8 ms·
Crypto AG
- et2o 7y agoRelated discussion here in WaPo article that broke some of this story: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22297963 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22297963
- pzumk 7y agoThank you, I knew I’ve seen this already on HN.
- netsharc 7y agoThis is the 2nd day that an HN post is just a link to a Wikipedia page (yesterday it was the page about the COVID-19 whistle-blower doctor). It feels obnoxious, expecting the reader to know the context behind the title.
- andrewnc 7y agoAh, my mistake. I hadn't seen that post. I read about it this morning in a newsletter and figured I would share the Wiki post.
- pluc 7y agoWhat's scary is if they willingly admitted to this, they've secured other means of decryption. American-owned technology can't be trusted any more than Chinese-owned technology.
- hn3333 7y agoPersonally, I do however have more faith in the secret agencies of western democracies than China. So all things being equal, right now I'd prefer Americans and Germans spied on me.
- DennisP 7y agoI'd rather be an American spied on by American secret agencies, than a citizen of China spied on by China. However, as a citizen and resident of America I'd rather be spied on by China, because it's a lot easier for my own government to make trouble for me.
- whatshisface 7y agoFurther, you are likely to get people to rally against China's spying, whereas a significant fraction of Americans want you to be spied on (because they can't distinguish between the people and their government).
- Areading314 7y agoDont be so sure. Plenty of retribution can be achieved online and unlawfully
- eska 7y agoThe American government is not going to steal your company's secrets and give them to other companies, the Chinese government in fact does.
- siv- 7y agoThe US has also engages in economic espionage.
- janvidar 7y agoIsn't this just a "...but, I have nothing to hide" argument? The values of the regimes in control are transient and ever changing. You might be okay with it right now - but maybe not in the near future.
- pzumk 7y agoYou’re probably wondering why this is relevant right now. > In 2020, an investigation carried out by the Washington Post, Zweites Deutsches Fernsehen (ZDF), and Schweizer Radio und Fernsehen (SRF) revealed that Crypto AG was, in fact, entirely controlled by the CIA and the BND. The project, initially known by codename "Thesaurus" and later as "Rubicon" operated from the end of the Second World War until 2018.
- marsRoverDev 7y agoSo can we assume that companies touched by In-Q-Tel are compromised to the same level as Crypto AG was? I'd like to collate a list.
- acklenx 7y agoWell that's easy, they've done it for you: https://www.iqt.org/portfolio/ https://www.iqt.org/portfolio/
- maqp 7y agoThe number of companies I've never heard of there is quite amazing. I'd really like to know how many of these are about data science/analytics.
- archi42 7y agoInteresting list. Besides Palantir, I know these: GitLab, Databricks, MemSQL and mongoDB. I don't think "they" are using these to exfiltrate data "Crypto AG" style - I'd be surprised if "big data"/data science wasn't part of their operations, hence it makes sense to invest into some of their core tools. This ensures sustained development and maybe catering to CIA-specific edge cases. Judging by the company names: Investments into RF companies also are more likely on the "tools we use" instead of the "rigged" side of things. The amount of Biotech makes me assume the decision-makers think this is an emerging market which will make a good investment. So answering to GP: No, not compromised. I wouldn't be surprised if there were one or maybe even two hiding in plain sight, but I think for each individual company on that list, it is very, very, very unlikely that this specific company is compromised. If you don't trust them, make your sensitive GitLab and MongoDB instances accessible via Intranet/VPN only - but I suppose that's good practice anyway?
- gowld 7y agoIn-Q-Tel is for companies that spy brazenly and legally without trying to hide it
- Ansil849 7y agoThe fact that Crypto AG was an intelligence front has been publicly known since at least the 1990s [1]. Why did the Washington Post rehash this story recently and pass it off as news? I'm glad that they did, because it spreads awareness - I'm just confused as to why. [1] https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-xpm-1995-12-10-1995344001-story.html https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-xpm-1995-12-10-19953440...
- rapsey 7y agoYou can be sure it servers someones agenda.
- mxcrossb 7y agoBecause of the new released documents. It says exactly this in their story. And why is it every time some article comes out about US spying, there is always someone complaining that they knew this all along? Good for you?
- Ansil849 7y agoIt's not that "I knew it all along", it's that this was a well-covered story that was already news in the '90s, based on documents as well, e.g. from the Baltimore Sun: > For years, NSA secretly rigged Crypto AG machines so that U.S. eavesdroppers could easily break their codes, according to former company employees whose story is supported by company documents. See also the 1992 news stories about the arrest of Hans Buehler [1], further elaborated in a 1998 article in Covert Action Quarterly [2]: > The cover shielding the NSA-Crypto AG relationship was torn in March 1992, when the Iranian military counterintelligence service arrested Hans Buehler, Crypto AG's marketing representative in Teheran. [1] https://www.upi.com/Archives/1992/03/30/Iran-arrests-Swiss-man-for-espionage/7727701931600/ https://www.upi.com/Archives/1992/03/30/Iran-arrests-Swiss-m... [2] http://mediafilter.org/caq/cryptogate/ http://mediafilter.org/caq/cryptogate/
- Tenoke 7y agoYet some nations, companies and the later owner weren't convinced that's the case until much later. As the Post's story mentions.
- kzrdude 7y agoIt says Crypto AG relocated to Switzerland to escape being nationalised by the Swedish government. How fun then, that it ended up being wholly state owned anyway.
- vearwhershuh 7y agoNo worries, though, I'm sure intelligence agencies weren't smart enough to get out ahead of things like search, social networks, password storage services and VPNs.
- inscionent 7y agoLike Facebook taking money from CIA In-Q-Tel?
- bobowzki 7y ago> Buehler was interrogated for nine months but, being completely unaware of any flaw in the machines, was released in January 1993 after Crypto AG posted bail of $1m to Iran.[10] Soon after Buehler's release Crypto AG dismissed him and charged him the $1m. Well that was an asshole move.
- NohatCoder 7y agoThe really good question is: What are they compromising now? We can't know for sure, but I'd wager that most quantum cryptography companies have been well greased by spy agencies who expect to be paid back in backdoors.
- kbenson 7y agoThe company’s importance to the global security market had fallen by then, squeezed by the spread of online encryption technology. Once the province of governments and major corporations, strong encryption is now as ubiquitous as apps on cellphones. Ah. That puts the export on cryptography limitations in perspective. Don't allow new tech to compete with the source of a lot of valuable intel.
- DrScientist 7y agoA timely reminder that democracies should avoid using voting machines....