4 ms·

That is an assumption regarding the human brain. Also, the limits of computation have been given an upper bound. If it's not computable by a Turing machine wit

by pnathan 16y ago

That is an assumption regarding the human brain. Also, the limits of computation have been given an upper bound. If it's not computable by a Turing machine with a finite memory tape (or anything else that is mappable to a Turing machine with a finite memory tape), it's not computable by a physical computer. Steve Yegge started exploring the metaphysics of computer programs before he stopped blogging; it makes for interesting reading.

cousin_it 16y ago
There's a reason why my argument never mentioned Turing computability :-) If a human brain uses quantum effects to get cognitive bonuses, you can build a quantum computer that does same. If the brain uses super-duper unified field theory, you can build a machine to take advantage of that, and so on. The only assumption I make about the human brain is that it doesn't run on magic juju that's available exclusively to humans by the orders of Cthulhu, and I think that assumption is quite warranted. (As far as I know, neurons can be approximated well enough by classical computers and you don't even need to go quantum, but that's another story.)
- signa11 16y ago
  moon-is-a-harsh-mistress quote: Am not going to argue whether a machine can "really" be alive, "really" be self-aware. Is a virus self-aware? Nyet! How about oyster? I doubt it. A cat? Almost certainly. A human? Don't know about you tovarishch, but I am. Somewhere along evolutionary chain from macromolecule to human brain self-awareness crept in. Psychologists assert it happens automatically whenever a brain acquires certain very high number of associational paths. Can't see it matters whether paths are protein or platinum.
VladRussian 16y ago
> If it's not computable by a Turing machine ... it's not computable by a physical computer. By a physical Turing equivalent computer. True. The breakthrough will come when we'll be able to overcome the damnation of step-by-step-ness (which is the primitive expression of causality).

by pnathan 16y ago

cousin_it 16y ago

There's a reason why my argument never mentioned Turing computability :-) If a human brain uses quantum effects to get cognitive bonuses, you can build a quantum computer that does same. If the brain uses super-duper unified field theory, you can build a machine to take advantage of that, and so on. The only assumption I make about the human brain is that it doesn't run on magic juju that's available exclusively to humans by the orders of Cthulhu, and I think that assumption is quite warranted. (As far as I know, neurons can be approximated well enough by classical computers and you don't even need to go quantum, but that's another story.)

signa11 16y ago
moon-is-a-harsh-mistress quote: Am not going to argue whether a machine can "really" be alive, "really" be self-aware. Is a virus self-aware? Nyet! How about oyster? I doubt it. A cat? Almost certainly. A human? Don't know about you tovarishch, but I am. Somewhere along evolutionary chain from macromolecule to human brain self-awareness crept in. Psychologists assert it happens automatically whenever a brain acquires certain very high number of associational paths. Can't see it matters whether paths are protein or platinum.

VladRussian 16y ago

> If it's not computable by a Turing machine ... it's not computable by a physical computer. By a physical Turing equivalent computer. True. The breakthrough will come when we'll be able to overcome the damnation of step-by-step-ness (which is the primitive expression of causality).