6 ms·

How to play the guitar by ear, for mathematicians and physicists (2000) [pdf]

149 points by lelf 7y ago

ajuc 7y ago
It doesn't work for chords for me, but for playing the melody by ear without any talent whatsoever there's a very simple trick that my uncle (who's a proffesional musician and plays many instruments) taught me in less than 1 hour: 1. start with any note (don't need to be in the same key as the original song - if you don't have absolute hearing just don't worry about that) 2. remember the song you're trying to play in your head and consider if the next note sounds higher in your head than the first one or lower 3. guess how much higher/lower and try to play it quietly - usually 2 or 3 tones is a good guess, if it's not 2 try 3 if it's not 3 try 1, etc. - it sounds bad after the first note if you hit the wrong one so you will know when you hit the right one, and there's not that many reasonable options, usually you will get it in 2 or 3 tries 4. when it sounds good you know it's the right note so you hit it hard to have a reference fresh in your memory and go to the next note in your head and repeat the steps This is all you need to learn to play any melody from hearing it by trying it for 15 minutes or so. Eventually you get very good at guessing the intervals and can play any melody by ear in real time I still can't play chords by ear (I can kinda cheat by playing chords based on every second note in the melody or so - it isn't dissonant but sound meh).
- leetrout 7y ago
  This is when I learned I really am tone deaf. I have an extremely difficult time deciding if something is higher or lower in my head. I can tell something isn’t right when I play them but I can’t discern how much it’s off nor if it’s higher or lower if it’s really close.
  - ajuc 7y ago
    Try moving the throat as if you were humming "happy birthday" but not pushing the air with your lungs. Your throat will constrict for higher notes more. Or maybe just try humming, dunno. In the end you don't really need the step 2 - you can try +2,-2, +3, -3, +1, -1, ... it will only slow you down by by a factor of 2 and you will train yourself to recognize the differences eventually anyway.
  - Thorrez 7y ago
    I generally only would have trouble if there are multiple notes played simultaneously (I can't figure out which one to focus on), or if they are different instruments (the different timber distracts from the pitch). This reminds me of this test about whether you can tell if one pitch is higher or lower than another: http://jakemandell.com/adaptivepitch/ http://jakemandell.com/adaptivepitch/ Unfortunately it requires Flash. Maybe I should try to duplicate it with webaudio.
    - leetrout 7y ago
      Well I found this one: https://www.nidcd.nih.gov/tunestest/hearing-test-results-0 https://www.nidcd.nih.gov/tunestest/hearing-test-results-0 > You correctly identified 25 tunes (out of 26) on the Distorted Tunes Test. Congratulations! That was easier tho because it was identifying very popular tunes that were off.
- maroonblazer 7y ago
  I'd argue that spending a few weeks learning/absorbing scale degrees and some basic theory will enable you to learn any melody in much shorter time.
  - ajuc 7y ago
    Well it worked for me. Would you learn to play a melody be ear if you just learn the music theory? You still have to practice, right?
    - sosborn 7y ago
      > Would you learn to play a melody be ear if you just learn the music theory? Learning the theory gives a framework for your brain to work in. It's helpful because it gives you incredible hints as to what the next note in the melody is. > You still have to practice, right? Scales/theory should be a part of practice.
    - tobr 7y ago
      It’s all about getting an intuitive connection between your ears and the instrument. The same kind of intuition most people naturally have for their voice to some degree. Music theory can give you some tools to start thinking in terms of scales and harmony, but I think the intuition for it can only come from playing.
- tobr 7y ago
  This sounds frustrating. But it made me appreciate my own musicality, which maybe I take for granted too often. Know that it’s a lot like learning to read, or learning to touch type. You struggle for a long time, but it gets better, and once you get past a certain threshold your body just does it for you.
  - ajuc 7y ago
    > This sounds frustrating. Not really. It's like a game - you get instant feedback and after a while you learn a new song.
zokier 7y ago
> The particular selection of notes used for a song is called the “key.” It is also called a “scale.” For a piece written in the key of C, the notes that are used are A B C D E F G. For a piece written in the key of F, the notes are F G A Bflat C D E. I will say more about keys later on, and why most music is based on a scale of just eight notes I'm not sure if I'm missing something, but why does he repeatedly refer scales having eight notes when (common Western) scales have seven notes, like the examples he gives?
- ajuc 7y ago
  He seems to include the first note from the next octave, because that's how it is on flute, and because one easy way to make a song ending sound final is to repeat the first note octave higher.
- jachee 7y ago
  It's about playing by ear. Play only the first seven notes of a scale, and you'll likely find that your ear really wants that 8th tone to resolve it.
