5 ms·

Inaccurate headline. They're doing a pilot project to see if they like it. This is where a lot of these "X Government Switches To Linux!" projects fall apart. W

Inaccurate headline. They're doing a pilot project to see if they like it. This is where a lot of these "X Government Switches To Linux!" projects fall apart. Wake me up when they actually do it.

fortran77 7y ago
That's what I thought. Flagged.
danso 7y ago
Relevant well-known case: when Munich switched to Linux and then switched back to Windows 10 https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/26/linux-pioneer-munich-switches-to-windows/ https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/26/linux-pioneer-munich-swi...
- AnthonyMouse 7y ago
  Which is, of course, the canonical example of why all governments should do it. The project didn't fail, it was on pace to succeed, which made Microsoft swoop in and basically bribe them to switch back. The lesson being, switch to Linux. Either you'll switch and save money, or Microsoft will bribe you not to and you'll save money.
  - dmix 7y ago
    The linked headline from the OPs post about the switch: > Linux in Munich: 'No compelling technical reason to return to Windows,' says city's IT chief https://www.techrepublic.com/article/linux-in-munich-no-compelling-technical-reason-to-return-to-windows-says-citys-it-chief/ https://www.techrepublic.com/article/linux-in-munich-no-comp... The reason was probably a shift in IT management who wanted to keep things "simple" with some vague thing about keeping one platform since they had kept previous windows machines around which were apparently "absolutely needed". It takes heart in the management to keep Linux around, which isn't always a reliable thing. Even when there was no "technical" need to use the more expensive Windows option. But this sounds 100% like a Microsoft sales/marketing job, which they are amazing at. They've really perfected selling to big firms, which you could see with the growth of Azure. Which I witnessed when they unleashed their sales machine on startups to get them to use it, and it was quite interesting to see in action.
    - atq2119 7y ago
      It was absolutely a political decision. Microsoft even moved their offices there from slightly outside of Munich to inside of Munich.
      - fierarul 7y ago
        First time I hear this. So they didn't move offices from the far away Berlin to Munich, they just moved them from a small nearby suburb into the downtown of Munich? How was that such an important decision?
        cookiengineer 7y ago
        > How was that such an important decision? Taxes. Politicians still think Microsoft pays taxes. Though 60M [1] per year in taxes while paying much more for their software is technically a retarded thing to do deal-wise. [1] https://www.northdata.de/Microsoft+Deutschland+GmbH,+München/HRB+70438 https://www.northdata.de/Microsoft+Deutschland+GmbH,+München...
  - rrdharan 7y ago
    That only makes sense if the total bribe outweighs the investment in building the credible alternative.
    - dx034 7y ago
      The bribe here is not to people but to the government. If the tax effect for the city outweighs licensing costs it makes sense for the city to switch. The city where their office used to be is the one suffering under the decision.
    - bangboombang 7y ago
      The bribe ends up in your pocket, the credible alternative only serves the general public.
    - AnthonyMouse 7y ago
      > That only makes sense if the total bribe outweighs the investment in building the credible alternative. It only makes sense to take the bribe in that case. It always makes sense to prepare for the switch, because if they won't bribe you enough to stop then you can always actually do the switch, which is still better than the status quo.
dx034 7y ago
And in the end it's not Windows that governments and companies need, it's Office. Windows is fairly easy to replace for a lot of jobs nowadays. But working without MS Office is extremely difficult. It's basically impossible and certainly not worth it ensuring that all spreadsheets used will still work with alternatives, it also makes communication with other governments or companies much harder. That's where Microsoft makes the money and has its monopoly.
- epigramx 7y ago
  Google Sheets has a History of your edits and if that's utilized well can make it well superior to MS.
  - bmon 7y ago
    I think using gsuite software would defeat the point of switching desktop operating system to avoid being dependant on a single company.
- cm2187 7y ago
  On the OS not being critical, I think that might be the case in 10 years, but large companies still have loads of internal desktop applications that haven’t moved to the web yet. But agree with your point on Office, there are many large organisations which are literally running on Excel, and which IT budget would have to grow 10 times if they were to replace all these excel based processes. And I must say that I haven’t seen any good alternative to Excel for a non programmer to set up a custom set of calculations, or deal with data. I am trying to get more people to learn SQL in my company, which shouldn’t be too difficult. But you are not going to write a company valuation model in SQL. And I had poor results at getting non programmers to pick up coding (I offered 1 week external in class courses, lots of people volunteered but 80% did not really do anything with it).
  - exikyut 7y ago
    I wonder what a landscape would look like where the OS isn't critical but everyone's still on Excel. Wine suddenly gets really really good, maybe?
dgellow 7y ago
It's a quite common way to negotiate lower licenses fees.
- guidedlight 7y ago
  Bingo. I've seen this strategy time and time again. It's part of the reason Microsoft is playing to their strength with Office 365, it's almost impossible to replace at this point.

