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I know almost nothing about indoor farming, aeroponics, urban farming, etc - but I get the feeling that people think its better because it appears clean. Farmin

I know almost nothing about indoor farming, aeroponics, urban farming, etc - but I get the feeling that people think its better because it appears clean. Farming and dirt is dirty, and indoor/urban farms/aeroponics are shiny and clean. Of course being dirty has nothing to do with global warming or the environment, but that type of analysis is much more complicated than "looks clean!"

rtkwe 7y ago
Maybe but there's other theoretical benefits too; food grown closer to it's consumption point releases less CO2 being transported and could be fresher, reduced run off from fertilizers and pesticide use, and reduced land use from building vertically. It's not just the attraction of the clean look, though that is part of the appeal, but there are real benefits.
- spurdoman77 7y ago
  I've understood transportation costs are less than 5% from the overall production cost/carbon footprint of vegetable production. So it really makes sense to transport veggies and fruits from far away if even minor benefits on other production steps can be achieved. Similarly also plastic packaging has minor footprint compared to the overall production of the vegetable. So, if the food waste is reduced even a little bit with plastic packaging, it is enviromentally better to wrap the veggies in plastic.
  - ses1984 7y ago
    Water management needs to be weighed against carbon footprint. It might be better to increase the carbon footprint slightly, reduce carbon footprint elsewhere, so that water can be managed smarter.
  - rtkwe 7y ago
    There's a lot more to the environmental impact of our current farming than just the CO2 though. Water run off is a big pollutant as farms have to spray way more fertilizer onto the ground in order to get the plants to grow than they strictly need, in a hydroponics system for example added nitrogen that doesn't get absorbed would just continue to cycle until it is. In a similar vein current farms' usage of herbicides and pesticides have huge impacts on the environment near and downstream of farms. An indoor farm would require low to no herbicide and pesticide use because the environment is contained and controlled, plus any use would be more easily contained reducing run-off again.
ajiang 7y ago
This is an oversimplification of why aeroponics or any form of hydroponics is great. A few of the most notable benefits: 1) Growing density - you use a lot less square footage by growing up! 2) Can grow anywhere - you control a ton of the variables due to setup indoors away from weather conditions, indoor lights, control of water and nutrients, etc. 3) The ability to very carefully fine tune the end product due to a large number of controllable inputs into the growing process (rather than spreading nutrients and water over large acres of land)
- antisthenes 7y ago
  > 1) Growing density - you use a lot less square footage by growing up! Yes, but all of that square footage is inside the building, which cost money to construct and operate, in addition to capital costs of constructing the multi-tiered farm and wiring it with LEDs > 2) Can grow anywhere Yes...anywhere...inside a heated building. Even if the LEDs used provide some degree of heating, some sort of HVAC to regulate temperatures must still be employed. I'd imagine you wouldn't use an unheated warehouse in Canada during winter. > 3) The ability to very carefully fine tune the end product due to a large number of controllable inputs into the growing process Probably the only real advantage. It also makes ramping up to demand somewhat easier, since the growth time is shorter. However, make no mistake - so far these are low calorie greens at a luxury price.
  - patall 7y ago
    If you built a house just for growing plants then yes. If I grow a few veggies in a green curtain at home in the kitchen window where I am not even there 90% of the daylight time, then no. Also, I am growing radish and salad in the attic right now where there is no extra heating or light so point 2 is also not necessarily true. The only thing I would agree on is that you will not cover more than 5% of your diet that way but it enough for covering the winter with some fresh stuff.
    - antisthenes 7y ago
      > If I grow a few veggies in a green curtain at home in the kitchen window where I am not even there 90% of the daylight time, then no. Smaller scales make the math worse, not better. > Also, I am growing radish and salad in the attic right now where there is no extra heating or light so point 2 is also not necessarily true. I'm assuming the attic is attached to a heated building of some sort? Not sure why you're trying so hard to come up with arguments for this hydroponic stuff. People are well aware of the advantages and it's mostly going to be used to grow high-value cash crops like spices (saffron?) and cannabis.

rtkwe 7y ago

Maybe but there's other theoretical benefits too; food grown closer to it's consumption point releases less CO2 being transported and could be fresher, reduced run off from fertilizers and pesticide use, and reduced land use from building vertically. It's not just the attraction of the clean look, though that is part of the appeal, but there are real benefits.

spurdoman77 7y ago
I've understood transportation costs are less than 5% from the overall production cost/carbon footprint of vegetable production. So it really makes sense to transport veggies and fruits from far away if even minor benefits on other production steps can be achieved. Similarly also plastic packaging has minor footprint compared to the overall production of the vegetable. So, if the food waste is reduced even a little bit with plastic packaging, it is enviromentally better to wrap the veggies in plastic.
- ses1984 7y ago
  Water management needs to be weighed against carbon footprint. It might be better to increase the carbon footprint slightly, reduce carbon footprint elsewhere, so that water can be managed smarter.
- rtkwe 7y ago
  There's a lot more to the environmental impact of our current farming than just the CO2 though. Water run off is a big pollutant as farms have to spray way more fertilizer onto the ground in order to get the plants to grow than they strictly need, in a hydroponics system for example added nitrogen that doesn't get absorbed would just continue to cycle until it is. In a similar vein current farms' usage of herbicides and pesticides have huge impacts on the environment near and downstream of farms. An indoor farm would require low to no herbicide and pesticide use because the environment is contained and controlled, plus any use would be more easily contained reducing run-off again.

ajiang 7y ago

This is an oversimplification of why aeroponics or any form of hydroponics is great. A few of the most notable benefits: 1) Growing density - you use a lot less square footage by growing up! 2) Can grow anywhere - you control a ton of the variables due to setup indoors away from weather conditions, indoor lights, control of water and nutrients, etc. 3) The ability to very carefully fine tune the end product due to a large number of controllable inputs into the growing process (rather than spreading nutrients and water over large acres of land)

antisthenes 7y ago
> 1) Growing density - you use a lot less square footage by growing up! Yes, but all of that square footage is inside the building, which cost money to construct and operate, in addition to capital costs of constructing the multi-tiered farm and wiring it with LEDs > 2) Can grow anywhere Yes...anywhere...inside a heated building. Even if the LEDs used provide some degree of heating, some sort of HVAC to regulate temperatures must still be employed. I'd imagine you wouldn't use an unheated warehouse in Canada during winter. > 3) The ability to very carefully fine tune the end product due to a large number of controllable inputs into the growing process Probably the only real advantage. It also makes ramping up to demand somewhat easier, since the growth time is shorter. However, make no mistake - so far these are low calorie greens at a luxury price.
- patall 7y ago
  If you built a house just for growing plants then yes. If I grow a few veggies in a green curtain at home in the kitchen window where I am not even there 90% of the daylight time, then no. Also, I am growing radish and salad in the attic right now where there is no extra heating or light so point 2 is also not necessarily true. The only thing I would agree on is that you will not cover more than 5% of your diet that way but it enough for covering the winter with some fresh stuff.
  - antisthenes 7y ago
    > If I grow a few veggies in a green curtain at home in the kitchen window where I am not even there 90% of the daylight time, then no. Smaller scales make the math worse, not better. > Also, I am growing radish and salad in the attic right now where there is no extra heating or light so point 2 is also not necessarily true. I'm assuming the attic is attached to a heated building of some sort? Not sure why you're trying so hard to come up with arguments for this hydroponic stuff. People are well aware of the advantages and it's mostly going to be used to grow high-value cash crops like spices (saffron?) and cannabis.