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I use a mix of Windows 7 and *nix OSes both at home and work. At work we do have some Win10 machines, and they are ALWAYS doing something completely off the wa

I use a mix of Windows 7 and *nix OSes both at home and work. At work we do have some Win10 machines, and they are ALWAYS doing something completely off the wall bizarre and unexpected, also doing any sort of maintenance on them is a pain, the tablet-style interface shoehorned into some places just doesn't work well. I know Win7 support is over, but we don't intend to leave it for Win10, we might leave it for Reactos or something else, but not Win10. Some examples of Win10 issues: sending tons of data to MS without permission. Not allowing us to install with local account unless we disable network on the EFI. Despite we trying everything to disable updates, the thing updates itself, reset several configurations, and reboot the machine. One of the times it did that, it broke some ancient but mandatory software on our business (it was a PDF driver that was mandatory to be used by our bank that would issue the invoice for our clients, so when this happened we were forced to install all banking software on a Win7 machien so we could get paid...). Showing ads out of the blue on Start menu and on the login screen. Installed games without permission (not Microsoft ones, I mean stuff that is popular on mobile, from king.com and whatnot). The list goes and goes on.

Wowfunhappy 7y ago
Has your business looked into using Windows 10 LTSB/LTSC?
- milankragujevic 7y ago
  Latest LTSC (Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC 2019) has some of the problems described.
  - Wowfunhappy 7y ago
    It has a couple but lacks many others. You'll never have critical software break in an update on LTSC. And equally critical, on LTSC you can go down the customization route to fix the other issues, and not have your settings just get reset in an update.
corey_moncure 7y ago
>Despite we trying everything to disable updates, the thing updates itself, reset several configurations, and reboot the machine. I too had tried all the tricks, including using a remote Powershell into my own local machine as the System role to change ownership of the Update "Orchestrator" and disable it, etc., nothing worked and Windows finds a way to revert all the settings you make. Then I discovered an open source utility written in C# that works with Windows' own internal Windows Update API to disable its shenanigans. Search for "wumgr". You can disable the automatic updates, block access to the WU servers, and even disable the WU page in the Settings app. You can also use it to manage the updates manually and selectively if you prefer. So far it has worked flawlessly on my machines and hopefully it will work for you as well. There are many many reasons why not being in control of OS updates is a bad thing, but the absolute red line for me is having my laptop wake itself up inside of my bag while I'm traveling, potentially creating a fire hazard and certainly draining the battery life my career may be about to depend on during an important presentation, or create incompatibility issues.
- datashow 7y ago
  My workplace hosts its own Windows update server, so they have total control of Windows updates.
gnu8 7y ago
I hate all of the same things you do about Windows 10, but many of these misfeatures can be turned off at work. For example, there is a consumer experience policy setting that disables the start menu ads and auto installed games, but the setting is only effective on enterprise versions of Windows.
dr-detroit 7y ago
With all due respect you are ignorant. You really think other people with Win10 professionally managed have your problems? Is your problem the OS or the fact that it wont let you run it unmanaged? How do your customers feel about security?
PeterStuer 7y ago
windows 7 was the last time windows had a desktop centric UI. ever since 8 they have tried to shoehorn the desktop into some limited mobile UX. Windows 8 was the worst. They besically just threw the desktop user under the bus as they expected they could do whatever on the desktop and the users would have to follow, and so create a path of familiarity leading them to their mobile UX. We all know how that turned out. 10 Is still a remnant from that. I doubt they will ever backtrack fully as they want to get in on those juicy 'store' margins by any means necessary, and with the full demise of their mobile platform grabbing the desktop users is the only remaining path.
- pathartl 7y ago
  I highly disagree, and I think Windows 10 is actually one of the most desktop-oriented UI's ever. Some things might be touch optimized for when you use devices like a Surface, but on a day to day basis I don't feel like I'm using something that hasn't been designed for desktop. Improvements to the task bar for things like switching audio devices and condensing of the ribbons on Explorer have been huge for me. Most people are quick to point out how control panel has been bastardized and such, but honestly I love the move towards a unified "Settings" area. Not everything has made it over, but slowly with each update more and more is added. Tbh, I absolutely loathe control panel from <=Win7. Trying to find something is always difficult and there's no unified layout to any of the .cpl applets. Windows 8/8.1 was terrible because it forced you to use this stupid full screen start menu. It was distracting and slow and pretty damn ugly when you start looking at icons for programs that haven't been updated in 20 years. All that has been scaled back and while ads on the start menu are not something that should be glossed over (they _are_ absolutely terrible, and Microsoft deserves to be shit talked), it's still the best start menu interface I've seen. Honestly if you want an example of a terrible desktop user interface / experience, look no further than macOS. With each update they seem to move more towards an iOS model of a walled garden. What really perplexes me is Apple doesn't seem to give two damns about a touch interface on their OS, and yet they're moving all of their design to be more mobile-centric with things like Launchpad or the absolute lobotomy of iTunes.
maram 7y ago
>>At work we do have some Win10 machines, and they are ALWAYS doing something completely off the wall bizarre and unexpected Like linking Skype accounts to hotmail accounts without permission... Once upon a time, not too long ago..it was Apple who did things without permission, but at least they had Steve Jobs.. now it’s everybody, without Steve Jobs. It’s Microsoft, Apple, Google, Facebook...it’s the culture of companies from the valley. But all this, is just another opportunity for a new software company. Their arrogance and recklessness is someone else’s opportunity.
kdrag0n 7y ago
> Despite we trying everything to disable updates, the thing updates itself, reset several configurations, and reboot the machine. There's actually a permanent fix for this that I found on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/aavocr/after_6_months_of_testing_this_in_my_company_i/ https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/aavocr/after_6_mo... I've been using it for years and have never once gotten a notification or nag screen about updates. You can still update whenever you want — no rebooting behind your back. The best part is that it's only one registry key which (ab)uses a Windows feature unrelated to Windows Update, so it's highly unlikely that they'll "fix" it any time soon.
- Wowfunhappy 7y ago
  Does good old: [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate\AU] "NoAutoUpdate"=dword:00000001 ...not work anymore on Windows 10 Pro? It works on 1807 LTSC.
  - kdrag0n 7y ago
    Not sure, I haven't actually tried other methods because I've always heard that they were unreliable or got "fixed" in later versions — never had to worry about the other one ceasing to work in the future.
    - Wowfunhappy 7y ago
      Well, for whatever it's worth, that registry setting has worked for me for years, across three different versions of LTSC. And it also happens to be the "official" Microsoft way to disable updates.

