6 ms·

> 1. Why do tech workers need a union? 1. Fight ageism (every 20 year old today will grow up someday) 2. Fight open office layout (my opinion, may not be sha

• sokoloff 7y ago
  Many of the most talented or hardest working engineers might rationally be opposed to equal pay measures.
  • claudeganon 7y ago
    Lobbying for equal pay protections isn’t independent of evaluations of merit. It’s about correcting demonstrable systemic bias against a protected class, e.g. if all women were being paid less then men in the same roles, with same experience, merit evaluations etc.
  • yumraj 7y ago
    Equal pay referred to between equally qualified men, women and other genders. Not clear why a talented and hard working person of one gender would be opposed that a similar person of another gender get same pay? It did not refer to people making unequal contributions.
    • manfredo 7y ago
      > Equal pay referred to between equally qualified men, women and other genders. Not clear why a talented and hard working person of one gender would be opposed that a similar person of another gender get same pay? Because there might not be an even distribution of people with certain skills. For instance, some point to the disproportionately large number of Asians in higher paying roles, and demand a form of equalization. The issue is not that people don't believe in equality, it's that people don't have the same view of what is equal. In particular, some view equality in terms of equality of outcomes while others view it in terms of equality of opportunity.
  • 8note 7y ago
    *engineers who are the best negotiators, rather than most talented or hard working
    • RhodesianHunter 7y ago
      Being talented and/or hard working can provide leverage in negotiations.
      • chobeat 7y ago
        You wish
      • ieRei6ae 7y ago
        Not at all.
  • untog 7y ago
    “equal pay” does not mean that all employees are paid the same amount...
• MPSimmons 7y ago
  > 2. Fight open office layout (my opinion, may not be shared by everyone) This is, I believe, the biggest strike against unions. If the unions decide you don't get open offices, then that decision binds everyone, whether they wanted an open office or not. You just have to hope that the many tradeoffs you make are worth the things you get in return.
  • Apocryphon 7y ago
    Unions need not ban all open offices from existence, but they can at least provide a more powerful voice than angry blog posts in an industry dominated by open plans.
  • hannasanarion 7y ago
    The difference is that, if you have a union, you get to vote on whether you want an open office or not. Without one, you have to do whatever the boss says.
  • alexgmcm 7y ago
    This is, I believe, the biggest strike against management. If the management decide you get open offices, then that decision binds everyone, whether they wanted an open office or not.
    • sokoloff 7y ago
      That's actually not (necessarily) the case (source: I'm management) Having management make adaptations specific to an individual's preferences is a feature available in a management-employee negotiated arrangement that might be precluded or more difficult in a union shop. As examples, I have colleagues working from remote locations, colleagues working in co-working spaces, colleagues working non-traditional schedules (by their choice, not mine). I can't see how having a union policy on work schedules and rules would have helped any of those employees and can easily see how they'd be harmed by having standardized work rules.
      • Apocryphon 7y ago
• skocznymroczny 7y ago
  How about automation? In Poland, worker unions at various companies strongly block any attempts at automation, because it makes less people are required to do the job so it leads to layoffs. But without adopting automation, in the long run the company can't keep up with automation-heavy competitors, so they go out of business, making everyone lose their jobs.