3 ms·

It reminds me of the whole .NET ecosystem. All of these custom magical special ways to do everything, compared to ‘dumb’ setups like node/ruby/go where the actu

by ENGNR 7y ago

It reminds me of the whole .NET ecosystem. All of these custom magical special ways to do everything, compared to ‘dumb’ setups like node/ruby/go where the actual logic is just right there in front of you And every release .NET just keeps moving closer to the dumb systems. Simple and raw is good, keep the magic away

kumarvvr 7y ago
I am really glad there are other people who think this way. I am experienced with Python/JS/Ruby web app development models and recently had a look at ASP.NET Core web api projects. The amount of complexity is mind boggling. I mean, look at Flask in Python. Or even Expressjs in Node, why can't Microsoft come up with a simple framework that can run well on the .NET runtime? I am a huge fan of C#, having used it for Desktop app development. I would love to have a framework like flask in the .NET ecosystem.
- UglyToad 7y ago
  Is something like Nancy [0] close to what you're after? I've not used it myself because I prefer the structure of the full approach but from my extremely brief interaction with Express in Node it seems similar? [0]: https://github.com/NancyFx/Nancy https://github.com/NancyFx/Nancy
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- nchie 7y ago
  What's so complex about ASP.NET Core web api, other than having to learn to use a DI framework? I found it very simple and minimal (again, other than the DI) when learning it.
- taway123411 7y ago
  Can you elaborate on the "mind boggling" complexity? Flask is self-described as a "micro framework", which makes it simple to start with, but IMHO difficult to grow into something bigger. I like the balance the ASP.NET Core 3.0 strikes. dotnet new webapp -o HelloWorld Yields a fully functional site with * HTTPS * Logging * HTML templating * CSS/JS bundling & minification And all of this is easy to customize and change. "Web API" projects are even simpler-- it's just a small handful of files.
- IggleSniggle 7y ago
  Ah, yes, expressjs, or as I like to call it, "the mutation ecosystem," where who knows what middleware has mutated which object in which way, and whether any state has leaked or whether any assumptions about control flow will actually hold true. Where it's common to see callbacks, streams, Promises, generators, and async/await patterns all thrown together in a mishmash that requires continuous syntactical context-switching. Honestly I'd rather develop in vanilla NodeJS where the approach is at least consistent, than in the Express ecosystem where sure your problems may have been solved 1000 different ways already but where none of them really fit what you want to do, and where there are many layers of hidden incompatibility that are going to require you to make adapters for each library anyway.

by ENGNR 7y ago

kumarvvr 7y ago

I am really glad there are other people who think this way. I am experienced with Python/JS/Ruby web app development models and recently had a look at ASP.NET Core web api projects. The amount of complexity is mind boggling. I mean, look at Flask in Python. Or even Expressjs in Node, why can't Microsoft come up with a simple framework that can run well on the .NET runtime? I am a huge fan of C#, having used it for Desktop app development. I would love to have a framework like flask in the .NET ecosystem.

UglyToad 7y ago
Is something like Nancy [0] close to what you're after? I've not used it myself because I prefer the structure of the full approach but from my extremely brief interaction with Express in Node it seems similar? [0]: https://github.com/NancyFx/Nancy https://github.com/NancyFx/Nancy
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
nchie 7y ago
What's so complex about ASP.NET Core web api, other than having to learn to use a DI framework? I found it very simple and minimal (again, other than the DI) when learning it.
taway123411 7y ago
Can you elaborate on the "mind boggling" complexity? Flask is self-described as a "micro framework", which makes it simple to start with, but IMHO difficult to grow into something bigger. I like the balance the ASP.NET Core 3.0 strikes. dotnet new webapp -o HelloWorld Yields a fully functional site with * HTTPS * Logging * HTML templating * CSS/JS bundling & minification And all of this is easy to customize and change. "Web API" projects are even simpler-- it's just a small handful of files.
IggleSniggle 7y ago
Ah, yes, expressjs, or as I like to call it, "the mutation ecosystem," where who knows what middleware has mutated which object in which way, and whether any state has leaked or whether any assumptions about control flow will actually hold true. Where it's common to see callbacks, streams, Promises, generators, and async/await patterns all thrown together in a mishmash that requires continuous syntactical context-switching. Honestly I'd rather develop in vanilla NodeJS where the approach is at least consistent, than in the Express ecosystem where sure your problems may have been solved 1000 different ways already but where none of them really fit what you want to do, and where there are many layers of hidden incompatibility that are going to require you to make adapters for each library anyway.