10 ms·

The 2020 State of Remote Work

187 points by donbox 7y ago

Areading314 7y ago
Meetings are MORE seamless when done fully remotely, because everyone is responsible for their own setup. In my experience, the biggest friction is always getting a "room" in the office for people to sit, which often has issues.
- montroser 7y ago
  Yes, it's often the people in the big conference room that are actually much harder to hear, because you have many people trying to jam all of their audio and video through a single mic and camera. Each remote person has their own dedicated mic and camera, so you can see and hear all of the nuance when they speak. But it is not reciprocal -- in return, the remote people get to see a single grainy feed of the tops of their colleagues heads in the office, and variable/muffled audio because the mic can't be close to everyone at once. We have been trying a different approach at work where everybody always just uses their own laptop camera and mic, whether they're in the office or remote. Sometimes it can seem a little silly talking into your laptop to the person sitting next to you also talking into their laptop. But the upside is everybody's dedicated audio and video is crystal clear; and when we share screens we can all see all of the detail up close rather than having to squint at a tv at the other end of a conference room. Curious to know if anyone else has tried working this way? We've also been trying out https://team.video https://team.video, which has some cool collaborative features that only really work if each person is joining from their own device.
  - mdonahoe 7y ago
    I can’t remember where I first read it, but a policy I liked was: “if any meeting attendee is remote, the entire meeting much be remote” which sounds similar to your solution.
  - gregmac 7y ago
    About half my team is technically collocated in one location, there's a couple other locations with two people, and a handful of others. I say "technically collocated" because at any given time, half those people work from home anyway. This came about from an acquisition. At first we did the meeting room plus remote thing. The best room we have for that has a ~60" tv and a Logitech Group camera/speaker/mic, and sits about 6-8 people. Plugs in with usb, and if the person plugging in does it right, you can get a decent view of all cameras and share a screen (trick is, the person plugging in can't be the one sharing). As a remote attendee the audio is good and the camera covers the room well. What's happened over time though is we stopped using the room, and everyone joins from their desk (and people started working remote more). It puts everyone on a level playing field, and frankly, the meetings are better. I love being able to look things up or update a ticket on my second monitor with my full desk setup, and it's much less disruptive to the type of people who get offended if you're heads-down looking at your laptop while they're talking. The only thing I really like better in person is standing around a whiteboard while designing or explaining something complex. Drawing on a touchscreen is the next closest thing I find works as a substitute but it's just not the same. Tips: Make it a requirement that every meeting invite gets an online session, even if everyone is in the same office. This helps shift things remote, if you don't or can't outright mandate the "one person remote means everyone is remote" rule, plus it avoids having to coordinate where anyone is. Use video, and make it a habit to turn on your camera, as it prompts others to as well. Staying muted is good etiquette but makes it impossible to gauge reactions, so video lets you see people nodding, looking confused, laughing, etc. Make sure everyone has a good audio setup (which basically means headset). For what it's worth, of non-headset users, maybe 20% have "passable but not great" audio, 2% have good audio (no feedback, echo, background noise), and the rest are garbage.
  - chasedehan 7y ago
    One screen. One face. The only way to do it. Remote people will love it but there will probably be push back from in office people. In order to enforce it there needs to be a champion at higher levels.
    - leppr 7y ago
      There are technological ways to get the benefits of this approach without changing the office workers' habits. I don't remember the name of the solution, but working with a big SF company which has both many office and remote workers, they had a camera mounted atop a TV in the meeting room. The camera would focus on and follow the current speaker even if they moved around the room, and the audio was clear as long as only one person talked at a time. It worked surprisingly well.
      - skgoa 7y ago
        There are a lot of products like this available and every corporation's offices I have been to have had one of them.
      - dasil003 7y ago
        This is a cool trick but I don’t like it because when someone is talking I actually care more about seeing the rooms reaction rather than the talking head. The ideal solution (which I haven’t seen) is ultra high rez camera and software zoom on the client.
- trollied 7y ago
  Remote meetings are brilliant. People get to the point straight away. There's no messing about. I've had hour-long all remote meetings that would have probably taken triple the time if everyone was in a meeting room.
dglass 7y ago
Glad to see this data coming out. My company builds tools for remote workers so naturally, I speak with a lot of people who work remotely. I'd say most of the pain points I hear from remote workers line up fairly well with the data in this survey (and also my own pain points since I've worked remote for over a year now). I'm not surprised to see that 97% of people would recommend working remote to others. Almost everyone I speak with says they would never go back to working in an office. While I can see myself going back to an office at some point in my career, right now the flexibility in my day far outweighs working in an office. I hear a lot of similar downsides as well. I'm a bit surprised that only 20% of people responded that they struggled with loneliness while working remote. In my experience this number seems to be higher. My coworkers and I work out of coffee shops quite a bit and almost everyone who goes to work in a coffee shop is doing so in order to break out of the loneliness of their home and be around other people (next time you're in a coffee shop, take note of how many people have laptops out). The problem though is that no one really interacts with people at coffee shops because everyone is at their own table on their laptops. We heard this feedback so much that we started holding Work Clubs[0] at coffee shops where people can sit down with us at the same table and work together for a few hours. It's not networking but it's a way to meet other people during the workday while getting your work done. We've had people from many different industries, ages, and walks of life working together and forming business connections. It's beneficial to the coffee shops too because when we all sit at the same table, order food and drinks, and it frees up other tables for more customers. Our communities are growing in Portland, San Diego, and the SF Bay Area right now, so come work with us if you're ever feeling lonely and need some IRL human interaction in your day! Mental health is an important factor for remote workers, and we're hoping to alleviate some of those struggles for the remote community. [0]: https://outofoffice.app/ https://outofoffice.app/
