4 ms·

Whats sad to me is, if we knew that homeless people could get help and be taken care of, we'd know not to give things to people like this. But since society has

Whats sad to me is, if we knew that homeless people could get help and be taken care of, we'd know not to give things to people like this. But since society has decided to not put resources towards it, we can't make assumptions like that.

grawprog 7y ago
Yeah, I don't like it and I don't like that experience (and others) guiding my judgement when it comes to helping people like that, because not everyone who gets stuck on the streets is like that, but people like that take resources and help from people that do really need it and make it harder for people to care. Which altogether just kinda sucks and there really isn't an easy solution to these problems.
- TheOtherHobbes 7y ago
  The fallacy is that a direct personal experience of one person's dishonest behaviour trumps a financial and economic system which relies on similar actions on an industrial scale. One dude pretending to be crippled is much less socially destructive than an asset-stripping hedge fund which loads up multiple viable businesses with debt and then kills them. The difference is the former is still relatively powerless, while the latter can be responsible for multiple instances of homelessness. So it's not a question of "help" - it's about making sure that homelessness is an absolutely exceptional situation, not the systemic default for anyone who finds themselves on the wrong end of the value creation process. As well as the mentally ill.
  - refurb 7y ago
    “Asset stripping hedge fund”?
    - ZephyrP 7y ago
      purchasing a corporation with the intention to liquidate it's assets for profit, often found seated next to "leveraged buy out" & "pharmaceuticals price hike" in the American Lexicon Association.
      - refurb 7y ago
        Hedge funds don't typically do leveraged buy outs.
        deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
Jommi 7y ago
Yep, in Finland its customary to nearly look down on those begging on the street, as most likely this is related to human trafficking or black market crime. We can do this because we know that a normal citizen would never need to do something like this.
- sneak 7y ago
  > its customary to nearly look down on those begging on the street, as most likely this is related to human trafficking > we know that a normal citizen would never That took a dark turn quickly.
  - 205guy 7y ago
    It's poorly phrased such that it sounds disconnected from the GP (about the lack of care in the US leading to both the needy and scammers on the street), but your quote leaves off the key word: > we know that a normal citizen would never need In other words, when you can trust your society to take care of its residents, you can be almost certain the beggars are scam artists.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - csharptwdec19 7y ago
    Finland is a country with a pretty dang good social safety net. They even have things like Government Subsidized recording studios. The stipulations for receiving aid are fairly light, so I think the viewpoint may be that if you aren't receiving assistance, you aren't willing to play by the simple rules they have. Of course, this is someone from the US speaking, and basing this on my conversations with people from Finland from 10-20 years ago...
  - Jommi 7y ago
    As in enabling human trafficking, not an innocent victim of it. Sorry for the tone :D

grawprog 7y ago

Yeah, I don't like it and I don't like that experience (and others) guiding my judgement when it comes to helping people like that, because not everyone who gets stuck on the streets is like that, but people like that take resources and help from people that do really need it and make it harder for people to care. Which altogether just kinda sucks and there really isn't an easy solution to these problems.

TheOtherHobbes 7y ago
The fallacy is that a direct personal experience of one person's dishonest behaviour trumps a financial and economic system which relies on similar actions on an industrial scale. One dude pretending to be crippled is much less socially destructive than an asset-stripping hedge fund which loads up multiple viable businesses with debt and then kills them. The difference is the former is still relatively powerless, while the latter can be responsible for multiple instances of homelessness. So it's not a question of "help" - it's about making sure that homelessness is an absolutely exceptional situation, not the systemic default for anyone who finds themselves on the wrong end of the value creation process. As well as the mentally ill.
- refurb 7y ago
  “Asset stripping hedge fund”?
  - ZephyrP 7y ago
    purchasing a corporation with the intention to liquidate it's assets for profit, often found seated next to "leveraged buy out" & "pharmaceuticals price hike" in the American Lexicon Association.
    - refurb 7y ago
      Hedge funds don't typically do leveraged buy outs.
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]

Jommi 7y ago

Yep, in Finland its customary to nearly look down on those begging on the street, as most likely this is related to human trafficking or black market crime. We can do this because we know that a normal citizen would never need to do something like this.

sneak 7y ago
> its customary to nearly look down on those begging on the street, as most likely this is related to human trafficking > we know that a normal citizen would never That took a dark turn quickly.
- 205guy 7y ago
  It's poorly phrased such that it sounds disconnected from the GP (about the lack of care in the US leading to both the needy and scammers on the street), but your quote leaves off the key word: > we know that a normal citizen would never need In other words, when you can trust your society to take care of its residents, you can be almost certain the beggars are scam artists.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- csharptwdec19 7y ago
  Finland is a country with a pretty dang good social safety net. They even have things like Government Subsidized recording studios. The stipulations for receiving aid are fairly light, so I think the viewpoint may be that if you aren't receiving assistance, you aren't willing to play by the simple rules they have. Of course, this is someone from the US speaking, and basing this on my conversations with people from Finland from 10-20 years ago...
- Jommi 7y ago
  As in enabling human trafficking, not an innocent victim of it. Sorry for the tone :D