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It's difficult for me to predict our response in every possible hypothetical circumstance, so I'm promising what I feel we can actually promise: a human who car

It's difficult for me to predict our response in every possible hypothetical circumstance, so I'm promising what I feel we can actually promise: a human who cares about your success will review the circumstances and make a judgment call.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
joecool1029 7y ago
Translation: Come to HN with your problems and you'll get the VIP treatment while there's a spotlight on the company. Attempting to find an answer as an outsider lead me to this PR release from last year: https://stripe.com/newsroom/news/chargeback-protection https://stripe.com/newsroom/news/chargeback-protection < It makes me assume that if the merchant wasn't paying that extra fee they are going to be slammed.
- commoner 7y ago
  I don't think that press release is applicable, since no chargebacks are involved here. According to Stripe's documentation (see submitted link), the merchant must still pay the 2.9% + $0.30 processing fee for each refunded transaction, unless Stripe's customer service representatives waive the fees as an exception. But there is an issue with this euphemism in the parent comment: > a human who cares about your success If Stripe "cares about your success", Stripe would return the processing fee on all refunded transactions (regardless of whether they are fraudulent) just like Square and Amazon Pay does.
- NicoJuicy 7y ago
  He's given an honest answer, the situation has to be checked. You don't know that the poster is 100% honest also. Patio has always been transparent and honest, long before he joined Stripe ;)
  - commoner 7y ago
    patio11 gave a nonanswer, which is hardly transparent. > a human who cares about your success Regarding honesty, if Stripe "cares about your success", Stripe would relinquish processing fees for all refunded transactions (regardless of whether they are fraudulent) just like Square and Amazon Pay do.
    - jasonkester 7y ago
      For what it's worth, the success of my business doesn't hinge on whether Stripe gives me a dollar. I hope yours doesn't either.
      - commoner 7y ago
        The fee is only $1 when the transaction amount is $24.14. The fee is $29.30 for a $1,000 transaction. For industries with lower margins or higher refund rates, Stripe's refusal to return the fee on refunded transactions is a problem. Regardless, Stripe's nickel-and-diming is not something to be grateful for in any industry when there are competitors that don't do the same.
        jasonkester 7y ago
        Feel free to substitue $29.30, or even $1,000 as values that should not sink one's software business. Considering how often you're going to be issuing refunds (I tend to do maybe 2 or 3 in a big month), I'd be surprised if we hadn't each spent more in billable hours typing into this text box than we will in Stripe refund fees over the next four years.
        ValentineC 7y ago
        I organise tech conferences as part of a non-profit. If I've already started selling tickets, and had to postpone the event because of something like COVID-19, I'd be looking at paying Stripe something like $3,500 in payment processing fees (it's 3.4%+$0.50 here; and assuming $100k in ticket revenue) for the privilege of refunding my attendees. It's not an amount that would sink our non-profit, but the full fee is also not something that we should have to pay, just because we want to do right by our attendees.
- fsloth 7y ago
  That's the un-charitable interpretation. When dealing with complex problems with no clear cut analytical solution putting a real human in the loop who can make a judgement call instead of playing back a prewritten script is often the optimal solution.
  - crankylinuxuser 7y ago
    > That's the un-charitable interpretation. Well, the truth sucks sometimes, doesn't it? Traditionally there's been 2 customer service lines: regular and VIP. Now there's 3: regular, VIP, and social media apology tour. And it'd sure be nice if these companies had decent policies to begin with... But that's the problem, isn't it?
    - cwyers 7y ago
      Decent policies that apply in all situations and are robust against being exploited by bad actors are very, very hard to come by sometimes.
      - crankylinuxuser 7y ago
        I do get that. But many of these stories we hear have to do with consistent customers with a stable payment history and a good relationship. Something goes terribly wrong, helpdesk bombs it, and then what? Well, twitter, HN, reddit. All I know is the current situation, well, stinks.
- martin_a 7y ago
  Sounds like Google. Either you know somebody deep in there or you are lost with your request. Your problem.
  - rfrey 7y ago
    In the case of Google we have a supertanker full of anecdotes of them ignoring customers with problems. In the case of Stripe we have no evidence their customer service is non existent outside social media flareups. To the contrary,they seem to have a pretty good reputation. So no, not like google at all. That somebody gets a response from a VP on hacker news is not evidence they will get no response outside hacker news.
    - martin_a 7y ago
      You're right. Maybe I was too harsh.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

joecool1029 7y ago

Translation: Come to HN with your problems and you'll get the VIP treatment while there's a spotlight on the company. Attempting to find an answer as an outsider lead me to this PR release from last year: https://stripe.com/newsroom/news/chargeback-protection https://stripe.com/newsroom/news/chargeback-protection < It makes me assume that if the merchant wasn't paying that extra fee they are going to be slammed.