- xrd 7y ago
  I'm glad you called out the loneliness metrics and analysis. I agree that this is a place where we as an industry can make improvements and provide leadership. It is just about every day that I go from feeling disappointed that I will be having lunch by myself again, to feeling frustrated to think that I could have lunch with someone (but it would add 2 hours to my day if I drive up, time I don't have as a father of three small kids), ending with just being frustrated about being lonely. I'm grateful I don't have to commute, but being able to walk out the door of an office and find dozens of random people with which I could have lunch with is something I really miss. I'm really glad there are numbers behind this important topic. Loneliness is real, its a big problem, and it is something most remote companies don't talk about.
jborichevskiy 7y ago
The parts that stood out to me: (my team and I are currently seeing each other in person two full days every two weeks and the rest is remote) > 3. Not having to commute is a top benefit to remote workers Makes sense. Financial, health, and psychological benefits. > 4. Communication, collaboration, and loneliness continue to be top challenges for remote workers and remote organizations 100% agree. I typically have automatic transcriptions enabled (Google Meet) + a full resolution version of whatever document the person is talking presenting is editing. As for the loneliness aspect, while I don’t feel like I socialize that much during work, I have enough energy to go out and socialize after. This is a byproduct of a lot of things and not purely remote/not remote. > 5. The majority of organizations with remote workers don’t pay for monthly expenses associated with remote work Not sure about this one. I think part of the incentive for a company to go remote is savings. On the other hand, a standing desk and a good chair do wonders. Perhaps the savings from rent are enough to cover all of this- I’m not sure. Travel and expenses should be 100% reimbursed, no question.
- noahtallen 7y ago
  I mean, it’s the recurring costs that aren’t usually covered, like internet. My company is fully remote and I’m reimbursed for my home office equipment (computer, desk, chair, router, etc) and for all travel. Even for working from a coffee shop. But not for home internet.
  - sunilkumarc 7y ago
    Great! Where do you work? If you don't mind me asking.
- flamtap 7y ago
  Regarding item 5: I think it can be a win-win. In my country at least (Canada), some of those savings are passed on to me. I can deduct from my taxes a portion of the following: rent, phone bill, internet bill, home utilities, essentially anything to do with me using my home as a workspace.
jameslk 7y ago
> Communication, collaboration, and loneliness continue to be top challenges for remote workers and remote organizations While probably years off and slightly dystopian, I'm interested to see how VR may change the remote communication and collaboration aspect. Stuff like ImmersedVR for the Quest (no affiliation) that allows you to be in the same virtual room as someone else, being able to glance over at their (virtual) screens by turning your head and having access to a digital whiteboard seems pretty scifi but are novel solutions to these problems.
- mnm1 7y ago
  I think video is mostly useless and VR will be even more so if only for the simple fact that many people cannot use it due to motion sickness. Better tech is unlikely to ever change that. (I can't even do 3d movies). I think chat and voice are plenty good and don't have all the drawbacks of a visual solution. I find not having to see people in real life, on video, or in VR to be one of the main advantages of remote work.
tyoma 7y ago
Glad this covers the good and bad aspects of remote work. One thing is missing though: the cost of an extra bedroom to use as an office. In many real estate markets, going from N to N+1 bedrooms is a considerable price increase.
- JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
  Some people set up desks in their living room / common areas. I haven't seen anybody pass judgment for not maintaining a separate, dedicated room for remote work.
  - kingludite 7y ago
    I could see a room outfitted to spec become a standard some day. Starting with a working microphone.
- ProZsolt 7y ago
  I usually just work from my living room. You don't necessarily need a dedicated home office. Also, because you don't need to commute you can move farther from the city center or even to another cheaper city/town. So you can get an N+1 bedroom for the price of N or even cheaper.
gingerlime 7y ago
Interesting results and well written casual but sensical analysis. One thing that bothered me a bit though was the “product placements”. Were there any (financial or otherwise) incentives to publish those? If so, and even more so if there weren’t, I feel like this should have been more explicitly disclosed. Apologies if I skipped any disclosure inadvertently.
JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
I was really skeptical of remote work before I took my first and current remote job, which surprisingly paid better than my former non-remote job. Conceptually, It was totally outside my Overton window. But having experienced it, my perspective completely changed. I don't mind doing a good job, but I underestimated how valuable the autonomy of my time would be, it's such a blessing. An occasional hour or two mid-day break really suits me. Those days, I am stretching my work day, but more relaxed and less stressed. My output is higher than working in an office.
- ebg13 7y ago
  > An occasional hour or two mid-day break really suits me. What...like lunch? I don't know any software engineer who doesn't regularly take more than an hour for lunch.
  - JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
    When I worked at the office, "lunch" was available onsite from 11:30 to 1:30 and onsite was 30-90 minutes from my house, depending on a very wide range of traffic conditions. It can be food, it can be laundry, it can be errands. Things I couldn't squeeze in before.
    - blaser-waffle 7y ago
      I've made a habit of using "lunch" to make dinner, via a crockpot or slowcooker. As in, I work remote and use my "lunch break" to throw stew (or curry, or soup, or a roast, etc.) together and have that cook for the rest of the afternoon.
  - kharak 7y ago
    I regularly do 15 to 30 minutes. In my current project, it's between 30 and 45 minutes due to socialising with coworkers. These minutes are not paid, meaning I have to stay longer at work, less free time. Long lunch almost always feels terrible to me. Short lunch is like a treat for myself. I've never seen engineers doing longer than 1 hour breaks at a regular basis. Even 1 hour is rare.
sdiw 7y ago
Interesting results. I am also a remote worker and glad to see this trend is picking up. Everything has upsides and downsides but upsides of working remotely outweigh downsides buy quite a margin. Not only working remotely gives peace of mind (little flexibility on working hours.); working in a familiar/comfortable environment increases productivity, especially for people like me who are a little uncomfortable when surrounded by other people. (bonus you can sit awkwardly in you PJs)
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plafl 7y ago
