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There will be no sustainable business. Regulations and taxes strangle your business before it gets to that point. If you look at the business landscape of Swe

There will be no sustainable business. Regulations and taxes strangle your business before it gets to that point. If you look at the business landscape of Sweden, it mostly consists of large multinational corporations with bases outside of Sweden (IKEA is a good example of this) and government jobs. It doesn't leave much room for individuals wanting to start a business and actually having an chance at success.

Apocryphon 7y ago
How was Spotify invented, in your mind?
- bobbytran 7y ago
  You made my point again. If you look at the wikipedia page, it's not incorporated in Sweden. It's a multinational corporation with an office in Sweden.
  - gamblor956 7y ago
    So are many multinationals, for tax reasons (not labor law reasons) related to something called IP migration that let corporations evade taxes on local income. Labor laws affect a company if they have employees in that jurisdiction. It doesn't matter if your HQ is somewhere else.
  - yellowapple 7y ago
    It's literally headquartered in Stockholm. That's like saying a Silicon Valley startup isn't actually in California or subject to California's laws solely because it incorporated in Delaware.
  - piva00 7y ago
    HQ is still here in Stockholm, it grew from Sweden up to the point it was incorporated outside of Sweden to go public, because shareholders will be moaning about it. It is still a very Swedish company, paying taxes in Sweden.
    - bobbytran 7y ago
      Incorporated outside of Sweden is the key here. It seems people are downvoting me because they dont want to hear the truth...but other commenters keep making my point quite nicely. Incorporating outside of Sweden allows big companies to enjoy tax benefits and then hire Engineers from Sweden at an average of 50,000USD to 68,0000USD (these numbers can easily be found on Google). They get lower taxes, a cheap labor pool, and the company isn't limited through draconian taxes and regulations, it only has to deal with it at a satellite office. It's a win-win. Now show me a company that's large, started in Sweden, and is still in Sweden many years later.
      - piva00 7y ago
        But it's the same exact thing that any larger Western corporation do when they become multinational, be it an American, British, Australian, they go out and create multiple tax schemes to avoid their duties, it's not a matter of Sweden specifically having high taxes or not, it's a matter of a systemic issue for tax evasion that large corporations can afford to abuse. Electrolux, Ericsson and Volvo are still incorporated and have their HQs in Sweden.
      - wsy 7y ago
        Now, by moving the goalposts, you lost your initial argument. Sure it might be the case that Swedish companies, at some stage of their growth, tend to incorporate in another country. Still the benefits Swedish employees experience don't seem to be in the way of getting a startup successfully up and running in Sweden.
        bobbytran 7y ago
        This was my point all along. You might be able to start a company in Sweden, but you won't be able to grow it there because of taxes and regulations. It's funny how it took so long for someone to finally admit that I'm correct instead of being willfully ignorant about the realities of a socialist country like Sweden.
        7y ago
pnako 7y ago
It's a country of 10 millions that builds jet fighters (Gripen), 5G technology with Ericsson, Minecraft, etc. The current NASDAQ trading platform was also developed in Sweden. I would say they're doing very well when it comes to business and technology.
- bobbytran 7y ago
  All government funded operations except Minecraft..which is now owned by Microsoft. Funny..the Original owner of Minecraft never stayed in Sweden with his billion dollars. My point still stands: you can start a company in Sweden, but will never be able to grow it to sustainable levels unless you incorporate elsewhere (or get purchased). All examples I've seen so far have only helped prove my point.
  - piva00 7y ago
    Spotify is homegrown in Sweden. King.com is homegrown in Sweden. Klarna is homegrown in Sweden and so on and on. I don't think you have any data to back your claims, reading through your comments it gives me "I feel it is this way" vibes and I don't think
    - bobbytran 7y ago
      King.com is incorporated in Malta. Presumably to get around taxes in Sweden and Spotify is incorporated in Luxomburg. Stop changing the topic. My point is that you can't grow a company in Sweden and every single example you have just given me are companies that left Sweden after growing to a certain stage. I think I'm done arguing my point because facts and data dont seem to matter here and it's funny how such a seemingly intelligent community can be utterly blinded by politics. The reality is that I would never incorporate a company in Sweden and incorporating pretty much anywhere else on earth would give me an advantage.
      - piva00 7y ago
        Again: as ANY big company looking to evade taxes, this is not a fault of Sweden. Why are most SV tech companies in the US incorporated in Delaware? Is it because California sucks and should lower their tax rates or employer obligations to the bottom of the pit that Delaware created? You never replied my other comment about companies that are still incorporated in Sweden such as Volvo, Electrolux, etc., so you can be done as much as you want peddling your point of view, it doesn't make it right. Edit: checking your comment history tells me that you call what Bernie Sanders is pushing for as "socialism" and you use that as an excuse to vote for Trump 2020, come on.

