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People also thought flight was impossible. In this case, the 'construct' is the morphological traits that distinguish men from women. That's what our brains u

People also thought flight was impossible. In this case, the 'construct' is the morphological traits that distinguish men from women. That's what our brains use to differentiate men from women -- chromosomes are irrelevant here. We don't need to replicate sex at a molecular level -- if someone is indiscernible from a women without inspecting their molecular structure they are for all practical purposes a woman. A far cry from changing a fly into a banana, as much as you may wish it were so.

apta 7y ago
They're two very different things. Flight is obviously possible because the inherent laws of physics allow it, and we observed other creatures do it. How are you going to take a grown man, whose physical traits are obviously different from a woman (broader shoulders, taller, more muscle mass, deep voice, not to mention his reproductive system, and other documented differences in other organs), and turn him into a woman? This is physically impossible and is akin to changing a banana into a fly. > if someone is indiscernible from a women without inspecting their molecular structure they are for all practical purposes a woman And physics and biology would still disagree with you. This warping of reality to fit some unscientific narrative is getting out of hand.
- streb-lo 7y ago
  > How are you going to take a grown man, whose physical traits are obviously different from a woman (broader shoulders, taller, more muscle mass, deep voice, not to mention his reproductive system, and other documented differences in other organs), and turn him into a woman? This is physically impossible and is akin to changing a banana into a fly. Well, the spectrum of bone sizes / muscle mass do have crossovers between the sexes. Obviously you're not going to turn a 6'5'' 300lb man into a believable woman but if that same man starts to transition at 16? Who knows. And there are plenty of people who are well within the size parameters of the opposing sex even in adulthood. > And physics and biology would still disagree with you. This warping of reality to fit some unscientific narrative is getting out of hand. Disagree with what? I said for all practical purposes. Sure, you could in theory make a biological and physical distinction -- it just won't be relevant to 99% of people if the difference is not available to them. Does a multi-platform software user care if he's running the ARM or x86 binary? They are two vastly different beasts but if the compilers work the user has no distinction. > They're two very different things. Flight is obviously possible because the inherent laws of physics allow it, and we observed other creatures do it. You are missing the big picture. What we view as physically possible now will change, as it always has throughout history. Space travel used to be 'physically impossible', heck so did circumnavigating the world. We will eventually reverse engineer our brain structure -- downloading our consciousness might be feasible one day. Do you think people will care about XY chromosomes when they can swap bodies? Or in a world that heavily uses VR?
  - apta 7y ago
    > Obviously you're not going to turn a 6'5'' 300lb man into a believable woman So now there's a notion of "believable" and "unbelievable" changing of men into women? That kind of completely brings down this entire house of cards now doesn't it? Think of it from another way. If there's an earthquake and a man pretending to be a woman dies in the rubble, and they discover his remains 50 years from now, do you honestly think that they'll classify him as female? His skeletal structure is masculine, and no amount of pretending or hormones or surgery is going to change it.
    - streb-lo 7y ago
      > So now there's a notion of "believable" and "unbelievable" changing of men into women? That kind of completely brings down this entire house of cards now doesn't it? How so? > Think of it from another way. If there's an earthquake and a man pretending to be a woman dies in the rubble, and they discover his remains 50 years from now, do you honestly think that they'll classify him as female? His skeletal structure is masculine, and no amount of pretending or hormones or surgery is going to change it. You're too hung up on the 'essence' of someone. It's not relevant in any practical way. If someone told you your spouse had a different set of chromosomes would you suddenly stop loving them?
- DavidVoid 7y ago
  > And physics and biology would still disagree with you. This warping of reality to fit some unscientific narrative is getting out of hand. You seem to be completely ignoring the generally agreed-upon scientific consensus that gender and sex are not equivalent; sex is biology, and gender is mostly performance. A transwoman is a woman (gender) even though they're biologically male (sex).
  - apta 7y ago
    The agreed upon science is that gender dysphoria is a mental issue. No more than a man thinking that he's a dog, he'd be classified as insane. There can be studies into why some people have this condition, perhaps it could be due to environmental or upbringing reasons, but the solution is not to expect others to dissociate from reality and pretend that that person is the sex he "wants to identify with". It's no different from asking others to treat that person like a dog if he feels like it.