One of the main benefits for me (I would consider it in the "Ability to work from home" category mentioned in the article) is how much better is the environment at home: I don't need to use headphones to avoid getting distracted and distracting other people with remote calls, I can stream some relaxing music from my computer, my chair is great, I have a huge L-shaped table, I have ilumination the way I like it, temperature. I agree also with most of the other points in the article, both positive and negatives. Right now I work from home about 50% of the time, which I think is great. Most of the team also works remote part time, and anyway we are split between two cities (Madrid and Barcelona) so we must coordinate remotely even if we are at the office.
- cs02rm0 7y ago
  100%. The last 10 days I've been in an open plan office instead of my home office I've used for 8 years. I've had to trade a 5k ultrawide monitor for 1080p, an Aeron for a cheap chair the company bought secondhand, desk at a height that's comfortable for one that isn't (I'm 6'5), natural light for fluorescent and 500ppm of CO2 for 1200ppm+. And a 10 second walk for a 45 minute drive each way commute. I don't even think CO2 is on anyone's radar, but some complain of headaches and many seem really lethargic by late morning. And everyone in the office uses cloud software, but there's a distrust of remote working. I was hoping this battle would be won by now, I'm almost at the point of thinking it should be encouraged by legislation.
  - awb 7y ago
    I started a fully remote company in 2008 and thought it was a matter of time until all new startups were fully remote. It's a win for the environment, productivity and much less overhead which means higher wages. Your hiring pool also increases substantially. We were successful but I'm surprised how many startups today still want to hire within a small radius of a physical office.
    - antupis 7y ago
      Personally I think initial seed-stage should be so that team is the same place, but when you want to scale remote team makes sense. I think the missing ingredient now is that there are not lots of examples and procedures on how to go remote, scale and manage remote teams.
sunilkumarc 7y ago
I'm currently working as a Senior Software Developer at a startup. I have been wanting to work remotely from my next job change. I'm from India where engineers generally get paid less compared to engineers in the United States and many European Countries. Although I'm not looking for the same salary as that of an US engineer, I'm looking for a pay something close to that amount. Is this the reality today? How many companies pay remote workers regardless of their location?
- dep_b 7y ago
  India means your time zone sucks. Working from Latin America I could get US$70,-/hour freelance but that was pretty much triple the median already. Experienced people in Poland earn 40-50 euro, they’re in a better time zone and are in economic and legal zone. Also hiring people on a fixed contract instead of freelance outside of “the civilized world” scares the shit out US businesses.
- aws_ls 7y ago
  > Although I'm not looking for the same salary as that of an US engineer, I'm looking for a pay something close to that amount. Is this the reality today? You can get close to that money in two ways, in my knowledge and experience. 1) Work for a FANG company (Only Amazon, Google are there, but there are others which pay well e.g. VMWare comes to mind now). 2) You join a good netork for freelancers. I currently work for one, and I make the amount, which fits your description of 'near US salary'. Since cost of living is low, it does feel like a high paying job.
  - sunilkumarc 7y ago
    You mean you work a company? Or you work as a freelancer on platforms like Toptal, freelancer.in etc ?
    - aws_ls 7y ago
      I work for a Bay area Startup client via Toptal. PS: I didn't mention the name earlier, to avoid being taken as marketing for a platform. Now that you asked... :)
znq 7y ago
I've shared this a lot recently, sorry for doing it again, but usually the feedback we get is extremely positive: We've turned our internal wiki with processes and experiences from running a fully remote company for over 8 years in a nice digestible PDF: https://mobilejazz.com/company-handbook-pdf/ https://mobilejazz.com/company-handbook-pdf/
- geewee 7y ago
  For some reason, the design of the page made me sure that it was some sort of lead generation site. I was really surprised when I didn't have to put in my email to read the book.
  - znq 7y ago
    While it wasn't the initial reason to create the company handbook, there are for sure marketing intentions behind the site and the handbook as well. Otherwise it wouldn't justify the effort of turning our internal wiki into a well designed PDF. But I believe giving it away for free and having people talking about it positively is already great for our brand. Actually by now I know this already for a fact, as many people have reached out to us because of this.
- suigetsusake 7y ago
  Thanks a lot for this reading its a lot of insight since il currently preparing to launch my own remote company and my vision of it align a lot with yours. Do you have any resources or tips for how to handle the financial and paperworks of having people from different countries ? Thats the thing im having the more trouble finding info about
  - znq 7y ago
    Unfortunately that is a very difficult question to answer as it is very specific to your company's tax and legal residency and those of every single team member. In our case we offer proper employment where we have a legal entity and thus actually can employ team members. For people with tax residency in other countries the only somewhat non-bureaucratic and sustainable solution is for them to go self-employed and have a "consulting contract" with us. That said, regardless of the legal technicalities, we treat everyone the same.
datingscientist 7y ago
Not commuting is huge. That adds about 3 hours a day to my availability, when you consider the prep time and various other incidentals. One way to pitch it to the boss: savings on relo and the ability to tap into a much broader hiring pool. I'm seeing this now with a private equity group, where they've decided it is cheaper to hire operating talent nationally in major metro areas and let them commute / remote work vs. relocating everyone for a two or three year gig. (After which point, you're laid off in a small town where you're brand new... not a good thing; absolutely no way I would relo for this gig)
distantaidenn 7y ago
Tokyo salaryman reporting in. This is definitely the next career move for me if I stay corporate. I waste about 3 hours of potentially productive time each day -- not to mention the wind-up time necessary when sitting down to work. 1 hour morning prep to go out, 1 hour commute each way on central Toyko trains, and 30 odd minutes settling in at the office. Only to do exactly what I could be doing at home...At this point, I think telling developers the benefits of remote work is preaching to the choir.
- jamesvandyne 7y ago
  If you’re looking for a remote job in Japan it’s worth checking out the remote in Japan repo on GitHub. Heaps of good companies that do remote (including the one I work for). https://github.com/uiur/remote-in-japan/blob/master/README.en.md https://github.com/uiur/remote-in-japan/blob/master/README.e...
- pinkfoot 7y ago
  > 1 hour morning prep to go out What on earth are you doing?
  - hnzix 7y ago