  - zokier 7y ago
    Isn't that simply because of the final half-step in major scale, and as such dependant on the scale/mode played? For example in mixolydian has full step in the end so it should not have such tension towards the octave
jackkinsella 7y ago
This is something I struggled with for longer than I should have. For me, the turning point was just diving in and practicing playing along with real songs every day until the patterns became clearer. No matter who uncomfortable and hopeless it felt at first. I recommend going to HookTheory and working your way through every song you're familiar with in the "beginner" section. These songs tend to stick to the big four chords (I IV V vi) and once you nail them, you're half-way there for most pop and rock. https://www.hooktheory.com/theorytab/difficulties/beginner https://www.hooktheory.com/theorytab/difficulties/beginner You'll make more progress doing that for an hour a day over a month than you will in five years of theory.
- wyclif 7y ago
  Another thing that will help you get good fast is that after learning I-IV-V-VI, learn how to play those chords everywhere they can be played on the neck.
- dehrmann 7y ago
  > patterns verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge-chorus. Except Aerosmith. Chorus. All chorus. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV9-n-2x8ww&start=105 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV9-n-2x8ww&start=105
palae 7y ago
I really enjoy the fact that the seemingly simple equation 2^n = 3^p has so much implication for how me make music.
fallingfrog 7y ago
I sort of feel like playing or singing by ear is one of those things that you can either just do, or you can’t. I remember being 8 years old and standing next to my parents in church, and noticing the choir singing in harmony, I would invent my own harmony line to go with it. It never seemed difficult at all but I don’t think I could explain what I was doing. Most skills can be taught but in my experience when it comes to music, you’ve either got it, or you don’t. If you’ve got it, you know you’ve got it. It’s just easy the same way that walking or talking is easy, but easier, because I could hum on key before I could talk.
- cousin_it 7y ago
  I sang off key for years, then found an exercise that worked (humming scales while away from the instrument), and a couple months later I found myself being very on key, harmonizing on the fly, noticing tiny off-key moments in popular songs, and getting compliments about "talent". So I think a lot of these skills are just taught wrong. You can teach an untalented person to "get it" - Betty Edwards' books famously do that for drawing skill - but for many skills the right method of teaching hasn't been found yet. It's easier to pick & choose students who already "got it" and then take credit for their success (like most music education, and higher education in general) than to research teaching methods that will work on more people.
- djaychela 7y ago
  I don't agree with this - I think that practicing your listening skills will make a huge difference in this area. I've been teaching guitar and music technology for about 20 years (and playing for 35), and it all comes from practice if you haven't got perfect pitch (I don't). Doing ear-training drills (listening for intervals, starting out with a simple one, such as the difference between an octave and a fifth) and slowly building on this so that you can quickly (and eventually, instantly) tell the difference between any of the diatonic intervals makes a huge difference. I've had kids who started out literally not able to know if a note was 'up' or 'down' from a previous one eventually be able to accurately discern any of the 12 semitone steps in an octave up or down, just by weekly practice using GNU solfege. Yes, some just 'get it' and don't know what they're doing - particularly with the voice - but most need fine-tuning and practice both in their heads and on their instruments, but after doing it for long enough it's possible to get really, really good at it.
lvturner 7y ago
On the fourth page he talks a bit about inability to sing a certain note. My first ever exposure to learning an instrument was a particularly cruel violin teacher - before he would let me pick up the violin he pressed a note on the piano and have everyone sing it. Everyone could do it, except to my shock, me. We went through this routine for weeks, (while my friends were actually being taught how to play their instruments) every time I sang I knew I was singing the wrong note - the problem wasn't that I couldn't hear the note, it was that I couldn't replicate it with my voice - I also couldn't fathom what the relationship between singing and violin playing was (and still couldn't until I wrote this up where I see now that it is obvious, but hilariously misguided) - but I persisited, fighting back tears of frustration until I eventually got right. I still can't play violin - but I do have a lifetime hatred of singing.
- markvdb 7y ago