Apocryphon 7y ago

How was Spotify invented, in your mind?

bobbytran 7y ago
You made my point again. If you look at the wikipedia page, it's not incorporated in Sweden. It's a multinational corporation with an office in Sweden.
- gamblor956 7y ago
  So are many multinationals, for tax reasons (not labor law reasons) related to something called IP migration that let corporations evade taxes on local income. Labor laws affect a company if they have employees in that jurisdiction. It doesn't matter if your HQ is somewhere else.
- yellowapple 7y ago
  It's literally headquartered in Stockholm. That's like saying a Silicon Valley startup isn't actually in California or subject to California's laws solely because it incorporated in Delaware.
- piva00 7y ago
  HQ is still here in Stockholm, it grew from Sweden up to the point it was incorporated outside of Sweden to go public, because shareholders will be moaning about it. It is still a very Swedish company, paying taxes in Sweden.
  - bobbytran 7y ago
    Incorporated outside of Sweden is the key here. It seems people are downvoting me because they dont want to hear the truth...but other commenters keep making my point quite nicely. Incorporating outside of Sweden allows big companies to enjoy tax benefits and then hire Engineers from Sweden at an average of 50,000USD to 68,0000USD (these numbers can easily be found on Google). They get lower taxes, a cheap labor pool, and the company isn't limited through draconian taxes and regulations, it only has to deal with it at a satellite office. It's a win-win. Now show me a company that's large, started in Sweden, and is still in Sweden many years later.
    - piva00 7y ago
      But it's the same exact thing that any larger Western corporation do when they become multinational, be it an American, British, Australian, they go out and create multiple tax schemes to avoid their duties, it's not a matter of Sweden specifically having high taxes or not, it's a matter of a systemic issue for tax evasion that large corporations can afford to abuse. Electrolux, Ericsson and Volvo are still incorporated and have their HQs in Sweden.
    - wsy 7y ago
      Now, by moving the goalposts, you lost your initial argument. Sure it might be the case that Swedish companies, at some stage of their growth, tend to incorporate in another country. Still the benefits Swedish employees experience don't seem to be in the way of getting a startup successfully up and running in Sweden.
      - bobbytran 7y ago
        This was my point all along. You might be able to start a company in Sweden, but you won't be able to grow it there because of taxes and regulations. It's funny how it took so long for someone to finally admit that I'm correct instead of being willfully ignorant about the realities of a socialist country like Sweden.
        7y ago

pnako 7y ago

It's a country of 10 millions that builds jet fighters (Gripen), 5G technology with Ericsson, Minecraft, etc. The current NASDAQ trading platform was also developed in Sweden. I would say they're doing very well when it comes to business and technology.

bobbytran 7y ago
All government funded operations except Minecraft..which is now owned by Microsoft. Funny..the Original owner of Minecraft never stayed in Sweden with his billion dollars. My point still stands: you can start a company in Sweden, but will never be able to grow it to sustainable levels unless you incorporate elsewhere (or get purchased). All examples I've seen so far have only helped prove my point.
- piva00 7y ago
  Spotify is homegrown in Sweden. King.com is homegrown in Sweden. Klarna is homegrown in Sweden and so on and on. I don't think you have any data to back your claims, reading through your comments it gives me "I feel it is this way" vibes and I don't think
  - bobbytran 7y ago
    King.com is incorporated in Malta. Presumably to get around taxes in Sweden and Spotify is incorporated in Luxomburg. Stop changing the topic. My point is that you can't grow a company in Sweden and every single example you have just given me are companies that left Sweden after growing to a certain stage. I think I'm done arguing my point because facts and data dont seem to matter here and it's funny how such a seemingly intelligent community can be utterly blinded by politics. The reality is that I would never incorporate a company in Sweden and incorporating pretty much anywhere else on earth would give me an advantage.
    - piva00 7y ago
      Again: as ANY big company looking to evade taxes, this is not a fault of Sweden. Why are most SV tech companies in the US incorporated in Delaware? Is it because California sucks and should lower their tax rates or employer obligations to the bottom of the pit that Delaware created? You never replied my other comment about companies that are still incorporated in Sweden such as Volvo, Electrolux, etc., so you can be done as much as you want peddling your point of view, it doesn't make it right. Edit: checking your comment history tells me that you call what Bernie Sanders is pushing for as "socialism" and you use that as an excuse to vote for Trump 2020, come on.