    Business clobber is a lot more hassle than throwing on jeans and a t-shirt. In a formal office environment it's best to look sharp and that takes some prep time.
foreigner 7y ago
This data is interesting but I'd love to see a similar survey done from the perspective of companies that employ remote workers.
dmontero 7y ago
In my previous job in Germany I could work remotely as much as I wanted. I would usually work from Spain, since is where I come from. It was close to ideal: having lunch in 30min and spending the other 30min at the pool or going for a short break to the beach (just 5min away). However I discovered that when I spent more than 1 or 2 weeks working remotely in a row I would start feeling detached from my job. It became increasingly difficult to be motivated and concentrated in certain tasks. In my current job employees can work remotely 1 day a week by default with possibility to extend it occasionally. I find this to work better for me personally. It allows me to be flexible and productive while working remotely and at the same time it keeps me engaged and connected with the challenges and goals at work.
- asterisk_ 7y ago
  How did the detachment manifest, if you don't mind sharing? Did you try to find an effective way to combat the lack of motivation, or was it just a matter of returning back to the office?
  - dmontero 7y ago
    It manifested by having difficulties to work without interruptions. I got easily distracted with anything and found myself procrastinating more often. That's rare on me, since I usually can work in a flow mode for long periods of time. As it was discussed previously, procrastination seems like a way to manage emotions: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17878716 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17878716
    - asterisk_ 7y ago
      Interesting; the article resonates well. Thanks for taking the time to share.
- ChuckNorris89 7y ago
  May I ask hod did you find remote work in Germany? I noticed in my time there German companies were highly conservative and didn't want to hear about their employees not being present in the office.
iamthepieman 7y ago
I have worked 100% remote at two different jobs for the past 8 years. I gave upon remote work this week. I slowly entered a phase of resenting work and resenting my family and home life. They each slowly encroached on each other until I was not sleeping, not being productive at work, not engaged with my kids and generally hating life. I felt like I was a husk of a person, a cipher or automaton. Fortunately my company has an office 40 minutes away so I have the option to commute without changing jobs. Admittedly, I have some unique circumstances that probably put me in a tiny minority. I still think remote work is a great idea, it's just not for me anymore and I wish I had realized that 3 years ago.
- sedgjh23 7y ago
  A lot of people use work to get away from their families. Just be aware It can be an indicator of other problems in your life. In all of my relationships (friends, family, romantic) I’ve observed that people usually severely undervalue personal time and are unwilling to commit to taking care of themselves. Good luck and I hope the office life brings you some happiness. I sometimes find myself jealous of those with commutes that get to chip away at their podcast queues daily.
BrandoElFollito 7y ago
I think that to some point larger companies who do not have a good time management are the most scared by remote work. The idea of someone slacking off freely at home is probably less bearable than slacking off at the office.
RickJWagner 7y ago
I've been working remote 10 years now. I love it. I am surprised, though. One major downfall wasn't listed-- the remote worker is not 'completely plugged in' with the rest of the team (if they are co-located). That little bit of drag brings some inefficiencies. But for me, remote work is now a 'must have'.
claudiulodro 7y ago
Is the average remote job paid significantly less than the average local job? Is the HN trope that every developer should be making $150k+ simply wrong? Curious how to reconcile this data with the giganto salaries everyone here is always talking about getting. I like the remote lifestyle OK, but am I shooting myself in the (salary) foot by working remotely? > Below is the breakdown of salary ranges for respondents in USD. > 18.6% $50,001 to $75,000 > 16.8% $75,001 to $100,000 > 14.2% $25,001 to $50,000 > 12.1% up to $25,000 > 12% $100,000 to $125,000 > 10.8% $125,001 to $150,000 > 9.7% $150,001 to $200,000 > 5.9% Over $200,000
- sheepybloke 7y ago
  One thing that's come up with remote work is missing out on promotion, since you aren't as naturally visible to your manager or boss. So, if you are working remotely, you might not want to be full time to make sure to get some of that visibility. (I know this isn't directly related to the question, but it's something to consider)
apercu 7y ago
I have worked remotely for 5 years, and for 3 years previously. Let's say I have been working for 25 years. That means 32% of my career has been spent working remotely. And it's been the most productive and personally satisfying part of my career. But, note when I say remote it's "work from home most of the time" remote. Not work in some other country on the other side of the world remote. I do in person meetings with clients and partners a couple times a month.
phaedrus 7y ago
The place I worked at before my current employer had a bizarre attitude to remote work. Our manager was strongly skeptical of work from home, but half of our team was distributed in branch offices which were effectively remote work! I worked in one of these satellite offices, so I had all of the collaboration difficulties and none of the upsides (still had to come in. To an open plan office.) After a bunch of people left I got promoted to lead developer, but I was the only one left in the branch office. The rest of my team was concentrated in HQ a couple hours' drive away. The manager and software architect (his right-hand man) still micromanaged technical decisions. I couldn't get ahold of them for weeks at a time as they were so overbooked, but my team members could occasionally corner them for hallway conversations. So I'd get asked something, have to make a best guess judgement since I couldn't ask them, someone else would corner them and they'd tell them the opposite of what I decided. But I wouldn't find out about this until we went to integrate something and found the two halves had been implemented to different directions.
downerending 7y ago
I'd love to work remotely. To date, though, there seems to be a very strong bias from employers in not doing so. Simply being in the office looks "busy", while not being in the office looks like slacking, regardless of what's actually getting done. Quoting Allen, 80% of life really is just showing up. For better or worse.
- xtracto 7y ago
  Tell me about it... as a technical leader at the startup I work on, I would love to be remote and for my team to be remote (we are kind of remote as we are collocated in 2 offices in different countries). But the CEO and HR department do not believe in remote teams. It is the one thing that I struggle with and will change in a heartbeat.
  - downerending 7y ago
    I've learned to look at the bright side. Any day I drag my ass in I'm scoring an 80% right out of the box. I'd feel guilty not much getting done on a day remotely, but for some reason I don't feel it much when I'm at my desk.

