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Retirement age in Greece is today and was in 2011 higher than in Germany. Using some anecdotes and guess for aggregate data is bad induction. "privatize" means

Retirement age in Greece is today and was in 2011 higher than in Germany. Using some anecdotes and guess for aggregate data is bad induction. "privatize" means that today all the Greek airports are owned by German companies. Is it legit to suppose there was a slight conflict of interest between the "doctor" and the "patient"? I mean, would you trust your doctor if he gains on your death?

tasubotadas 7y ago
Really? "Like many EU countries, the general retirement age in Greece is 65, although the actual average is about 61. However, the deeply fragmented system also provides for early retirement – as early as 55 for men and 50 for women – in many professions classified as unhealthy." 55 and 50! https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/greece-to-call-time-on-cushy-pension-deals-for-unhealthy-jobs-1978789.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/greece-to-ca...
- leto_ii 7y ago
  Conveniently, Greece is just below Germany in the table, making for easy comparison: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retirement_age#Retirement_age_by_country_and_region https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retirement_age#Retirement_age_... Regarding early retirement, I'm sure this is the case in many "industrious" countries too. You probably don't want 65 year olds running around in combat boots with a machine gun and 20kg of supplies on their back.
  - kriberg 7y ago
    But Germany would afford a low retirement age, while Greece could not. It is an unfair comparison, as not all other facts are equal.
- lucianoq 7y ago
  Average in 2011 was 61,9 yo for Greece and 61,5 yo for Germany. This is an average between all the jobs, classified unhealthy and not. But although it was less than Germany, let's say 60 or 59 or even 55: 1) lenders knew it, so it's also their fault on not weighting the risk well or not asking for an higher interest rate or avoiding giving them money at all. To check is their responsibility. 2) IMF decisions brought an increase in suicide rate and children mortality rate. Are the lenders allowed to bring death to the borrowers? Is this illegal for the mafia but allowed for IMF/ECB/EC?
  - champagneben 7y ago
    > 2) IMF decisions brought an increase in suicide rate and children mortality rate. Are the lenders allowed to bring death to the borrowers? Is this illegal for the mafia but allowed for IMF/ECB/EC? How does one make this claim? What would the alternative have looked like? It's not like the IMF just decided to tank a healthy economy.
- claudiawerner 7y ago
  A low retirement age is a good thing; it is a symbol that society does not prize labour just as much as it appears to. It is an affirmation that we work to live, not live to work.

tasubotadas 7y ago

Really? "Like many EU countries, the general retirement age in Greece is 65, although the actual average is about 61. However, the deeply fragmented system also provides for early retirement – as early as 55 for men and 50 for women – in many professions classified as unhealthy." 55 and 50! https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/greece-to-call-time-on-cushy-pension-deals-for-unhealthy-jobs-1978789.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/greece-to-ca...

leto_ii 7y ago
Conveniently, Greece is just below Germany in the table, making for easy comparison: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retirement_age#Retirement_age_by_country_and_region https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retirement_age#Retirement_age_... Regarding early retirement, I'm sure this is the case in many "industrious" countries too. You probably don't want 65 year olds running around in combat boots with a machine gun and 20kg of supplies on their back.
- kriberg 7y ago
  But Germany would afford a low retirement age, while Greece could not. It is an unfair comparison, as not all other facts are equal.
lucianoq 7y ago
Average in 2011 was 61,9 yo for Greece and 61,5 yo for Germany. This is an average between all the jobs, classified unhealthy and not. But although it was less than Germany, let's say 60 or 59 or even 55: 1) lenders knew it, so it's also their fault on not weighting the risk well or not asking for an higher interest rate or avoiding giving them money at all. To check is their responsibility. 2) IMF decisions brought an increase in suicide rate and children mortality rate. Are the lenders allowed to bring death to the borrowers? Is this illegal for the mafia but allowed for IMF/ECB/EC?
- champagneben 7y ago
  > 2) IMF decisions brought an increase in suicide rate and children mortality rate. Are the lenders allowed to bring death to the borrowers? Is this illegal for the mafia but allowed for IMF/ECB/EC? How does one make this claim? What would the alternative have looked like? It's not like the IMF just decided to tank a healthy economy.
claudiawerner 7y ago
A low retirement age is a good thing; it is a symbol that society does not prize labour just as much as it appears to. It is an affirmation that we work to live, not live to work.