3 ms·

Households don't need to expend wages. Ever heard of savings? People in 1985 BCE were consuming baskets of goods akin to us in 2020. The entire CPI metric is e

Households don't need to expend wages. Ever heard of savings? People in 1985 BCE were consuming baskets of goods akin to us in 2020. The entire CPI metric is extremely sensitive to both the extremely narrow size of the basket and also to the relatively short period of time on which the metric has been measured. Go buy a burger. Tell me it's not more expensive than it used to be. But ask the burger-flipper and he'll tell you that he has the same rule of thumb, 3x or 3.5x or 4x the cost of the raw ingredients, rounded up, as he did a decade ago or two decades ago. I have had slices of pizza at the same place as my father, at the same hole-in-the-wall pizzeria that he ate at when he was at university in the 70s. That same slice of pizza hasn't changed in quality, but it certainly costs quite a bit more than it used to. All that cost-disease theory can tell us is that we're paying the employees more. Good work on your cherry-picking for housing numbers. After adjusting for the bubble, though, with a chart like [0], we see that home prices still climbed about 50%, by your own numbers from the Census, and that's just from the 90s. You wanna know what hasn't gone up? Minimum wage [1]. We aren't putting cash into peoples' hands, and that is what is squeezing them the worst. > The minimum wage would be $11 in 2016 if its real value had remained at the 1968 level. Healthcare costs are driven by the existence of HMOs and their protected status under federal law. If you want healthcare costs to stop ballooning, undo the 1973 HMO Act; if you want healthcare to be affordable, get on Bernie's bus and support Medicare For All. To hear your "story of the incredible consumer growth" one would think that you've never actually seen the crushing poverty that grips so many folks in the USA. We are not in a healthier economy than we were in the 80s, let alone the 60s. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home-ownership_in_the_United_States#/media/File:Home_Ownership_rate.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home-ownership_in_the_United_S... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_in_the_United_Sta...

dcolkitt 7y ago
> Go buy a burger. Tell me it's not more expensive than it used to be. In 1985 the standard McDonalds burger was $0.50 in nominal terms. Today it's $1.00[1]. Over the same period nominal median household incomes has grown by 173%. Therefore hamburgers have become 37% more affordable to the median household since 1985. > You wanna know what hasn't gone up? Minimum wage Only 2.3% of hourly workers (and essentially 0% of salaried workers) earned minimum wage in 2017. In contrast in 1979, 13.4% of workers earned minimum wage.[3] Whether to raise or not raising minimum wages is a separate debate. And it may tell us something about the lowest income earners, like teenagers or felons. But trends in minimum wage tell us virtually nothing about "typical households", because virtually all working households earn more than minimum wage. > Healthcare costs are driven by the existence of HMOs and their protected status under federal law. This seems an extremely dubious assertion given that fewer than one in five private health insurance plans are HMOs.[4] And that number continues to shrink every year. [1] https://www.insider.com/fast-food-burgers-cost-every-year-2018-9#first-a-note-about-relative-burger-sizes-1 https://www.insider.com/fast-food-burgers-cost-every-year-20... [2] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N [3] https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm [4] https://www.bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-4/mobile/understanding_health_plan_types.htm4/mobile/understanding_health_plan_types.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-4/mobile/understanding_h...
- lidHanteyk 7y ago
  Not McDonald's, but a burger. Real food from a real restaurant. I'm not being facetious or (especially) anti-corporate here: McDonald's vertically integrates and owns their supply chain, meaning that they don't actually have to pay market prices for their food. In fact, it's worse than that; their actions in the food market are so massive that they distort prices for everybody else [0]. To pick a local burger chain: Burgerville opened in 1961 in Vancouver, WA. Their cheapest burger was 19¢, and the "Colossal" burger was 39¢ [1]. Today their cheapest is the "Original", at $1.75, and the "Colossal" is still on the menu but is now $3.99 [2]. And if I look at your sources, but look at Wendy's or Burger King, then suddenly the same price increases manifest. So McDonald's really is an outlier, as might be expected from the second-largest employer in the world [3]. The reason why "only 2.3% of hourly workers earned [federal] minimum wage in 2017" is because of my editorial addition; most workers in the USA are covered by better state-level minimum wage laws. If we spend a few minutes totalling up the number of folks who live in areas where they are effectively covered by federal minimum wage [4][5]... I get that about 40.0874% of the country is either covered by federal minimum wage, or by state minimum wage which is coincidentally the same. These folks rely upon the federal minimum wage to climb, when it hasn't been climbing. Applying Bayes' rule, and using the newer number of 2.1% from [6], I get about 2.8mil people who live in situations, either as employees or as dependents, where federal minimum wage is the only thing keeping them going. (I was going to say "out of poverty", but of course that's not true.) Improvements to either the state or federal minimum wages would improve their lives. Worse, I get that about 7.4201% of the country is only covered by federal minimum wage. I would expect that these folks are disproportionately earning federal minimum wage, because if one doesn't live in these areas, then one cannot earn such low wages. Applying Bayes again, that's only about 517k people. These folks are genuinely marginalized; see American Samoa for a good microcosm of the difficulties involved in getting folks paid decent wages [7]. The conclusion I draw isn't that people are doing so well that the federal minimum wage is increasingly useless; instead, I think that the federal minimum wage has been neglected for so long that people are either changing local laws, or moving to places where the laws have been changed for the better. [0] https://www.theawl.com/2011/11/a-conspiracy-of-hogs-the-mcrib-as-arbitrage/ https://www.theawl.com/2011/11/a-conspiracy-of-hogs-the-mcri... [1] https://www.historylink.org/File/8792 https://www.historylink.org/File/8792 [2] https://thefoodxp.com/burgerville-menu-prices/ https://thefoodxp.com/burgerville-menu-prices/ or just go into Burgerville and see for yourself [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald%27s https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald%27s [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_and_territories_of_the_United_States_by_population https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_and_territories... [5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_in_the_United_States#/media/File:US_minimum_wage_map.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_in_the_United_Sta... [6] https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2018/home.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2018/home.htm [7] https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/american-samoa https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/american...