  Pro guitar teacher her. TLDR: Pitch skills are incredibly hard to reliably improve. Inability to vocally reproduce pitch is a reliable filter for limited musical talent, _but_ it should always be used together with other filters because on its own, it produces some very important false positives. Your teacher was being lazy filtering students based on just that filter. He was probably trying to discourage you from continuing to study with him. That's cruel, the opposite of what a good teacher should be, whatever your abilities. You being able to catch the right frequency, but not being able to reproduce it by voice is very rare, but not unheard of! Anecdotal evidence: I had a friend at music conservatory with perfect pitch hearing, and zero pitch control of his vocal cords. Our professors came to this conclusion in very early screening. Another interesting to know is that there are incredibly many pro musicians who have less than optimal pitch recognition. I'll tell you even more: most are bad at recognising chords, let alone imagining them. I can tell, because I'm in the top decile of pro musicians on this. And before you think I'm bragging, I'll admit I'm situated much lower when it comes to fine motor skills...
  - lvturner 7y ago
    Yes - it took me a long time to realise he was cruel and lazy, years later I picked up the saxophone and was always lauded for my intonation. I can hear the notes (and I also seem to be way more sensitive to key clashes than anyone else I know) I just can't sing very well.
troughway 7y ago
Maybe I missed something but he never actually addresses how to play by ear. I opened the PDF and started reading, and eventually found myself jumping past the mathematical harmonic mumbo-jumbo and into the good stuff, and unfortunately I was disappointed. He ended up covering the basics of Music Theory found in a lot of books with no real application to ear training. 1) Learning Material I can sympathize with the author's plight about not having access to good learning materials or schools. For those who want to pick up guitar and want a bit of extra "why things are the way they are" explanations, I have found books such as "Fretboard Logic" and "The Advancing Guitarist" to be useful. There are plenty more, like Ted Greene's "Chord Chemistry" and whatnot that have insight on ear training. Also, you have software today like Ear Master, Rocksmith and others that can help and are fun as well. YouTube is full of backing tracks that you can use to practice and hear how various notes, phrasings, melodies sound on top of the backing chords. 2) Notes Personally I have not found using "natural" note names to be that useful; using relative note names like root, second, third is to me much more functional, because the third of any key sounds like a third. The whole "returning to _root_" thing he mentions should be hint enough. 3) Ear Training His story of his dad being a multi-instrumentalist struck a chord with me (sorry). I have friends and teachers who are like this and I've come to believe that it's less about knowing any of what he is talking about (although it is important) and more about their storytelling ability and translating it over into music. I doubt his dad was a shredder, but his dad's ability to pick up and play an instrument wowed him all the same. To put another way - most people are lucky if they can passably play one instrument. The question is, how is it that there are people that can pick up an instrument and leave an impression on others? I doubt they have a massive IQ or some arcane knowledge of music theory. Storytelling and Composition are the same thing. All the high brow shit about Principles of Composition and Counterpoint and whatnot does not matter. Being able to evoke imagery in someone's mind or make them feel a certain way with music is something that the first half of the author's paper cannot begin to rationalize. I believe it's important to really _hear_ the music you are listening to. It doesn't matter if there are no vocals explicitly telling you how to feel (ie. pop music); it is on you to allow yourself to engage with what you're hearing and to eventually formulate an opinion on how something sounds and how it makes you feel. I've heard music teachers expressing this sentiment, and it's no surprise that it goes over most people's heads. It's not a subject for the dabblers. Composers for film, Classical composers etc excel at this. Learning from them is a masterclass in both ear training and storytelling. They've written plenty of books on this subject. Take a song you know, and start hearing it on a deeper level. Start transcribing it first by singing/humming/whistling along to it and then with your instrument. Take a chunk of it, and alter it in some way. Slow it down, add vibrato if there isn't already, elongate certain passages. I can't stress enough listening to music that actually tries to tell a story, because that's when you will hear the most _functional_ use of chord changes, progressions, melodies and vocals, which will ultimately aid in your ear training abilities and answer "why" better than the first half of the paper. Yes, you still have to sit down and woodshed (scales, progressions, metronome practice, etc) and whatnot, but that's assumed to be the case. PS. Lastly, you can find most of his mathematical explanations on Music Theory Stack Exchange. None of it will help you play by ear any better.
jng 7y ago