commoner 7y ago
I don't think that press release is applicable, since no chargebacks are involved here. According to Stripe's documentation (see submitted link), the merchant must still pay the 2.9% + $0.30 processing fee for each refunded transaction, unless Stripe's customer service representatives waive the fees as an exception. But there is an issue with this euphemism in the parent comment: > a human who cares about your success If Stripe "cares about your success", Stripe would return the processing fee on all refunded transactions (regardless of whether they are fraudulent) just like Square and Amazon Pay does.
NicoJuicy 7y ago
He's given an honest answer, the situation has to be checked. You don't know that the poster is 100% honest also. Patio has always been transparent and honest, long before he joined Stripe ;)
- commoner 7y ago
  patio11 gave a nonanswer, which is hardly transparent. > a human who cares about your success Regarding honesty, if Stripe "cares about your success", Stripe would relinquish processing fees for all refunded transactions (regardless of whether they are fraudulent) just like Square and Amazon Pay do.
  - jasonkester 7y ago
    For what it's worth, the success of my business doesn't hinge on whether Stripe gives me a dollar. I hope yours doesn't either.
    - commoner 7y ago
      The fee is only $1 when the transaction amount is $24.14. The fee is $29.30 for a $1,000 transaction. For industries with lower margins or higher refund rates, Stripe's refusal to return the fee on refunded transactions is a problem. Regardless, Stripe's nickel-and-diming is not something to be grateful for in any industry when there are competitors that don't do the same.
      - jasonkester 7y ago
        Feel free to substitue $29.30, or even $1,000 as values that should not sink one's software business. Considering how often you're going to be issuing refunds (I tend to do maybe 2 or 3 in a big month), I'd be surprised if we hadn't each spent more in billable hours typing into this text box than we will in Stripe refund fees over the next four years.
        ValentineC 7y ago
        I organise tech conferences as part of a non-profit. If I've already started selling tickets, and had to postpone the event because of something like COVID-19, I'd be looking at paying Stripe something like $3,500 in payment processing fees (it's 3.4%+$0.50 here; and assuming $100k in ticket revenue) for the privilege of refunding my attendees. It's not an amount that would sink our non-profit, but the full fee is also not something that we should have to pay, just because we want to do right by our attendees.
fsloth 7y ago
That's the un-charitable interpretation. When dealing with complex problems with no clear cut analytical solution putting a real human in the loop who can make a judgement call instead of playing back a prewritten script is often the optimal solution.
- crankylinuxuser 7y ago
  > That's the un-charitable interpretation. Well, the truth sucks sometimes, doesn't it? Traditionally there's been 2 customer service lines: regular and VIP. Now there's 3: regular, VIP, and social media apology tour. And it'd sure be nice if these companies had decent policies to begin with... But that's the problem, isn't it?
  - cwyers 7y ago
    Decent policies that apply in all situations and are robust against being exploited by bad actors are very, very hard to come by sometimes.
    - crankylinuxuser 7y ago
      I do get that. But many of these stories we hear have to do with consistent customers with a stable payment history and a good relationship. Something goes terribly wrong, helpdesk bombs it, and then what? Well, twitter, HN, reddit. All I know is the current situation, well, stinks.
martin_a 7y ago
Sounds like Google. Either you know somebody deep in there or you are lost with your request. Your problem.
- rfrey 7y ago
  In the case of Google we have a supertanker full of anecdotes of them ignoring customers with problems. In the case of Stripe we have no evidence their customer service is non existent outside social media flareups. To the contrary,they seem to have a pretty good reputation. So no, not like google at all. That somebody gets a response from a VP on hacker news is not evidence they will get no response outside hacker news.
  - martin_a 7y ago
    You're right. Maybe I was too harsh.