187 points by donbox 7y ago

Meetings are MORE seamless when done fully remotely, because everyone is responsible for their own setup. In my experience, the biggest friction is always getting a "room" in the office for people to sit, which often has issues.

montroser 7y ago
Yes, it's often the people in the big conference room that are actually much harder to hear, because you have many people trying to jam all of their audio and video through a single mic and camera. Each remote person has their own dedicated mic and camera, so you can see and hear all of the nuance when they speak. But it is not reciprocal -- in return, the remote people get to see a single grainy feed of the tops of their colleagues heads in the office, and variable/muffled audio because the mic can't be close to everyone at once. We have been trying a different approach at work where everybody always just uses their own laptop camera and mic, whether they're in the office or remote. Sometimes it can seem a little silly talking into your laptop to the person sitting next to you also talking into their laptop. But the upside is everybody's dedicated audio and video is crystal clear; and when we share screens we can all see all of the detail up close rather than having to squint at a tv at the other end of a conference room. Curious to know if anyone else has tried working this way? We've also been trying out https://team.video https://team.video, which has some cool collaborative features that only really work if each person is joining from their own device.
- mdonahoe 7y ago
  I can’t remember where I first read it, but a policy I liked was: “if any meeting attendee is remote, the entire meeting much be remote” which sounds similar to your solution.
- gregmac 7y ago
  About half my team is technically collocated in one location, there's a couple other locations with two people, and a handful of others. I say "technically collocated" because at any given time, half those people work from home anyway. This came about from an acquisition. At first we did the meeting room plus remote thing. The best room we have for that has a ~60" tv and a Logitech Group camera/speaker/mic, and sits about 6-8 people. Plugs in with usb, and if the person plugging in does it right, you can get a decent view of all cameras and share a screen (trick is, the person plugging in can't be the one sharing). As a remote attendee the audio is good and the camera covers the room well. What's happened over time though is we stopped using the room, and everyone joins from their desk (and people started working remote more). It puts everyone on a level playing field, and frankly, the meetings are better. I love being able to look things up or update a ticket on my second monitor with my full desk setup, and it's much less disruptive to the type of people who get offended if you're heads-down looking at your laptop while they're talking. The only thing I really like better in person is standing around a whiteboard while designing or explaining something complex. Drawing on a touchscreen is the next closest thing I find works as a substitute but it's just not the same. Tips: Make it a requirement that every meeting invite gets an online session, even if everyone is in the same office. This helps shift things remote, if you don't or can't outright mandate the "one person remote means everyone is remote" rule, plus it avoids having to coordinate where anyone is. Use video, and make it a habit to turn on your camera, as it prompts others to as well. Staying muted is good etiquette but makes it impossible to gauge reactions, so video lets you see people nodding, looking confused, laughing, etc. Make sure everyone has a good audio setup (which basically means headset). For what it's worth, of non-headset users, maybe 20% have "passable but not great" audio, 2% have good audio (no feedback, echo, background noise), and the rest are garbage.
- chasedehan 7y ago
  One screen. One face. The only way to do it. Remote people will love it but there will probably be push back from in office people. In order to enforce it there needs to be a champion at higher levels.
  - leppr 7y ago
    There are technological ways to get the benefits of this approach without changing the office workers' habits. I don't remember the name of the solution, but working with a big SF company which has both many office and remote workers, they had a camera mounted atop a TV in the meeting room. The camera would focus on and follow the current speaker even if they moved around the room, and the audio was clear as long as only one person talked at a time. It worked surprisingly well.
    - skgoa 7y ago
      There are a lot of products like this available and every corporation's offices I have been to have had one of them.
    - dasil003 7y ago
      This is a cool trick but I don’t like it because when someone is talking I actually care more about seeing the rooms reaction rather than the talking head. The ideal solution (which I haven’t seen) is ultra high rez camera and software zoom on the client.
trollied 7y ago
Remote meetings are brilliant. People get to the point straight away. There's no messing about. I've had hour-long all remote meetings that would have probably taken triple the time if everyone was in a meeting room.

dglass 7y ago

Glad to see this data coming out. My company builds tools for remote workers so naturally, I speak with a lot of people who work remotely. I'd say most of the pain points I hear from remote workers line up fairly well with the data in this survey (and also my own pain points since I've worked remote for over a year now). I'm not surprised to see that 97% of people would recommend working remote to others. Almost everyone I speak with says they would never go back to working in an office. While I can see myself going back to an office at some point in my career, right now the flexibility in my day far outweighs working in an office. I hear a lot of similar downsides as well. I'm a bit surprised that only 20% of people responded that they struggled with loneliness while working remote. In my experience this number seems to be higher. My coworkers and I work out of coffee shops quite a bit and almost everyone who goes to work in a coffee shop is doing so in order to break out of the loneliness of their home and be around other people (next time you're in a coffee shop, take note of how many people have laptops out). The problem though is that no one really interacts with people at coffee shops because everyone is at their own table on their laptops. We heard this feedback so much that we started holding Work Clubs[0] at coffee shops where people can sit down with us at the same table and work together for a few hours. It's not networking but it's a way to meet other people during the workday while getting your work done. We've had people from many different industries, ages, and walks of life working together and forming business connections. It's beneficial to the coffee shops too because when we all sit at the same table, order food and drinks, and it frees up other tables for more customers. Our communities are growing in Portland, San Diego, and the SF Bay Area right now, so come work with us if you're ever feeling lonely and need some IRL human interaction in your day! Mental health is an important factor for remote workers, and we're hoping to alleviate some of those struggles for the remote community. [0]: https://outofoffice.app/ https://outofoffice.app/

xrd 7y ago
I'm glad you called out the loneliness metrics and analysis. I agree that this is a place where we as an industry can make improvements and provide leadership. It is just about every day that I go from feeling disappointed that I will be having lunch by myself again, to feeling frustrated to think that I could have lunch with someone (but it would add 2 hours to my day if I drive up, time I don't have as a father of three small kids), ending with just being frustrated about being lonely. I'm grateful I don't have to commute, but being able to walk out the door of an office and find dozens of random people with which I could have lunch with is something I really miss. I'm really glad there are numbers behind this important topic. Loneliness is real, its a big problem, and it is something most remote companies don't talk about.