Inaccurate headline. They're doing a pilot project to see if they like it. This is where a lot of these "X Government Switches To Linux!" projects fall apart. Wake me up when they actually do it.

fortran77 7y ago

That's what I thought. Flagged.

danso 7y ago

Relevant well-known case: when Munich switched to Linux and then switched back to Windows 10 https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/26/linux-pioneer-munich-switches-to-windows/ https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/26/linux-pioneer-munich-swi...

AnthonyMouse 7y ago
Which is, of course, the canonical example of why all governments should do it. The project didn't fail, it was on pace to succeed, which made Microsoft swoop in and basically bribe them to switch back. The lesson being, switch to Linux. Either you'll switch and save money, or Microsoft will bribe you not to and you'll save money.
- dmix 7y ago
  The linked headline from the OPs post about the switch: > Linux in Munich: 'No compelling technical reason to return to Windows,' says city's IT chief https://www.techrepublic.com/article/linux-in-munich-no-compelling-technical-reason-to-return-to-windows-says-citys-it-chief/ https://www.techrepublic.com/article/linux-in-munich-no-comp... The reason was probably a shift in IT management who wanted to keep things "simple" with some vague thing about keeping one platform since they had kept previous windows machines around which were apparently "absolutely needed". It takes heart in the management to keep Linux around, which isn't always a reliable thing. Even when there was no "technical" need to use the more expensive Windows option. But this sounds 100% like a Microsoft sales/marketing job, which they are amazing at. They've really perfected selling to big firms, which you could see with the growth of Azure. Which I witnessed when they unleashed their sales machine on startups to get them to use it, and it was quite interesting to see in action.
  - atq2119 7y ago
    It was absolutely a political decision. Microsoft even moved their offices there from slightly outside of Munich to inside of Munich.
    - fierarul 7y ago
      First time I hear this. So they didn't move offices from the far away Berlin to Munich, they just moved them from a small nearby suburb into the downtown of Munich? How was that such an important decision?
      - cookiengineer 7y ago
        > How was that such an important decision? Taxes. Politicians still think Microsoft pays taxes. Though 60M [1] per year in taxes while paying much more for their software is technically a retarded thing to do deal-wise. [1] https://www.northdata.de/Microsoft+Deutschland+GmbH,+München/HRB+70438 https://www.northdata.de/Microsoft+Deutschland+GmbH,+München...
- rrdharan 7y ago
  That only makes sense if the total bribe outweighs the investment in building the credible alternative.
  - dx034 7y ago
    The bribe here is not to people but to the government. If the tax effect for the city outweighs licensing costs it makes sense for the city to switch. The city where their office used to be is the one suffering under the decision.
  - bangboombang 7y ago
    The bribe ends up in your pocket, the credible alternative only serves the general public.
  - AnthonyMouse 7y ago
    > That only makes sense if the total bribe outweighs the investment in building the credible alternative. It only makes sense to take the bribe in that case. It always makes sense to prepare for the switch, because if they won't bribe you enough to stop then you can always actually do the switch, which is still better than the status quo.

dx034 7y ago

And in the end it's not Windows that governments and companies need, it's Office. Windows is fairly easy to replace for a lot of jobs nowadays. But working without MS Office is extremely difficult. It's basically impossible and certainly not worth it ensuring that all spreadsheets used will still work with alternatives, it also makes communication with other governments or companies much harder. That's where Microsoft makes the money and has its monopoly.

epigramx 7y ago
Google Sheets has a History of your edits and if that's utilized well can make it well superior to MS.
- bmon 7y ago
  I think using gsuite software would defeat the point of switching desktop operating system to avoid being dependant on a single company.
cm2187 7y ago
On the OS not being critical, I think that might be the case in 10 years, but large companies still have loads of internal desktop applications that haven’t moved to the web yet. But agree with your point on Office, there are many large organisations which are literally running on Excel, and which IT budget would have to grow 10 times if they were to replace all these excel based processes. And I must say that I haven’t seen any good alternative to Excel for a non programmer to set up a custom set of calculations, or deal with data. I am trying to get more people to learn SQL in my company, which shouldn’t be too difficult. But you are not going to write a company valuation model in SQL. And I had poor results at getting non programmers to pick up coding (I offered 1 week external in class courses, lots of people volunteered but 80% did not really do anything with it).
- exikyut 7y ago
  I wonder what a landscape would look like where the OS isn't critical but everyone's still on Excel. Wine suddenly gets really really good, maybe?

dgellow 7y ago

It's a quite common way to negotiate lower licenses fees.

guidedlight 7y ago
Bingo. I've seen this strategy time and time again. It's part of the reason Microsoft is playing to their strength with Office 365, it's almost impossible to replace at this point.