Wowfunhappy 7y ago

Has your business looked into using Windows 10 LTSB/LTSC?

milankragujevic 7y ago
Latest LTSC (Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC 2019) has some of the problems described.
- Wowfunhappy 7y ago
  It has a couple but lacks many others. You'll never have critical software break in an update on LTSC. And equally critical, on LTSC you can go down the customization route to fix the other issues, and not have your settings just get reset in an update.

corey_moncure 7y ago

>Despite we trying everything to disable updates, the thing updates itself, reset several configurations, and reboot the machine. I too had tried all the tricks, including using a remote Powershell into my own local machine as the System role to change ownership of the Update "Orchestrator" and disable it, etc., nothing worked and Windows finds a way to revert all the settings you make. Then I discovered an open source utility written in C# that works with Windows' own internal Windows Update API to disable its shenanigans. Search for "wumgr". You can disable the automatic updates, block access to the WU servers, and even disable the WU page in the Settings app. You can also use it to manage the updates manually and selectively if you prefer. So far it has worked flawlessly on my machines and hopefully it will work for you as well. There are many many reasons why not being in control of OS updates is a bad thing, but the absolute red line for me is having my laptop wake itself up inside of my bag while I'm traveling, potentially creating a fire hazard and certainly draining the battery life my career may be about to depend on during an important presentation, or create incompatibility issues.

datashow 7y ago
My workplace hosts its own Windows update server, so they have total control of Windows updates.

gnu8 7y ago

I hate all of the same things you do about Windows 10, but many of these misfeatures can be turned off at work. For example, there is a consumer experience policy setting that disables the start menu ads and auto installed games, but the setting is only effective on enterprise versions of Windows.

dr-detroit 7y ago

With all due respect you are ignorant. You really think other people with Win10 professionally managed have your problems? Is your problem the OS or the fact that it wont let you run it unmanaged? How do your customers feel about security?

