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I don't know why they felt they had to mess with OCaml's syntax - one of the nicest around AFAIC. With F#, even MS didn't feel like they had to add extra brace

I don't know why they felt they had to mess with OCaml's syntax - one of the nicest around AFAIC. With F#, even MS didn't feel like they had to add extra braces and other baggage and change keywords ("match" to "switch ()", etc.) to make C# programmers have an easier first ten minutes of transition time.

emmanueloga_ 7y ago
Are you referring to Reason? I don't see anything related to messing OCaml syntax in the OP.
- thelazydogsback 7y ago
  "Reason, also known as ReasonML, is a syntax extension and toolchain for OCaml created by Jordan Walke at Facebook.[2] Reason offers a syntax familiar to JavaScript programmers, and transpiles to OCaml.[3]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason_(syntax_extension_for_OCaml) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason_(syntax_extension_for_O...
  - emmanueloga_ 7y ago
    got it, I was just confused since usually top level comments refer to the original post, which in this case is a Textbook for OCaml that doesn't mention Reason anywhere afaict
    - thelazydogsback 7y ago
      Sorry, my bad - I meant to reply to @melling, not the top-level
nv-vn 7y ago
There's a few legitimate issues with OCaml syntax that have been fixed by Reason at least. E.g. `match`/`if` not having an `end` means you need to use parens or `begin`/`end` to nest match and have ; inside of an `if` body. There's also some ambiguity between functional `if` and imperative `if` in some situations.
- toastal 7y ago
  Despite that, Reason adds semicolons and braces to OCaml; presumably this was to make it have a more JavaScript aesthetic for on-boarding (ignoring JS's ASI)?
  - nine_k 7y ago
    Explicit opening and closing structures help locate and explain errors better. In an absence of an entirely obvious, unambiguous, commonly known way of formatting, it's helpful.
    - pjmlp 7y ago
      Because OCaml aware editors/IDE don't exist.
      - smabie 7y ago
        Merlin works really well in my experience for both ReasonML and OCaml. Also there's LSP support so OCaml/ReasonML have as much editor support as any other language.
        pjmlp 7y ago
        I was being sarcastic....
    - pyrale 7y ago
      I'm not sure to understand how it helps. Are you talking about parsing errors ? As for formatting, if you manage to get an AST, what would be made easier by braces ?
      - nine_k 7y ago
        Yes, parsing errors. In a number of cases you can legitimately continue to interpret a text well past the missing closing token, and signal an error in a place which does not seem related. If you already have a correct AST, you can render it whatever way you want.
jolux 7y ago
I think F# cleaned up a lot of OCaml’s syntactic oddities nicely, though I could do without the off-side rule.
- pjmlp 7y ago
  F# supports OCaml syntax as well, via a compiler pragma.
  - jolux 7y ago
    I’m aware. #light “off”
  - nikofeyn 7y ago
    f# has diverged away from ocaml enough that the small fact that a tiny subset of it is compatible with ocaml is just a trivia fact.
- adgasf 7y ago
  Agreed! and the approach to operator overloading is much more pragmatic.
yawaramin 7y ago
Well, with F# they did change some significant things e.g. type parameter syntax. Anyway, the point of Reason is that some people just won't even look at OCaml syntax. They just won't, that's the way it is. Reason allows us to onboard those people now, get them to see the benefits of the language, and perhaps later even come around to preferring the OCaml syntax.
smabie 7y ago
I think Haskell's or F#'s syntax is a lot better, OCaml has a lot of edge cases that require parens. OCaml is an old language and it really shows in the syntax. I personally think Reason's cleanup of strange parsing rules that OCaml has is a good step forward, though changing match to switch is kind of annoying, I must admit.

emmanueloga_ 7y ago

Are you referring to Reason? I don't see anything related to messing OCaml syntax in the OP.

thelazydogsback 7y ago
"Reason, also known as ReasonML, is a syntax extension and toolchain for OCaml created by Jordan Walke at Facebook.[2] Reason offers a syntax familiar to JavaScript programmers, and transpiles to OCaml.[3]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason_(syntax_extension_for_OCaml) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason_(syntax_extension_for_O...
- emmanueloga_ 7y ago
  got it, I was just confused since usually top level comments refer to the original post, which in this case is a Textbook for OCaml that doesn't mention Reason anywhere afaict
  - thelazydogsback 7y ago
    Sorry, my bad - I meant to reply to @melling, not the top-level

nv-vn 7y ago

There's a few legitimate issues with OCaml syntax that have been fixed by Reason at least. E.g. `match`/`if` not having an `end` means you need to use parens or `begin`/`end` to nest match and have ; inside of an `if` body. There's also some ambiguity between functional `if` and imperative `if` in some situations.

toastal 7y ago
Despite that, Reason adds semicolons and braces to OCaml; presumably this was to make it have a more JavaScript aesthetic for on-boarding (ignoring JS's ASI)?
- nine_k 7y ago
  Explicit opening and closing structures help locate and explain errors better. In an absence of an entirely obvious, unambiguous, commonly known way of formatting, it's helpful.
  - pjmlp 7y ago
    Because OCaml aware editors/IDE don't exist.
    - smabie 7y ago
      Merlin works really well in my experience for both ReasonML and OCaml. Also there's LSP support so OCaml/ReasonML have as much editor support as any other language.
      - pjmlp 7y ago
        I was being sarcastic....
  - pyrale 7y ago
    I'm not sure to understand how it helps. Are you talking about parsing errors ? As for formatting, if you manage to get an AST, what would be made easier by braces ?
    - nine_k 7y ago
      Yes, parsing errors. In a number of cases you can legitimately continue to interpret a text well past the missing closing token, and signal an error in a place which does not seem related. If you already have a correct AST, you can render it whatever way you want.

jolux 7y ago

I think F# cleaned up a lot of OCaml’s syntactic oddities nicely, though I could do without the off-side rule.

pjmlp 7y ago
F# supports OCaml syntax as well, via a compiler pragma.
- jolux 7y ago
  I’m aware. #light “off”
- nikofeyn 7y ago
  f# has diverged away from ocaml enough that the small fact that a tiny subset of it is compatible with ocaml is just a trivia fact.
adgasf 7y ago
Agreed! and the approach to operator overloading is much more pragmatic.

yawaramin 7y ago

Well, with F# they did change some significant things e.g. type parameter syntax. Anyway, the point of Reason is that some people just won't even look at OCaml syntax. They just won't, that's the way it is. Reason allows us to onboard those people now, get them to see the benefits of the language, and perhaps later even come around to preferring the OCaml syntax.

smabie 7y ago

I think Haskell's or F#'s syntax is a lot better, OCaml has a lot of edge cases that require parens. OCaml is an old language and it really shows in the syntax. I personally think Reason's cleanup of strange parsing rules that OCaml has is a good step forward, though changing match to switch is kind of annoying, I must admit.