apta 7y ago

They're two very different things. Flight is obviously possible because the inherent laws of physics allow it, and we observed other creatures do it. How are you going to take a grown man, whose physical traits are obviously different from a woman (broader shoulders, taller, more muscle mass, deep voice, not to mention his reproductive system, and other documented differences in other organs), and turn him into a woman? This is physically impossible and is akin to changing a banana into a fly. > if someone is indiscernible from a women without inspecting their molecular structure they are for all practical purposes a woman And physics and biology would still disagree with you. This warping of reality to fit some unscientific narrative is getting out of hand.

streb-lo 7y ago
> How are you going to take a grown man, whose physical traits are obviously different from a woman (broader shoulders, taller, more muscle mass, deep voice, not to mention his reproductive system, and other documented differences in other organs), and turn him into a woman? This is physically impossible and is akin to changing a banana into a fly. Well, the spectrum of bone sizes / muscle mass do have crossovers between the sexes. Obviously you're not going to turn a 6'5'' 300lb man into a believable woman but if that same man starts to transition at 16? Who knows. And there are plenty of people who are well within the size parameters of the opposing sex even in adulthood. > And physics and biology would still disagree with you. This warping of reality to fit some unscientific narrative is getting out of hand. Disagree with what? I said for all practical purposes. Sure, you could in theory make a biological and physical distinction -- it just won't be relevant to 99% of people if the difference is not available to them. Does a multi-platform software user care if he's running the ARM or x86 binary? They are two vastly different beasts but if the compilers work the user has no distinction. > They're two very different things. Flight is obviously possible because the inherent laws of physics allow it, and we observed other creatures do it. You are missing the big picture. What we view as physically possible now will change, as it always has throughout history. Space travel used to be 'physically impossible', heck so did circumnavigating the world. We will eventually reverse engineer our brain structure -- downloading our consciousness might be feasible one day. Do you think people will care about XY chromosomes when they can swap bodies? Or in a world that heavily uses VR?
- apta 7y ago
  > Obviously you're not going to turn a 6'5'' 300lb man into a believable woman So now there's a notion of "believable" and "unbelievable" changing of men into women? That kind of completely brings down this entire house of cards now doesn't it? Think of it from another way. If there's an earthquake and a man pretending to be a woman dies in the rubble, and they discover his remains 50 years from now, do you honestly think that they'll classify him as female? His skeletal structure is masculine, and no amount of pretending or hormones or surgery is going to change it.
  - streb-lo 7y ago
    > So now there's a notion of "believable" and "unbelievable" changing of men into women? That kind of completely brings down this entire house of cards now doesn't it? How so? > Think of it from another way. If there's an earthquake and a man pretending to be a woman dies in the rubble, and they discover his remains 50 years from now, do you honestly think that they'll classify him as female? His skeletal structure is masculine, and no amount of pretending or hormones or surgery is going to change it. You're too hung up on the 'essence' of someone. It's not relevant in any practical way. If someone told you your spouse had a different set of chromosomes would you suddenly stop loving them?
DavidVoid 7y ago
> And physics and biology would still disagree with you. This warping of reality to fit some unscientific narrative is getting out of hand. You seem to be completely ignoring the generally agreed-upon scientific consensus that gender and sex are not equivalent; sex is biology, and gender is mostly performance. A transwoman is a woman (gender) even though they're biologically male (sex).
- apta 7y ago
  The agreed upon science is that gender dysphoria is a mental issue. No more than a man thinking that he's a dog, he'd be classified as insane. There can be studies into why some people have this condition, perhaps it could be due to environmental or upbringing reasons, but the solution is not to expect others to dissociate from reality and pretend that that person is the sex he "wants to identify with". It's no different from asking others to treat that person like a dog if he feels like it.