4 ms·

Honest question: how do we address the housing crisis in the Bay Area without turning it into Los Angeles?

by gdubs 7y ago

contingencies 7y ago
Avert global warming and maintain current patterns of SF weather.
manfredo 7y ago
By building higher density housing, instead of restrictive zoning laws that foster urban sprawl.
themagician 7y ago
Rezone the area around Golden Gate Park and turn it into a dense metropolis. You could 10x the density around there and be able to support the population. You’ve got wide streets, services, and it isn’t landfill. Honestly though, I feel like it isn’t really a crisis. It’s mostly rich people fighting with other rich people over whose backyard to build in. There are no real YIMBYs, just people who want to live in certain areas they don’t currently live in. Most of the poors have already been displaced. We pretend like they are the focus because it’s good for politics, but the reality is the diversity is already gone.
- thedance 7y ago
  Every property within 1/4 mile of the N-Judah streetcar line should have over-the-counter, by-right zoning approval for 7-story buildings with zero parking and no setbacks.
  - i_am_nomad 7y ago
    I used to live right near the park, 1/4 mile from the N-Judah. The infrastructure in that area can barely support the housing stock that exists right now.
- bluGill 7y ago
  If you upzone far enough builders will fill all the demand for rich apartments, and see the only way to make money is to build apartments for the next level down Some of this is moving the rich to the next style and letting the next level down have their old apartment. The problem of course is the best time to build affordable housing is 20 years ago. So if you want to really help the poor (as opposed to symbolically helping a few poor while leaving the rest out) you need to go back in time 20 years. You can start today though on a 20 year plan.
bovermyer 7y ago
Either build very tall, high density housing to accommodate the population... or reduce the population drastically. A nuclear missile fired into the San Andreas fault, perhaps (this is a movie reference, folks, and not a serious suggestion).
- nostrademons 7y ago
  What movie? It sounds vaguely entertaining.
  - bluGill 7y ago
    There are probably many from 1950 - 1980 to choose from. I've read many science fiction books from that era where the premise was such a bomb (though the destination was different). I'm not a movie buff, but I'd guess there is a superhero blockbuster with that theme somewhere in there ( Superman?).
  - bovermyer 7y ago
    This is from the first Christopher Reeve Superman movie.
  - logfromblammo 7y ago
    Superman (1978), starring Christopher Reeve. It involves Superman traveling at faster than c to save the day, rather than breaking a promise made under duress, which makes flunking ethical calculus into a super-vulnerability. Movies based on comic book characters have come a long way. And even movies based on DC characters have advanced slightly.
    - bovermyer 7y ago
      Maybe, but the music from that movie is still iconic; more so than most other DC movies', except perhaps Elfman's Batman theme.
notJim 7y ago
What does "turning it into Los Angeles?" mean? Everyone replying seems to know what you're talking about, but it's totally baffling to me.
- munificent 7y ago
  Huge sprawl and a massively car-focused infrastructure that requires long drive times on enormous multi-lane interstates to get anywhere.
driverdan 7y ago
The Bay Area is already like LA. SF has used its land, it needs to build up. The surrounding areas have already built out.
papreclip 7y ago
There are going to be tradeoffs one way or another. You can build a bunch of high rises and fill them with people, and private transportation will become impossible. The experience of going to the beach or some hiking spot on the weekend will be degraded. Everyone will be living in a godawful megacity instead of the nice neighborhood they'd rather live in. There's a reason people push back against growth with respect to housing. The real problem is overpopulation. If you eliminate one negative feedback loop for population growth, you will ultimately run into another one, and all the different kinds of waste we produce (CO2, garbage, light and noise pollution) will only pile up while finite resources in the region (breathing room, nature, water, room on the road and on hiking trails) will be divvied up into smaller portions

Honest question: how do we address the housing crisis in the Bay Area without turning it into Los Angeles?

by gdubs 7y ago

Honest question: how do we address the housing crisis in the Bay Area without turning it into Los Angeles?

contingencies 7y ago

Avert global warming and maintain current patterns of SF weather.

manfredo 7y ago

By building higher density housing, instead of restrictive zoning laws that foster urban sprawl.

themagician 7y ago

Rezone the area around Golden Gate Park and turn it into a dense metropolis. You could 10x the density around there and be able to support the population. You’ve got wide streets, services, and it isn’t landfill. Honestly though, I feel like it isn’t really a crisis. It’s mostly rich people fighting with other rich people over whose backyard to build in. There are no real YIMBYs, just people who want to live in certain areas they don’t currently live in. Most of the poors have already been displaced. We pretend like they are the focus because it’s good for politics, but the reality is the diversity is already gone.

thedance 7y ago
Every property within 1/4 mile of the N-Judah streetcar line should have over-the-counter, by-right zoning approval for 7-story buildings with zero parking and no setbacks.
- i_am_nomad 7y ago
  I used to live right near the park, 1/4 mile from the N-Judah. The infrastructure in that area can barely support the housing stock that exists right now.
bluGill 7y ago
If you upzone far enough builders will fill all the demand for rich apartments, and see the only way to make money is to build apartments for the next level down Some of this is moving the rich to the next style and letting the next level down have their old apartment. The problem of course is the best time to build affordable housing is 20 years ago. So if you want to really help the poor (as opposed to symbolically helping a few poor while leaving the rest out) you need to go back in time 20 years. You can start today though on a 20 year plan.

bovermyer 7y ago

Either build very tall, high density housing to accommodate the population... or reduce the population drastically. A nuclear missile fired into the San Andreas fault, perhaps (this is a movie reference, folks, and not a serious suggestion).

nostrademons 7y ago
What movie? It sounds vaguely entertaining.
- bluGill 7y ago
  There are probably many from 1950 - 1980 to choose from. I've read many science fiction books from that era where the premise was such a bomb (though the destination was different). I'm not a movie buff, but I'd guess there is a superhero blockbuster with that theme somewhere in there ( Superman?).
- bovermyer 7y ago
  This is from the first Christopher Reeve Superman movie.
- logfromblammo 7y ago
  Superman (1978), starring Christopher Reeve. It involves Superman traveling at faster than c to save the day, rather than breaking a promise made under duress, which makes flunking ethical calculus into a super-vulnerability. Movies based on comic book characters have come a long way. And even movies based on DC characters have advanced slightly.
  - bovermyer 7y ago
    Maybe, but the music from that movie is still iconic; more so than most other DC movies', except perhaps Elfman's Batman theme.

notJim 7y ago

What does "turning it into Los Angeles?" mean? Everyone replying seems to know what you're talking about, but it's totally baffling to me.

munificent 7y ago
Huge sprawl and a massively car-focused infrastructure that requires long drive times on enormous multi-lane interstates to get anywhere.

driverdan 7y ago

The Bay Area is already like LA. SF has used its land, it needs to build up. The surrounding areas have already built out.

papreclip 7y ago

There are going to be tradeoffs one way or another. You can build a bunch of high rises and fill them with people, and private transportation will become impossible. The experience of going to the beach or some hiking spot on the weekend will be degraded. Everyone will be living in a godawful megacity instead of the nice neighborhood they'd rather live in. There's a reason people push back against growth with respect to housing. The real problem is overpopulation. If you eliminate one negative feedback loop for population growth, you will ultimately run into another one, and all the different kinds of waste we produce (CO2, garbage, light and noise pollution) will only pile up while finite resources in the region (breathing room, nature, water, room on the road and on hiking trails) will be divvied up into smaller portions