I have been a software developer for 35 years (started learning in 1985, I've accomplished several pretty successful things in this time), and it's also taken me over three decades to become a good musician (which I've only allowed myself to call my self very, very recently - I play piano and sing, a little bit of guitar and drums too). Programming and music are very different beasts, both very tough, both very worthwhile. I just wanted to post because the documenta above has a lot of great information (on a quick browse) and I'm sure it's filled with good intentions, but it's a very poor way to learn music. If you're a mathematician or physicist or software engineer trying to learn how to play the guitar, be it by ear or in any other way, it's not going to cut it. It's great if you read it and learn the information, but only the last 6 pages or so really talk about actually playing, and they are not going to teach you. If you want to learn to write and play music, don't delve into the math except as a side project. Learn to play a few simple songs that you like, using 3-4 simple chords (there are a ton of tutorials for that), and then spend 1,000 hours playing around on the vicinity of that musical environment. There is no shortcut, it is not about learning patterns, music is a different language, and learning music is about awakening your musical self. Learning to accompany yourself while you sing a few songs needs no understanding of the mathematical foundations at all (and they don't really help), it's mostly about learning a few basic patterns (3-4 chord finger positions) and then being good at performing (mostly tied to self-confidence). Learning to play common songs doesn't take much more. Learning to improvise and to write your own songs requires 1,000+ hours of the type of "playing/dancing/exploring" I was mentioning above. You'll learn the theory on the 10% of those 1,000 hours that you are resting and browsing the internet.
- sibeliuss 7y ago
  > Learning to improvise and to write your own songs requires 1,000+ hours of the type of "playing/dancing/exploring" I was mentioning above. You'll learn the theory on the 10% of those 1,000 hours that you are resting and browsing the internet. This has been my experience as well. When I first started I thought I would rush into the theory and that would allow me to improvise, but what was lacking was the playing of songs and getting a feel for the music. Learning the theory was easy -- getting a basketful of songs under my belt and then getting good at playing them took much longer, and required much more effort -- and now improvising comes more naturally, including being able to use use my ears to hear things like keys, intervals and so on. Practice, practice, practice! Learn a lot of different songs well, and fully understand the Circle of 5ths.
arh68 7y ago
I think light gauge strings tune just fine, and non-12-tone music might be interesting (I want to hear it, though, not read about it) I'm an average guitar player, and I don't teach. If you want to play a song, of course pull up the tab/gpro/songbook. But find video of the original artist playing it, look on youtube for the "guitar track" version (no vocals, drums), and try to see where they play/"voice" their chords and how they dish out upstrokes / downstrokes, these things are very subtle when heard. If you can find a video of the original guitarist teaching you their own song on their own guitar, almost nothing can beat that. Do Not look at your hands! (play in the dark if you have to) Play the song on the computer, and just try to follow.
christiansakai 7y ago
I accidentally discovered playing by ear. So I play acoustic/electric guitar and electric bass. It helps if you like to sing and actually have a decent singing voice. I am a Christian. One of our daily activities is to just pray and sing Christian music (we call this activity worship) every morning after wake up and every night before bed. One of my friend at church taught me Nashville number system. However he told only one key, G to me since that was the easiest. I began to just look for worship music that I can play and sing comfortably in G. I found around 3-5 songs and did that daily. After a month, I realized that I did not need to look at the chord book anymore because I memorized it. Then my friend taught me other keys such as C. Then I tried to transcribe the songs that I already know to C and played it and tried to sing it as best as I can. Since those songs weren’t comfortable to be sung in C I tried to find 3 other songs, then proceed for another month to just play these. Then my friend taught me D, and then he mentioned that if I know how to play D then playing E is just moving it up. Then he told me that I already knew A because it is just G moved up. So I began to play around with various type of songs, slow and fast, and suddenly everything click, because it seems that majority of Christian music are 90% the same. I developed an ear for knowing which chord to play at what key. It is really not that hard. It is like driving. Hard at first but once you got it you got it. I applied this technique to bass as well. It is mostly just patterns. I have successfully taught one student this technique. She actually did it faster than me. I acquired CAGED keys by ear in about 6 months, around 1 key per month. she managed to play just in key of E in 2 weeks. Granted, she practiced longer than me daily.
amparanoid 7y ago
For those who want to know the whys of Music Theory, without math: https://books.google.com.br/books/about/Theory_of_Harmony.html?id=5Y5MyjbU87oC&redir_esc=y https://books.google.com.br/books/about/Theory_of_Harmony.ht... This book has all explanations you need. The best monography in subject