dcolkitt 7y ago

> Go buy a burger. Tell me it's not more expensive than it used to be. In 1985 the standard McDonalds burger was $0.50 in nominal terms. Today it's $1.00[1]. Over the same period nominal median household incomes has grown by 173%. Therefore hamburgers have become 37% more affordable to the median household since 1985. > You wanna know what hasn't gone up? Minimum wage Only 2.3% of hourly workers (and essentially 0% of salaried workers) earned minimum wage in 2017. In contrast in 1979, 13.4% of workers earned minimum wage.[3] Whether to raise or not raising minimum wages is a separate debate. And it may tell us something about the lowest income earners, like teenagers or felons. But trends in minimum wage tell us virtually nothing about "typical households", because virtually all working households earn more than minimum wage. > Healthcare costs are driven by the existence of HMOs and their protected status under federal law. This seems an extremely dubious assertion given that fewer than one in five private health insurance plans are HMOs.[4] And that number continues to shrink every year. [1] https://www.insider.com/fast-food-burgers-cost-every-year-2018-9#first-a-note-about-relative-burger-sizes-1 https://www.insider.com/fast-food-burgers-cost-every-year-20... [2] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N [3] https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm [4] https://www.bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-4/mobile/understanding_health_plan_types.htm4/mobile/understanding_health_plan_types.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-4/mobile/understanding_h...

lidHanteyk 7y ago
Not McDonald's, but a burger. Real food from a real restaurant. I'm not being facetious or (especially) anti-corporate here: McDonald's vertically integrates and owns their supply chain, meaning that they don't actually have to pay market prices for their food. In fact, it's worse than that; their actions in the food market are so massive that they distort prices for everybody else [0]. To pick a local burger chain: Burgerville opened in 1961 in Vancouver, WA. Their cheapest burger was 19¢, and the "Colossal" burger was 39¢ [1]. Today their cheapest is the "Original", at $1.75, and the "Colossal" is still on the menu but is now $3.99 [2]. And if I look at your sources, but look at Wendy's or Burger King, then suddenly the same price increases manifest. So McDonald's really is an outlier, as might be expected from the second-largest employer in the world [3]. The reason why "only 2.3% of hourly workers earned [federal] minimum wage in 2017" is because of my editorial addition; most workers in the USA are covered by better state-level minimum wage laws. If we spend a few minutes totalling up the number of folks who live in areas where they are effectively covered by federal minimum wage [4][5]... I get that about 40.0874% of the country is either covered by federal minimum wage, or by state minimum wage which is coincidentally the same. These folks rely upon the federal minimum wage to climb, when it hasn't been climbing. Applying Bayes' rule, and using the newer number of 2.1% from [6], I get about 2.8mil people who live in situations, either as employees or as dependents, where federal minimum wage is the only thing keeping them going. (I was going to say "out of poverty", but of course that's not true.) Improvements to either the state or federal minimum wages would improve their lives. Worse, I get that about 7.4201% of the country is only covered by federal minimum wage. I would expect that these folks are disproportionately earning federal minimum wage, because if one doesn't live in these areas, then one cannot earn such low wages. Applying Bayes again, that's only about 517k people. These folks are genuinely marginalized; see American Samoa for a good microcosm of the difficulties involved in getting folks paid decent wages [7]. The conclusion I draw isn't that people are doing so well that the federal minimum wage is increasingly useless; instead, I think that the federal minimum wage has been neglected for so long that people are either changing local laws, or moving to places where the laws have been changed for the better. [0] https://www.theawl.com/2011/11/a-conspiracy-of-hogs-the-mcrib-as-arbitrage/ https://www.theawl.com/2011/11/a-conspiracy-of-hogs-the-mcri... [1] https://www.historylink.org/File/8792 https://www.historylink.org/File/8792 [2] https://thefoodxp.com/burgerville-menu-prices/ https://thefoodxp.com/burgerville-menu-prices/ or just go into Burgerville and see for yourself [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald%27s https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald%27s [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_and_territories_of_the_United_States_by_population https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_and_territories... [5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_in_the_United_States#/media/File:US_minimum_wage_map.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_in_the_United_Sta... [6] https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2018/home.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2018/home.htm [7] https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/american-samoa https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/american...