PeterStuer 7y ago

windows 7 was the last time windows had a desktop centric UI. ever since 8 they have tried to shoehorn the desktop into some limited mobile UX. Windows 8 was the worst. They besically just threw the desktop user under the bus as they expected they could do whatever on the desktop and the users would have to follow, and so create a path of familiarity leading them to their mobile UX. We all know how that turned out. 10 Is still a remnant from that. I doubt they will ever backtrack fully as they want to get in on those juicy 'store' margins by any means necessary, and with the full demise of their mobile platform grabbing the desktop users is the only remaining path.

pathartl 7y ago
I highly disagree, and I think Windows 10 is actually one of the most desktop-oriented UI's ever. Some things might be touch optimized for when you use devices like a Surface, but on a day to day basis I don't feel like I'm using something that hasn't been designed for desktop. Improvements to the task bar for things like switching audio devices and condensing of the ribbons on Explorer have been huge for me. Most people are quick to point out how control panel has been bastardized and such, but honestly I love the move towards a unified "Settings" area. Not everything has made it over, but slowly with each update more and more is added. Tbh, I absolutely loathe control panel from <=Win7. Trying to find something is always difficult and there's no unified layout to any of the .cpl applets. Windows 8/8.1 was terrible because it forced you to use this stupid full screen start menu. It was distracting and slow and pretty damn ugly when you start looking at icons for programs that haven't been updated in 20 years. All that has been scaled back and while ads on the start menu are not something that should be glossed over (they _are_ absolutely terrible, and Microsoft deserves to be shit talked), it's still the best start menu interface I've seen. Honestly if you want an example of a terrible desktop user interface / experience, look no further than macOS. With each update they seem to move more towards an iOS model of a walled garden. What really perplexes me is Apple doesn't seem to give two damns about a touch interface on their OS, and yet they're moving all of their design to be more mobile-centric with things like Launchpad or the absolute lobotomy of iTunes.

maram 7y ago

>>At work we do have some Win10 machines, and they are ALWAYS doing something completely off the wall bizarre and unexpected Like linking Skype accounts to hotmail accounts without permission... Once upon a time, not too long ago..it was Apple who did things without permission, but at least they had Steve Jobs.. now it’s everybody, without Steve Jobs. It’s Microsoft, Apple, Google, Facebook...it’s the culture of companies from the valley. But all this, is just another opportunity for a new software company. Their arrogance and recklessness is someone else’s opportunity.

kdrag0n 7y ago

> Despite we trying everything to disable updates, the thing updates itself, reset several configurations, and reboot the machine. There's actually a permanent fix for this that I found on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/aavocr/after_6_months_of_testing_this_in_my_company_i/ https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/aavocr/after_6_mo... I've been using it for years and have never once gotten a notification or nag screen about updates. You can still update whenever you want — no rebooting behind your back. The best part is that it's only one registry key which (ab)uses a Windows feature unrelated to Windows Update, so it's highly unlikely that they'll "fix" it any time soon.

Wowfunhappy 7y ago
Does good old: [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate\AU] "NoAutoUpdate"=dword:00000001 ...not work anymore on Windows 10 Pro? It works on 1807 LTSC.
- kdrag0n 7y ago
  Not sure, I haven't actually tried other methods because I've always heard that they were unreliable or got "fixed" in later versions — never had to worry about the other one ceasing to work in the future.
  - Wowfunhappy 7y ago
    Well, for whatever it's worth, that registry setting has worked for me for years, across three different versions of LTSC. And it also happens to be the "official" Microsoft way to disable updates.