jborichevskiy 7y ago

The parts that stood out to me: (my team and I are currently seeing each other in person two full days every two weeks and the rest is remote) > 3. Not having to commute is a top benefit to remote workers Makes sense. Financial, health, and psychological benefits. > 4. Communication, collaboration, and loneliness continue to be top challenges for remote workers and remote organizations 100% agree. I typically have automatic transcriptions enabled (Google Meet) + a full resolution version of whatever document the person is talking presenting is editing. As for the loneliness aspect, while I don’t feel like I socialize that much during work, I have enough energy to go out and socialize after. This is a byproduct of a lot of things and not purely remote/not remote. > 5. The majority of organizations with remote workers don’t pay for monthly expenses associated with remote work Not sure about this one. I think part of the incentive for a company to go remote is savings. On the other hand, a standing desk and a good chair do wonders. Perhaps the savings from rent are enough to cover all of this- I’m not sure. Travel and expenses should be 100% reimbursed, no question.

noahtallen 7y ago
I mean, it’s the recurring costs that aren’t usually covered, like internet. My company is fully remote and I’m reimbursed for my home office equipment (computer, desk, chair, router, etc) and for all travel. Even for working from a coffee shop. But not for home internet.
- sunilkumarc 7y ago
  Great! Where do you work? If you don't mind me asking.
flamtap 7y ago
Regarding item 5: I think it can be a win-win. In my country at least (Canada), some of those savings are passed on to me. I can deduct from my taxes a portion of the following: rent, phone bill, internet bill, home utilities, essentially anything to do with me using my home as a workspace.

jameslk 7y ago

> Communication, collaboration, and loneliness continue to be top challenges for remote workers and remote organizations While probably years off and slightly dystopian, I'm interested to see how VR may change the remote communication and collaboration aspect. Stuff like ImmersedVR for the Quest (no affiliation) that allows you to be in the same virtual room as someone else, being able to glance over at their (virtual) screens by turning your head and having access to a digital whiteboard seems pretty scifi but are novel solutions to these problems.

mnm1 7y ago
I think video is mostly useless and VR will be even more so if only for the simple fact that many people cannot use it due to motion sickness. Better tech is unlikely to ever change that. (I can't even do 3d movies). I think chat and voice are plenty good and don't have all the drawbacks of a visual solution. I find not having to see people in real life, on video, or in VR to be one of the main advantages of remote work.

tyoma 7y ago

Glad this covers the good and bad aspects of remote work. One thing is missing though: the cost of an extra bedroom to use as an office. In many real estate markets, going from N to N+1 bedrooms is a considerable price increase.

JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
Some people set up desks in their living room / common areas. I haven't seen anybody pass judgment for not maintaining a separate, dedicated room for remote work.
- kingludite 7y ago
  I could see a room outfitted to spec become a standard some day. Starting with a working microphone.
ProZsolt 7y ago
I usually just work from my living room. You don't necessarily need a dedicated home office. Also, because you don't need to commute you can move farther from the city center or even to another cheaper city/town. So you can get an N+1 bedroom for the price of N or even cheaper.

gingerlime 7y ago

Interesting results and well written casual but sensical analysis. One thing that bothered me a bit though was the “product placements”. Were there any (financial or otherwise) incentives to publish those? If so, and even more so if there weren’t, I feel like this should have been more explicitly disclosed. Apologies if I skipped any disclosure inadvertently.

JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago

I was really skeptical of remote work before I took my first and current remote job, which surprisingly paid better than my former non-remote job. Conceptually, It was totally outside my Overton window. But having experienced it, my perspective completely changed. I don't mind doing a good job, but I underestimated how valuable the autonomy of my time would be, it's such a blessing. An occasional hour or two mid-day break really suits me. Those days, I am stretching my work day, but more relaxed and less stressed. My output is higher than working in an office.

ebg13 7y ago
> An occasional hour or two mid-day break really suits me. What...like lunch? I don't know any software engineer who doesn't regularly take more than an hour for lunch.
- JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
  When I worked at the office, "lunch" was available onsite from 11:30 to 1:30 and onsite was 30-90 minutes from my house, depending on a very wide range of traffic conditions. It can be food, it can be laundry, it can be errands. Things I couldn't squeeze in before.
  - blaser-waffle 7y ago
    I've made a habit of using "lunch" to make dinner, via a crockpot or slowcooker. As in, I work remote and use my "lunch break" to throw stew (or curry, or soup, or a roast, etc.) together and have that cook for the rest of the afternoon.
- kharak 7y ago
  I regularly do 15 to 30 minutes. In my current project, it's between 30 and 45 minutes due to socialising with coworkers. These minutes are not paid, meaning I have to stay longer at work, less free time. Long lunch almost always feels terrible to me. Short lunch is like a treat for myself. I've never seen engineers doing longer than 1 hour breaks at a regular basis. Even 1 hour is rare.

sdiw 7y ago

Interesting results. I am also a remote worker and glad to see this trend is picking up. Everything has upsides and downsides but upsides of working remotely outweigh downsides buy quite a margin. Not only working remotely gives peace of mind (little flexibility on working hours.); working in a familiar/comfortable environment increases productivity, especially for people like me who are a little uncomfortable when surrounded by other people. (bonus you can sit awkwardly in you PJs)

