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It may be a case of German government's right hand not knowing what German government's left hand is doing. An open source distributed framework can't be coerce

It may be a case of German government's right hand not knowing what German government's left hand is doing. An open source distributed framework can't be coerced into routing its messages through a central server for surveillance.

TrickyRick 7y ago
That's a good point!
ge0rg 7y ago
Open Source and centralized are orthogonal to each other. Signal is both, just to name an example. An open push framework only makes sense (for battery optimization at least) if it's centralized, and all applications make use of it.
- ryukafalz 7y ago
  >An open push framework only makes sense (for battery optimization at least) if it's centralized, and all applications make use of it. Sure, from the perspective of a single device. But that doesn't mean all devices have to use the same push server.
  - ge0rg 7y ago
    So as an app developer, I need to integrate each of those into my app, or provide alternative builds for all?
    - lern_too_spel 7y ago
      No, you need to use a library that allows the user to configure the push server, which should be configured device-wide and communicated to the app server.
      - ryukafalz 7y ago
        Exactly. I believe this is how Web Push works; the major browser vendors each run their own push servers, and the protocol is standardized.
- hnjst 7y ago
  While Signal client app source is open, the server side isn't and the global system (and Moxie in particular) is notoriously hostile to federation or any sort of free interoperability. For a communication network, this reduces the benefits of openness to almost nothing, and, at least from my PoV, do not bring any kind of freedom or security to the users. While I can imagine a free ecosystem being somehow centralized, I firmly believe that Signal is on the contrary an illustration of centralization imposed against user freedom which suggest that these properties may not be so orthogonal.

TrickyRick 7y ago

That's a good point!

ge0rg 7y ago

Open Source and centralized are orthogonal to each other. Signal is both, just to name an example. An open push framework only makes sense (for battery optimization at least) if it's centralized, and all applications make use of it.

ryukafalz 7y ago
>An open push framework only makes sense (for battery optimization at least) if it's centralized, and all applications make use of it. Sure, from the perspective of a single device. But that doesn't mean all devices have to use the same push server.
- ge0rg 7y ago
  So as an app developer, I need to integrate each of those into my app, or provide alternative builds for all?
  - lern_too_spel 7y ago
    No, you need to use a library that allows the user to configure the push server, which should be configured device-wide and communicated to the app server.
    - ryukafalz 7y ago
      Exactly. I believe this is how Web Push works; the major browser vendors each run their own push servers, and the protocol is standardized.
hnjst 7y ago
While Signal client app source is open, the server side isn't and the global system (and Moxie in particular) is notoriously hostile to federation or any sort of free interoperability. For a communication network, this reduces the benefits of openness to almost nothing, and, at least from my PoV, do not bring any kind of freedom or security to the users. While I can imagine a free ecosystem being somehow centralized, I firmly believe that Signal is on the contrary an illustration of centralization imposed against user freedom which suggest that these properties may not be so orthogonal.