149 points by lelf 7y ago

ajuc 7y ago

It doesn't work for chords for me, but for playing the melody by ear without any talent whatsoever there's a very simple trick that my uncle (who's a proffesional musician and plays many instruments) taught me in less than 1 hour: 1. start with any note (don't need to be in the same key as the original song - if you don't have absolute hearing just don't worry about that) 2. remember the song you're trying to play in your head and consider if the next note sounds higher in your head than the first one or lower 3. guess how much higher/lower and try to play it quietly - usually 2 or 3 tones is a good guess, if it's not 2 try 3 if it's not 3 try 1, etc. - it sounds bad after the first note if you hit the wrong one so you will know when you hit the right one, and there's not that many reasonable options, usually you will get it in 2 or 3 tries 4. when it sounds good you know it's the right note so you hit it hard to have a reference fresh in your memory and go to the next note in your head and repeat the steps This is all you need to learn to play any melody from hearing it by trying it for 15 minutes or so. Eventually you get very good at guessing the intervals and can play any melody by ear in real time I still can't play chords by ear (I can kinda cheat by playing chords based on every second note in the melody or so - it isn't dissonant but sound meh).

leetrout 7y ago
This is when I learned I really am tone deaf. I have an extremely difficult time deciding if something is higher or lower in my head. I can tell something isn’t right when I play them but I can’t discern how much it’s off nor if it’s higher or lower if it’s really close.
- ajuc 7y ago
  Try moving the throat as if you were humming "happy birthday" but not pushing the air with your lungs. Your throat will constrict for higher notes more. Or maybe just try humming, dunno. In the end you don't really need the step 2 - you can try +2,-2, +3, -3, +1, -1, ... it will only slow you down by by a factor of 2 and you will train yourself to recognize the differences eventually anyway.
- Thorrez 7y ago
  I generally only would have trouble if there are multiple notes played simultaneously (I can't figure out which one to focus on), or if they are different instruments (the different timber distracts from the pitch). This reminds me of this test about whether you can tell if one pitch is higher or lower than another: http://jakemandell.com/adaptivepitch/ http://jakemandell.com/adaptivepitch/ Unfortunately it requires Flash. Maybe I should try to duplicate it with webaudio.
  - leetrout 7y ago
    Well I found this one: https://www.nidcd.nih.gov/tunestest/hearing-test-results-0 https://www.nidcd.nih.gov/tunestest/hearing-test-results-0 > You correctly identified 25 tunes (out of 26) on the Distorted Tunes Test. Congratulations! That was easier tho because it was identifying very popular tunes that were off.
maroonblazer 7y ago
I'd argue that spending a few weeks learning/absorbing scale degrees and some basic theory will enable you to learn any melody in much shorter time.
- ajuc 7y ago
  Well it worked for me. Would you learn to play a melody be ear if you just learn the music theory? You still have to practice, right?
  - sosborn 7y ago
    > Would you learn to play a melody be ear if you just learn the music theory? Learning the theory gives a framework for your brain to work in. It's helpful because it gives you incredible hints as to what the next note in the melody is. > You still have to practice, right? Scales/theory should be a part of practice.
  - tobr 7y ago
    It’s all about getting an intuitive connection between your ears and the instrument. The same kind of intuition most people naturally have for their voice to some degree. Music theory can give you some tools to start thinking in terms of scales and harmony, but I think the intuition for it can only come from playing.
tobr 7y ago
This sounds frustrating. But it made me appreciate my own musicality, which maybe I take for granted too often. Know that it’s a lot like learning to read, or learning to touch type. You struggle for a long time, but it gets better, and once you get past a certain threshold your body just does it for you.
- ajuc 7y ago
  > This sounds frustrating. Not really. It's like a game - you get instant feedback and after a while you learn a new song.

zokier 7y ago

> The particular selection of notes used for a song is called the “key.” It is also called a “scale.” For a piece written in the key of C, the notes that are used are A B C D E F G. For a piece written in the key of F, the notes are F G A Bflat C D E. I will say more about keys later on, and why most music is based on a scale of just eight notes I'm not sure if I'm missing something, but why does he repeatedly refer scales having eight notes when (common Western) scales have seven notes, like the examples he gives?