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plafl 7y ago

One of the main benefits for me (I would consider it in the "Ability to work from home" category mentioned in the article) is how much better is the environment at home: I don't need to use headphones to avoid getting distracted and distracting other people with remote calls, I can stream some relaxing music from my computer, my chair is great, I have a huge L-shaped table, I have ilumination the way I like it, temperature. I agree also with most of the other points in the article, both positive and negatives. Right now I work from home about 50% of the time, which I think is great. Most of the team also works remote part time, and anyway we are split between two cities (Madrid and Barcelona) so we must coordinate remotely even if we are at the office.

cs02rm0 7y ago
100%. The last 10 days I've been in an open plan office instead of my home office I've used for 8 years. I've had to trade a 5k ultrawide monitor for 1080p, an Aeron for a cheap chair the company bought secondhand, desk at a height that's comfortable for one that isn't (I'm 6'5), natural light for fluorescent and 500ppm of CO2 for 1200ppm+. And a 10 second walk for a 45 minute drive each way commute. I don't even think CO2 is on anyone's radar, but some complain of headaches and many seem really lethargic by late morning. And everyone in the office uses cloud software, but there's a distrust of remote working. I was hoping this battle would be won by now, I'm almost at the point of thinking it should be encouraged by legislation.
- awb 7y ago
  I started a fully remote company in 2008 and thought it was a matter of time until all new startups were fully remote. It's a win for the environment, productivity and much less overhead which means higher wages. Your hiring pool also increases substantially. We were successful but I'm surprised how many startups today still want to hire within a small radius of a physical office.
  - antupis 7y ago
    Personally I think initial seed-stage should be so that team is the same place, but when you want to scale remote team makes sense. I think the missing ingredient now is that there are not lots of examples and procedures on how to go remote, scale and manage remote teams.

sunilkumarc 7y ago

I'm currently working as a Senior Software Developer at a startup. I have been wanting to work remotely from my next job change. I'm from India where engineers generally get paid less compared to engineers in the United States and many European Countries. Although I'm not looking for the same salary as that of an US engineer, I'm looking for a pay something close to that amount. Is this the reality today? How many companies pay remote workers regardless of their location?

dep_b 7y ago
India means your time zone sucks. Working from Latin America I could get US$70,-/hour freelance but that was pretty much triple the median already. Experienced people in Poland earn 40-50 euro, they’re in a better time zone and are in economic and legal zone. Also hiring people on a fixed contract instead of freelance outside of “the civilized world” scares the shit out US businesses.
aws_ls 7y ago
> Although I'm not looking for the same salary as that of an US engineer, I'm looking for a pay something close to that amount. Is this the reality today? You can get close to that money in two ways, in my knowledge and experience. 1) Work for a FANG company (Only Amazon, Google are there, but there are others which pay well e.g. VMWare comes to mind now). 2) You join a good netork for freelancers. I currently work for one, and I make the amount, which fits your description of 'near US salary'. Since cost of living is low, it does feel like a high paying job.
- sunilkumarc 7y ago
  You mean you work a company? Or you work as a freelancer on platforms like Toptal, freelancer.in etc ?
  - aws_ls 7y ago
    I work for a Bay area Startup client via Toptal. PS: I didn't mention the name earlier, to avoid being taken as marketing for a platform. Now that you asked... :)

znq 7y ago

I've shared this a lot recently, sorry for doing it again, but usually the feedback we get is extremely positive: We've turned our internal wiki with processes and experiences from running a fully remote company for over 8 years in a nice digestible PDF: https://mobilejazz.com/company-handbook-pdf/ https://mobilejazz.com/company-handbook-pdf/

geewee 7y ago
For some reason, the design of the page made me sure that it was some sort of lead generation site. I was really surprised when I didn't have to put in my email to read the book.
- znq 7y ago
  While it wasn't the initial reason to create the company handbook, there are for sure marketing intentions behind the site and the handbook as well. Otherwise it wouldn't justify the effort of turning our internal wiki into a well designed PDF. But I believe giving it away for free and having people talking about it positively is already great for our brand. Actually by now I know this already for a fact, as many people have reached out to us because of this.
suigetsusake 7y ago
Thanks a lot for this reading its a lot of insight since il currently preparing to launch my own remote company and my vision of it align a lot with yours. Do you have any resources or tips for how to handle the financial and paperworks of having people from different countries ? Thats the thing im having the more trouble finding info about
- znq 7y ago
  Unfortunately that is a very difficult question to answer as it is very specific to your company's tax and legal residency and those of every single team member. In our case we offer proper employment where we have a legal entity and thus actually can employ team members. For people with tax residency in other countries the only somewhat non-bureaucratic and sustainable solution is for them to go self-employed and have a "consulting contract" with us. That said, regardless of the legal technicalities, we treat everyone the same.

datingscientist 7y ago

Not commuting is huge. That adds about 3 hours a day to my availability, when you consider the prep time and various other incidentals. One way to pitch it to the boss: savings on relo and the ability to tap into a much broader hiring pool. I'm seeing this now with a private equity group, where they've decided it is cheaper to hire operating talent nationally in major metro areas and let them commute / remote work vs. relocating everyone for a two or three year gig. (After which point, you're laid off in a small town where you're brand new... not a good thing; absolutely no way I would relo for this gig)

distantaidenn 7y ago

Tokyo salaryman reporting in. This is definitely the next career move for me if I stay corporate. I waste about 3 hours of potentially productive time each day -- not to mention the wind-up time necessary when sitting down to work. 1 hour morning prep to go out, 1 hour commute each way on central Toyko trains, and 30 odd minutes settling in at the office. Only to do exactly what I could be doing at home...At this point, I think telling developers the benefits of remote work is preaching to the choir.

jamesvandyne 7y ago
If you’re looking for a remote job in Japan it’s worth checking out the remote in Japan repo on GitHub. Heaps of good companies that do remote (including the one I work for). https://github.com/uiur/remote-in-japan/blob/master/README.en.md https://github.com/uiur/remote-in-japan/blob/master/README.e...
pinkfoot 7y ago
> 1 hour morning prep to go out What on earth are you doing?
- hnzix 7y ago
  Business clobber is a lot more hassle than throwing on jeans and a t-shirt. In a formal office environment it's best to look sharp and that takes some prep time.

