful.
- k1m 7y ago
  Here's what Nils Melzer the UN Special Rapporteur on Torture had to say: > Question: At what point does imprisonment become torture? > Nils Melzer: Julian Assange has been intentionally psychologically tortured by Sweden, Britain, Ecuador and the U.S. First through the highly arbitrary handling of proceedings against him. The way Sweden pursued the case, with active assistance from Britain, was aimed at putting him under pressure and trapping him in the embassy. Sweden was never interested in finding the truth and helping these women, but in pushing Assange into a corner. It has been an abuse of judicial processes aimed at pushing a person into a position where he is unable to defend himself. On top of that come the surveillance measures, the insults, the indignities and the attacks by politicians from these countries, up to and including death threats. This constant abuse of state power has triggered serious stress and anxiety in Assange and has resulted in measurable cognitive and neurological harm. I visited Assange in his cell in London in May 2019 together with two experienced, widely respected doctors who are specialized in the forensic and psychological examination of torture victims. The diagnosis arrived at by the two doctors was clear: Julian Assange displays the typical symptoms of psychological torture. If he doesn’t receive protection soon, a rapid deterioration of his health is likely, and death could be one outcome. Source: https://www.republik.ch/2020/01/31/nils-melzer-about-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange https://www.republik.ch/2020/01/31/nils-melzer-about-wikilea...
  - anonsivalley652 7y ago
    And a 3 million euro extortion scheme as a cherry on top. This was for the surveillance videos/audio and stolen medical, legal and personal documents of Julian's that WikiLeaks EIC Kristinn worked with Madrid police to thwart Ecuadorian embassy staff from "selling" back to them. (I take it they claimed some sort of diplomatic immunity because I don't see any news regarding arrests.) This is how the corrupt elites in power maintain their position, folks; by ordering the political, legal, military, police, judicial establishments to lie, cheat, and steal in order to conduct a sham trial. It's a farce, without legitimacy.
- anonsivalley652 7y ago
  No problem, I can never quite tell how writing comes across to be calibrated reasonably. In general, I only hope and suggest every individual determines to make themselves more informed (knowledge is literally a prerequisite of power), in depth and breadth, rather than haphazardly absorbing information to a shallow depth that is ambiently shoveled on them by commercial forces. I'm not a reporter, but I know a little about it: - Just days before Assange was dragged out from the embassy, WikiLeaks Editor-in-Chief met with would-be extortionists in Madrid, Spain (unnamed Ecuadorian embassy staff; either intelligence operatives or for personal gain) who suggested a payment of 3 million euros in lieu of releasing months/years of surveillance video & audio and stolen documents covering Julian's daily existence. On top of that, WikiLeaks collaborated with the Madrid police to conduct a sting operation that recorded audio and video of the extortion scheme, and it was referred to the Madrid's prosecutor's office. (I've checked multiple sources and it doesn't seem any of the Ecuadorian embassy staff were arrested, they probably claimed diplomatic immunity?) - Assange was holding a book, History of The National Security State by Gore Vidal, in his hand when he was being illegally dragged out by British police. - It is internationally illegal to revoke asylum once granted, unless the statements leading to its granting are disputed by new evidence. - Julian's parents support him on Twitter quite often, and were at the latest hearing. They had to threaten to walk-out in order to keep Kristinn (WL E-I-C) from being banned for no reason. - Pamela Anderson has been a vocal supporter. One could surmise that they may have "a thing." I haven't seen her in a while supporting Assange, guess she's too busy marrying and divorcing Jon Peters. ;-) - Dragging Assange out from the embassy accomplished four goals for Moreno: 1) Silenced a potential embarrassing story from misbehavior of civilian or intelligence service personnel allowing WikiLeaks to make Ecuador look bad. 2) Got rid of "a stone in [his] shoe." (That's a direct quote.) 3) Appeased US interests. 4) Secured the $10.2 billion IMF loan package. Wikileaks Editor in chief holds press briefing 143K views - Apr 10 2019 https://youtu.be/QFq38d3Q9qY https://youtu.be/QFq38d3Q9qY Spanish police ‘recover Julian Assange surveillance footage’ [and stolen legal and medical documents] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2019/apr/10/julian-assange-wikileaks-says-spies-at-work-in-ecuadorean-embassy https://www.theguardian.com/media/2019/apr/10/julian-assange...
JoeSmithson 7y ago
Assange is not in solitary confinement. This has been confirmed by Nils Melzer himself. Please stop spreading misinformation.
logfromblammo 7y ago
I'd not put a demonstrated and notorious flight risk in minimum security. Low security, yes--not to be allowed freedom of movement until the extradition is decided. That certainly should have already happened. I don't understand any legitimate reason for the delay.

dean177 7y ago

"Torture means any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession" Yes, it is exactly torture. https://apt.ch/en/what-is-torture/ https://apt.ch/en/what-is-torture/

mft_ 7y ago
Again, probably depends on which aspects of his treatment you're referring to. The original quote spoke of "twice been stripped naked and searched, eleven times been handcuffed, and five times been locked up in different holding cells" - which is unpleasant treatment, but probably not hugely different from the treatment of many prisoners, fairly regularly, within our dehumanising criminal justice system. And I don't think it would constitute torture, per your definition. That said, as another commenter added, he's apparently been in solitary confinement [for up to 23 hours a day[0] ] in a high category prison for a year. This sounds pretty awful, and much closer to a definition of "torture". That said, it's hard to know: maybe prisoners of his nature are routinely interned in Belmarsh? And maybe being in your cell for 23 hours a day is routine for prisoners in Belmarsh? Would be interesting to know why it's taken a year for his case to be heard, though. [0] https://inews.co.uk/news/julian-assange-solitary-confinement-human-rights-gavin-macfayden-award-638050 https://inews.co.uk/news/julian-assange-solitary-confinement...
- teraku 7y ago
  I mean they needed to wait for something big enough to bury it (Corona). Now's the perfect chance :kappa: In all honesty though, there is a bunch of evidence in his US court case that basically frees him of all accusations in his british court case, but the judge refuses to accept it. Although the case is about delivering him to the US. So she denies the rightfulnes of the US court system, but wants to deliver a person to this very system??? And then there is a treaty of denying political extradictions. But then the judge said that she does not care for the treaty and only honors the UK Extraction Act, which does not mention any of it.
- dean177 7y ago

thinkingemote 7y ago

It may not be "enhanced interrogation" but...

yk 7y ago

> “The evidence is overwhelming and clear,” the expert [a medical expert accompanying the UN Special Rapporteur on torture Melzer during a visit to Assange] said. “Mr. Assange has been deliberately exposed, for a period of several years, to progressively severe forms of cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment, the cumulative effects of which can only be described as psychological torture. https://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/DisplayNews.aspx?NewsID=24665 https://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/DisplayNews.aspx?N...