ajuc 7y ago
He seems to include the first note from the next octave, because that's how it is on flute, and because one easy way to make a song ending sound final is to repeat the first note octave higher.
jachee 7y ago
It's about playing by ear. Play only the first seven notes of a scale, and you'll likely find that your ear really wants that 8th tone to resolve it.
- zokier 7y ago
  Isn't that simply because of the final half-step in major scale, and as such dependant on the scale/mode played? For example in mixolydian has full step in the end so it should not have such tension towards the octave

jackkinsella 7y ago

This is something I struggled with for longer than I should have. For me, the turning point was just diving in and practicing playing along with real songs every day until the patterns became clearer. No matter who uncomfortable and hopeless it felt at first. I recommend going to HookTheory and working your way through every song you're familiar with in the "beginner" section. These songs tend to stick to the big four chords (I IV V vi) and once you nail them, you're half-way there for most pop and rock. https://www.hooktheory.com/theorytab/difficulties/beginner https://www.hooktheory.com/theorytab/difficulties/beginner You'll make more progress doing that for an hour a day over a month than you will in five years of theory.

wyclif 7y ago
Another thing that will help you get good fast is that after learning I-IV-V-VI, learn how to play those chords everywhere they can be played on the neck.
dehrmann 7y ago
> patterns verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge-chorus. Except Aerosmith. Chorus. All chorus. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV9-n-2x8ww&start=105 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV9-n-2x8ww&start=105

palae 7y ago

I really enjoy the fact that the seemingly simple equation 2^n = 3^p has so much implication for how me make music.

fallingfrog 7y ago

I sort of feel like playing or singing by ear is one of those things that you can either just do, or you can’t. I remember being 8 years old and standing next to my parents in church, and noticing the choir singing in harmony, I would invent my own harmony line to go with it. It never seemed difficult at all but I don’t think I could explain what I was doing. Most skills can be taught but in my experience when it comes to music, you’ve either got it, or you don’t. If you’ve got it, you know you’ve got it. It’s just easy the same way that walking or talking is easy, but easier, because I could hum on key before I could talk.

cousin_it 7y ago
I sang off key for years, then found an exercise that worked (humming scales while away from the instrument), and a couple months later I found myself being very on key, harmonizing on the fly, noticing tiny off-key moments in popular songs, and getting compliments about "talent". So I think a lot of these skills are just taught wrong. You can teach an untalented person to "get it" - Betty Edwards' books famously do that for drawing skill - but for many skills the right method of teaching hasn't been found yet. It's easier to pick & choose students who already "got it" and then take credit for their success (like most music education, and higher education in general) than to research teaching methods that will work on more people.
djaychela 7y ago
I don't agree with this - I think that practicing your listening skills will make a huge difference in this area. I've been teaching guitar and music technology for about 20 years (and playing for 35), and it all comes from practice if you haven't got perfect pitch (I don't). Doing ear-training drills (listening for intervals, starting out with a simple one, such as the difference between an octave and a fifth) and slowly building on this so that you can quickly (and eventually, instantly) tell the difference between any of the diatonic intervals makes a huge difference. I've had kids who started out literally not able to know if a note was 'up' or 'down' from a previous one eventually be able to accurately discern any of the 12 semitone steps in an octave up or down, just by weekly practice using GNU solfege. Yes, some just 'get it' and don't know what they're doing - particularly with the voice - but most need fine-tuning and practice both in their heads and on their instruments, but after doing it for long enough it's possible to get really, really good at it.

lvturner 7y ago

On the fourth page he talks a bit about inability to sing a certain note. My first ever exposure to learning an instrument was a particularly cruel violin teacher - before he would let me pick up the violin he pressed a note on the piano and have everyone sing it. Everyone could do it, except to my shock, me. We went through this routine for weeks, (while my friends were actually being taught how to play their instruments) every time I sang I knew I was singing the wrong note - the problem wasn't that I couldn't hear the note, it was that I couldn't replicate it with my voice - I also couldn't fathom what the relationship between singing and violin playing was (and still couldn't until I wrote this up where I see now that it is obvious, but hilariously misguided) - but I persisited, fighting back tears of frustration until I eventually got right. I still can't play violin - but I do have a lifetime hatred of singing.