foreigner 7y ago

This data is interesting but I'd love to see a similar survey done from the perspective of companies that employ remote workers.

dmontero 7y ago

In my previous job in Germany I could work remotely as much as I wanted. I would usually work from Spain, since is where I come from. It was close to ideal: having lunch in 30min and spending the other 30min at the pool or going for a short break to the beach (just 5min away). However I discovered that when I spent more than 1 or 2 weeks working remotely in a row I would start feeling detached from my job. It became increasingly difficult to be motivated and concentrated in certain tasks. In my current job employees can work remotely 1 day a week by default with possibility to extend it occasionally. I find this to work better for me personally. It allows me to be flexible and productive while working remotely and at the same time it keeps me engaged and connected with the challenges and goals at work.

asterisk_ 7y ago
How did the detachment manifest, if you don't mind sharing? Did you try to find an effective way to combat the lack of motivation, or was it just a matter of returning back to the office?
- dmontero 7y ago
  It manifested by having difficulties to work without interruptions. I got easily distracted with anything and found myself procrastinating more often. That's rare on me, since I usually can work in a flow mode for long periods of time. As it was discussed previously, procrastination seems like a way to manage emotions: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17878716 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17878716
  - asterisk_ 7y ago
    Interesting; the article resonates well. Thanks for taking the time to share.
ChuckNorris89 7y ago
May I ask hod did you find remote work in Germany? I noticed in my time there German companies were highly conservative and didn't want to hear about their employees not being present in the office.

iamthepieman 7y ago

I have worked 100% remote at two different jobs for the past 8 years. I gave upon remote work this week. I slowly entered a phase of resenting work and resenting my family and home life. They each slowly encroached on each other until I was not sleeping, not being productive at work, not engaged with my kids and generally hating life. I felt like I was a husk of a person, a cipher or automaton. Fortunately my company has an office 40 minutes away so I have the option to commute without changing jobs. Admittedly, I have some unique circumstances that probably put me in a tiny minority. I still think remote work is a great idea, it's just not for me anymore and I wish I had realized that 3 years ago.

sedgjh23 7y ago
A lot of people use work to get away from their families. Just be aware It can be an indicator of other problems in your life. In all of my relationships (friends, family, romantic) I’ve observed that people usually severely undervalue personal time and are unwilling to commit to taking care of themselves. Good luck and I hope the office life brings you some happiness. I sometimes find myself jealous of those with commutes that get to chip away at their podcast queues daily.

BrandoElFollito 7y ago

I think that to some point larger companies who do not have a good time management are the most scared by remote work. The idea of someone slacking off freely at home is probably less bearable than slacking off at the office.

RickJWagner 7y ago

I've been working remote 10 years now. I love it. I am surprised, though. One major downfall wasn't listed-- the remote worker is not 'completely plugged in' with the rest of the team (if they are co-located). That little bit of drag brings some inefficiencies. But for me, remote work is now a 'must have'.

claudiulodro 7y ago

Is the average remote job paid significantly less than the average local job? Is the HN trope that every developer should be making $150k+ simply wrong? Curious how to reconcile this data with the giganto salaries everyone here is always talking about getting. I like the remote lifestyle OK, but am I shooting myself in the (salary) foot by working remotely? > Below is the breakdown of salary ranges for respondents in USD. > 18.6% $50,001 to $75,000 > 16.8% $75,001 to $100,000 > 14.2% $25,001 to $50,000 > 12.1% up to $25,000 > 12% $100,000 to $125,000 > 10.8% $125,001 to $150,000 > 9.7% $150,001 to $200,000 > 5.9% Over $200,000

sheepybloke 7y ago
One thing that's come up with remote work is missing out on promotion, since you aren't as naturally visible to your manager or boss. So, if you are working remotely, you might not want to be full time to make sure to get some of that visibility. (I know this isn't directly related to the question, but it's something to consider)

apercu 7y ago

I have worked remotely for 5 years, and for 3 years previously. Let's say I have been working for 25 years. That means 32% of my career has been spent working remotely. And it's been the most productive and personally satisfying part of my career. But, note when I say remote it's "work from home most of the time" remote. Not work in some other country on the other side of the world remote. I do in person meetings with clients and partners a couple times a month.

phaedrus 7y ago

The place I worked at before my current employer had a bizarre attitude to remote work. Our manager was strongly skeptical of work from home, but half of our team was distributed in branch offices which were effectively remote work! I worked in one of these satellite offices, so I had all of the collaboration difficulties and none of the upsides (still had to come in. To an open plan office.) After a bunch of people left I got promoted to lead developer, but I was the only one left in the branch office. The rest of my team was concentrated in HQ a couple hours' drive away. The manager and software architect (his right-hand man) still micromanaged technical decisions. I couldn't get ahold of them for weeks at a time as they were so overbooked, but my team members could occasionally corner them for hallway conversations. So I'd get asked something, have to make a best guess judgement since I couldn't ask them, someone else would corner them and they'd tell them the opposite of what I decided. But I wouldn't find out about this until we went to integrate something and found the two halves had been implemented to different directions.

downerending 7y ago

I'd love to work remotely. To date, though, there seems to be a very strong bias from employers in not doing so. Simply being in the office looks "busy", while not being in the office looks like slacking, regardless of what's actually getting done. Quoting Allen, 80% of life really is just showing up. For better or worse.

xtracto 7y ago
Tell me about it... as a technical leader at the startup I work on, I would love to be remote and for my team to be remote (we are kind of remote as we are collocated in 2 offices in different countries). But the CEO and HR department do not believe in remote teams. It is the one thing that I struggle with and will change in a heartbeat.
- downerending 7y ago
  I've learned to look at the bright side. Any day I drag my ass in I'm scoring an 80% right out of the box. I'd feel guilty not much getting done on a day remotely, but for some reason I don't feel it much when I'm at my desk.