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I have a very hard time believing that this stuff has to do with anything other than having the discipline to have a proper sleep schedule. It's possible to adj

I have a very hard time believing that this stuff has to do with anything other than having the discipline to have a proper sleep schedule. It's possible to adjust your sleep schedule. People do it all the time when they change timezones. I didn't read the article, I'll go read it and update if I change my mind..

zarmin 7y ago
Just to present another perspective: https://abc3340.com/news/local/adhd-and-your-circadian-rhythm https://abc3340.com/news/local/adhd-and-your-circadian-rhyth...
GuB-42 7y ago
Sure, you can change timezone, but you usually feel like shit in the process. The idea seem to be that it takes about a day per hour to adjust. Now the idea (somewhat supported by the article) is that night owls have a natural cycle longer than 24h. It means they are in a constant state of jet lag. The (unrealistic) solution to get in sync with the rest of the population would be to always go west. Early birds are in the opposite situation. They have a natural cycle shorter than 24h. It is just that for some reason, waking up and going to bed early is not seen as a problem in our society, while the other way is.
- eq_sd_ 7y ago
  You're confusing delayed sleep phase disorder with non 24hr sleep wake disorder.
jodrellblank 7y ago
"You could have a proper sleep schedule if you could hold yourself to a proper sleep schedule" doesn't seem to usefully explain or add anything. Surely the people with poor discipline lack exactly that which they need to build discipline?
pclstyle 7y ago
Seems like an unpopular opinion, but this is my experience as well. Went from sleeping from 4-10AM to 11PM-5AM over the course of 3 years, without changing time zones. I swore I was a night-owl my whole life, but I definitely fall into the category of early-risers now. Overall happy with the switch; I love having those quiet morning hours to prepare for the rest of my day. For me, it was about establishing new habits, setting up an environment conducive to sleeping by midnight, and having some external pressures like a work schedule, etc. I've heard this validated by external testimony as well. Can't say there are no biological factors at play that impact individual inclinations, but it's a bit hard to believe that we're hard-wired for one over the other.
- silvester23 7y ago
  > but it's a bit hard to believe that we're hard-wired for one over the other. How is this harder to believe than the huge amount of other human characteristics that are directly affected or even effected by the genes?
Raphmedia 7y ago
Yes, people can adapt to different timezone. However what's interesting is that night owls will adapt based on their own circadian rhythm. If you are someone with delayed circadian rhythm, you would end up synchronizing to the local timezone but still fall asleep after midnight.
- Izkata 7y ago
  So the solution is to own 24 homes and move one timezone over each month?
  - Raphmedia 7y ago
    An easier solution would be to colonize different planets and send the folks with non-24-hour sleep–wake disorder to planets with orbits that corresponds with their circadian cycle.
    - mucahityilmaz 7y ago
      That's what I need actually, a 30-hours-a-day planet. So I can live perfectly in a routine like 10-12 hours of sleep and 18-20 hours of being awake.
dijit 7y ago
It really doesn't take long to adapt, but that first week is glorious, awake and energised!
hnick 7y ago
Counterpoint: when I fly back home westwards from the US, that first week is the best. I get up at a normal-person time. I have energy during daylight hours. I sleep at a decent time. It doesn't last.

zarmin 7y ago

Just to present another perspective: https://abc3340.com/news/local/adhd-and-your-circadian-rhythm https://abc3340.com/news/local/adhd-and-your-circadian-rhyth...

GuB-42 7y ago

Sure, you can change timezone, but you usually feel like shit in the process. The idea seem to be that it takes about a day per hour to adjust. Now the idea (somewhat supported by the article) is that night owls have a natural cycle longer than 24h. It means they are in a constant state of jet lag. The (unrealistic) solution to get in sync with the rest of the population would be to always go west. Early birds are in the opposite situation. They have a natural cycle shorter than 24h. It is just that for some reason, waking up and going to bed early is not seen as a problem in our society, while the other way is.

eq_sd_ 7y ago
You're confusing delayed sleep phase disorder with non 24hr sleep wake disorder.

jodrellblank 7y ago

"You could have a proper sleep schedule if you could hold yourself to a proper sleep schedule" doesn't seem to usefully explain or add anything. Surely the people with poor discipline lack exactly that which they need to build discipline?

pclstyle 7y ago

Seems like an unpopular opinion, but this is my experience as well. Went from sleeping from 4-10AM to 11PM-5AM over the course of 3 years, without changing time zones. I swore I was a night-owl my whole life, but I definitely fall into the category of early-risers now. Overall happy with the switch; I love having those quiet morning hours to prepare for the rest of my day. For me, it was about establishing new habits, setting up an environment conducive to sleeping by midnight, and having some external pressures like a work schedule, etc. I've heard this validated by external testimony as well. Can't say there are no biological factors at play that impact individual inclinations, but it's a bit hard to believe that we're hard-wired for one over the other.

silvester23 7y ago
> but it's a bit hard to believe that we're hard-wired for one over the other. How is this harder to believe than the huge amount of other human characteristics that are directly affected or even effected by the genes?

Raphmedia 7y ago

Yes, people can adapt to different timezone. However what's interesting is that night owls will adapt based on their own circadian rhythm. If you are someone with delayed circadian rhythm, you would end up synchronizing to the local timezone but still fall asleep after midnight.

Izkata 7y ago
So the solution is to own 24 homes and move one timezone over each month?
- Raphmedia 7y ago
  An easier solution would be to colonize different planets and send the folks with non-24-hour sleep–wake disorder to planets with orbits that corresponds with their circadian cycle.
  - mucahityilmaz 7y ago
    That's what I need actually, a 30-hours-a-day planet. So I can live perfectly in a routine like 10-12 hours of sleep and 18-20 hours of being awake.

dijit 7y ago

It really doesn't take long to adapt, but that first week is glorious, awake and energised!

hnick 7y ago

Counterpoint: when I fly back home westwards from the US, that first week is the best. I get up at a normal-person time. I have energy during daylight hours. I sleep at a decent time. It doesn't last.