markvdb 7y ago
Pro guitar teacher her. TLDR: Pitch skills are incredibly hard to reliably improve. Inability to vocally reproduce pitch is a reliable filter for limited musical talent, _but_ it should always be used together with other filters because on its own, it produces some very important false positives. Your teacher was being lazy filtering students based on just that filter. He was probably trying to discourage you from continuing to study with him. That's cruel, the opposite of what a good teacher should be, whatever your abilities. You being able to catch the right frequency, but not being able to reproduce it by voice is very rare, but not unheard of! Anecdotal evidence: I had a friend at music conservatory with perfect pitch hearing, and zero pitch control of his vocal cords. Our professors came to this conclusion in very early screening. Another interesting to know is that there are incredibly many pro musicians who have less than optimal pitch recognition. I'll tell you even more: most are bad at recognising chords, let alone imagining them. I can tell, because I'm in the top decile of pro musicians on this. And before you think I'm bragging, I'll admit I'm situated much lower when it comes to fine motor skills...
- lvturner 7y ago
  Yes - it took me a long time to realise he was cruel and lazy, years later I picked up the saxophone and was always lauded for my intonation. I can hear the notes (and I also seem to be way more sensitive to key clashes than anyone else I know) I just can't sing very well.

troughway 7y ago

Maybe I missed something but he never actually addresses how to play by ear. I opened the PDF and started reading, and eventually found myself jumping past the mathematical harmonic mumbo-jumbo and into the good stuff, and unfortunately I was disappointed. He ended up covering the basics of Music Theory found in a lot of books with no real application to ear training. 1) Learning Material I can sympathize with the author's plight about not having access to good learning materials or schools. For those who want to pick up guitar and want a bit of extra "why things are the way they are" explanations, I have found books such as "Fretboard Logic" and "The Advancing Guitarist" to be useful. There are plenty more, like Ted Greene's "Chord Chemistry" and whatnot that have insight on ear training. Also, you have software today like Ear Master, Rocksmith and others that can help and are fun as well. YouTube is full of backing tracks that you can use to practice and hear how various notes, phrasings, melodies sound on top of the backing chords. 2) Notes Personally I have not found using "natural" note names to be that useful; using relative note names like root, second, third is to me much more functional, because the third of any key sounds like a third. The whole "returning to _root_" thing he mentions should be hint enough. 3) Ear Training His story of his dad being a multi-instrumentalist struck a chord with me (sorry). I have friends and teachers who are like this and I've come to believe that it's less about knowing any of what he is talking about (although it is important) and more about their storytelling ability and translating it over into music. I doubt his dad was a shredder, but his dad's ability to pick up and play an instrument wowed him all the same. To put another way - most people are lucky if they can passably play one instrument. The question is, how is it that there are people that can pick up an instrument and leave an impression on others? I doubt they have a massive IQ or some arcane knowledge of music theory. Storytelling and Composition are the same thing. All the high brow shit about Principles of Composition and Counterpoint and whatnot does not matter. Being able to evoke imagery in someone's mind or make them feel a certain way with music is something that the first half of the author's paper cannot begin to rationalize. I believe it's important to really _hear_ the music you are listening to. It doesn't matter if there are no vocals explicitly telling you how to feel (ie. pop music); it is on you to allow yourself to engage with what you're hearing and to eventually formulate an opinion on how something sounds and how it makes you feel. I've heard music teachers expressing this sentiment, and it's no surprise that it goes over most people's heads. It's not a subject for the dabblers. Composers for film, Classical composers etc excel at this. Learning from them is a masterclass in both ear training and storytelling. They've written plenty of books on this subject. Take a song you know, and start hearing it on a deeper level. Start transcribing it first by singing/humming/whistling along to it and then with your instrument. Take a chunk of it, and alter it in some way. Slow it down, add vibrato if there isn't already, elongate certain passages. I can't stress enough listening to music that actually tries to tell a story, because that's when you will hear the most _functional_ use of chord changes, progressions, melodies and vocals, which will ultimately aid in your ear training abilities and answer "why" better than the first half of the paper. Yes, you still have to sit down and woodshed (scales, progressions, metronome practice, etc) and whatnot, but that's assumed to be the case. PS. Lastly, you can find most of his mathematical explanations on Music Theory Stack Exchange. None of it will help you play by ear any better.

jng 7y ago

I have been a software developer for 35 years (started learning in 1985, I've accomplished several pretty successful things in this time), and it's also taken me over three decades to become a good musician (which I've only allowed myself to call my self very, very recently - I play piano and sing, a little bit of guitar and drums too). Programming and music are very different beasts, both very tough, both very worthwhile. I just wanted to post because the documenta above has a lot of great information (on a quick browse) and I'm sure it's filled with good intentions, but it's a very poor way to learn music. If you're a mathematician or physicist or software engineer trying to learn how to play the guitar, be it by ear or in any other way, it's not going to cut it. It's great if you read it and learn the information, but only the last 6 pages or so really talk about actually playing, and they are not going to teach you. If you want to learn to write and play music, don't delve into the math except as a side project. Learn to play a few simple songs that you like, using 3-4 simple chords (there are a ton of tutorials for that), and then spend 1,000 hours playing around on the vicinity of that musical environment. There is no shortcut, it is not about learning patterns, music is a different language, and learning music is about awakening your musical self. Learning to accompany yourself while you sing a few songs needs no understanding of the mathematical foundations at all (and they don't really help), it's mostly about learning a few basic patterns (3-4 chord finger positions) and then being good at performing (mostly tied to self-confidence). Learning to play common songs doesn't take much more. Learning to improvise and to write your own songs requires 1,000+ hours of the type of "playing/dancing/exploring" I was mentioning above. You'll learn the theory on the 10% of those 1,000 hours that you are resting and browsing the internet.

sibeliuss 7y ago
> Learning to improvise and to write your own songs requires 1,000+ hours of the type of "playing/dancing/exploring" I was mentioning above. You'll learn the theory on the 10% of those 1,000 hours that you are resting and browsing the internet. This has been my experience as well. When I first started I thought I would rush into the theory and that would allow me to improvise, but what was lacking was the playing of songs and getting a feel for the music. Learning the theory was easy -- getting a basketful of songs under my belt and then getting good at playing them took much longer, and required much more effort -- and now improvising comes more naturally, including being able to use use my ears to hear things like keys, intervals and so on. Practice, practice, practice! Learn a lot of different songs well, and fully understand the Circle of 5ths.

arh68 7y ago

I think light gauge strings tune just fine, and non-12-tone music might be interesting (I want to hear it, though, not read about it) I'm an average guitar player, and I don't teach. If you want to play a song, of course pull up the tab/gpro/songbook. But find video of the original artist playing it, look on youtube for the "guitar track" version (no vocals, drums), and try to see where they play/"voice" their chords and how they dish out upstrokes / downstrokes, these things are very subtle when heard. If you can find a video of the original guitarist teaching you their own song on their own guitar, almost nothing can beat that. Do Not look at your hands! (play in the dark if you have to) Play the song on the computer, and just try to follow.

christiansakai 7y ago

I accidentally discovered playing by ear. So I play acoustic/electric guitar and electric bass. It helps if you like to sing and actually have a decent singing voice. I am a Christian. One of our daily activities is to just pray and sing Christian music (we call this activity worship) every morning after wake up and every night before bed. One of my friend at church taught me Nashville number system. However he told only one key, G to me since that was the easiest. I began to just look for worship music that I can play and sing comfortably in G. I found around 3-5 songs and did that daily. After a month, I realized that I did not need to look at the chord book anymore because I memorized it. Then my friend taught me other keys such as C. Then I tried to transcribe the songs that I already know to C and played it and tried to sing it as best as I can. Since those songs weren’t comfortable to be sung in C I tried to find 3 other songs, then proceed for another month to just play these. Then my friend taught me D, and then he mentioned that if I know how to play D then playing E is just moving it up. Then he told me that I already knew A because it is just G moved up. So I began to play around with various type of songs, slow and fast, and suddenly everything click, because it seems that majority of Christian music are 90% the same. I developed an ear for knowing which chord to play at what key. It is really not that hard. It is like driving. Hard at first but once you got it you got it. I applied this technique to bass as well. It is mostly just patterns. I have successfully taught one student this technique. She actually did it faster than me. I acquired CAGED keys by ear in about 6 months, around 1 key per month. she managed to play just in key of E in 2 weeks. Granted, she practiced longer than me daily.

amparanoid 7y ago

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