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I went down this rabbit hole a long time ago and saw a therapist about it. I would suggest you do the same. That said, they basically told me that if you're wo

I went down this rabbit hole a long time ago and saw a therapist about it. I would suggest you do the same. That said, they basically told me that if you're worried about being a narcissist or trying to change it then you probably aren't a candidate for NPD diagnosis. Simply put people with NPD don't even consider that they might be wrong or flawed. That doesn't mean you don't have something to fix, but it's worth seeing a professional.

deleted 7y ago
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Domenic_S 7y ago
Look at how he frames the question -- "I talk too much...", "I don't enjoy...", "I tend to judge...", "I have an inflated ego..." He doesn't think about his behavior in relation to other people. To the narcissist, other people are simply background actors in the movie that is their life. Why does this matter? Well, if you were living on a deserted island, would it matter if you were a narcissist? When he talks about the negative impact, he again frames it as it impacts him: "These traits have affected my personal and professional life...". Nothing about how it might have impacted other people's lives. We can therefore be sure this post is an act of defense against change. Further reading: https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2009/01/can_narcissism_be_cured.html https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2009/01/can_narcissism_be_cu...
- tvanantwerp 7y ago
  High use of the first-person in writing is hardly a sign of NPD. "I" is one of the most commonly used words in the English language.
  - Domenic_S 7y ago
    You've misunderstood the point, in the whole post he didn't say how anybody else was affected by his behavior. If nobody's negatively affected, the behavior can't be bad. "I've hurt people by being too egotistical" is an example of an "I" sentence that would have made me believe he could see that something was wrong.
    - jshevek 7y ago
      It was a short post, focused on the information most relevant to the purpose of the post, without being overly intimate.
- AndrewKemendo 7y ago
  I understand, but the whole subtext is that he's taking responsibility, and not blaming other people, something narcissists can't do.
  - Domenic_S 7y ago
    That's the trick: it seems that way, but really it's a trap/defense against change. Narcissists are very, very good at seeming to others like they want to fix something about themselves, all the while digging themselves in deeper because deep down they don't really think something is wrong. He says "I tend to judge situations only from my perspective" -- and then proceeds to write this very public post completely from only his own perspective. In another context we could call that lack of insight but for the narcissist it's a feature, not a bug.
    - monkeypizza 7y ago
      What would you have him do, though? Voluntarily posting about it to try to improve seems like the best choice. If he hadn't posted at all and just continued being a narcissist, that'd also have been wrong. It's not right to set up a judgement system where someone has no correct action at all.
    - AndrewKemendo 7y ago
      Like other disorders NPD lies on a spectrum. From a clinical perspective (I'm not a clinician but have been treated by them btw) my understanding is that untreatable NPD presents as basically no remorse and no introspection at all. What would be called a "sociopath" which isn't itself a diagnosis. So while yes I totally understand what you're talking about, that the attention seeking of the post itself could be considered narcissistic I am taking it at face value and saying there might be a possibility of some rehab. So my suggestion og talking with a mental health provider is the right option here.
      - Domenic_S 7y ago
        Im not saying he’s attention seeking although that could be the case. I’m saying the form and content of his post shows his inability to see his world from the perspective of other people - the people affected by his narcissism - which is like I said before a feature of the disorder and the reason it is so treatment-resistant. None of this is to say I don’t think he should see a professional - he absolutely should.
tenpoundhammer 7y ago
I agree with this one hundred percent. However, I would add that in my interpretation the users was likely talking about trending towards having narcissistic traits, and they weren't necessarily referring to NPD. For a little context, my mother is the most narcissistic person I've ever met and she constantly told the people around her, "I like myself just the way I am I have nothing to change". She was emotionally and psychologically abusive and ruined every relationship she ever had, if there was ever a person that needed to change it was her. So anyone that thinks to themselves that they may be too narcissistic is way further ahead than a lot of people on the more extreme end of narcissistic personality traits. I think other hallmarks of being narcissistic, which these are things she also did, accusing others of being narcissistic, creating and believing elaborate scenarios where other people are ruining your life or goals, consistently villainizing groups of people, the inability to maintain personal relationships, and most of all deflecting all responsibility for negative circumstances. I think you could do any or all of this stuff and still not have NPD but a life long pattern of these things are a good indicator. I'm not a licensed psychologist or therapist just trying to share a bit of my experience.
- hosh 7y ago
  I think there are better definitions that more precisely define certain traits: Jerk -- that view that you are surrounded by idiots, don't have anything worth saying, and does not deserve respect. See: https://aeon.co/essays/so-you-re-surrounded-by-idiots-guess-who-the-real-jerk-is https://aeon.co/essays/so-you-re-surrounded-by-idiots-guess-... Asshole -- a kind of disconnection with relating to other people, by being "untouchable" by the feelings and concerns of other people. Paradoxically, there is often a great yearning to connect inspite of that isolation. The best book I have seen on this subject is specific to the masculine archetypes, in the book, Trickster, Magician, and the Grieving Man by Glen Mavis. People with Borderline Personality Disorder can get confused for narcissism. The way to differentiate is that people with BPD have an incredible fear of being rejected or abandoned.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

Domenic_S 7y ago

Look at how he frames the question -- "I talk too much...", "I don't enjoy...", "I tend to judge...", "I have an inflated ego..." He doesn't think about his behavior in relation to other people. To the narcissist, other people are simply background actors in the movie that is their life. Why does this matter? Well, if you were living on a deserted island, would it matter if you were a narcissist? When he talks about the negative impact, he again frames it as it impacts him: "These traits have affected my personal and professional life...". Nothing about how it might have impacted other people's lives. We can therefore be sure this post is an act of defense against change. Further reading: https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2009/01/can_narcissism_be_cured.html https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2009/01/can_narcissism_be_cu...

tvanantwerp 7y ago
High use of the first-person in writing is hardly a sign of NPD. "I" is one of the most commonly used words in the English language.
- Domenic_S 7y ago
  You've misunderstood the point, in the whole post he didn't say how anybody else was affected by his behavior. If nobody's negatively affected, the behavior can't be bad. "I've hurt people by being too egotistical" is an example of an "I" sentence that would have made me believe he could see that something was wrong.
  - jshevek 7y ago
    It was a short post, focused on the information most relevant to the purpose of the post, without being overly intimate.
AndrewKemendo 7y ago
I understand, but the whole subtext is that he's taking responsibility, and not blaming other people, something narcissists can't do.
- Domenic_S 7y ago
  That's the trick: it seems that way, but really it's a trap/defense against change. Narcissists are very, very good at seeming to others like they want to fix something about themselves, all the while digging themselves in deeper because deep down they don't really think something is wrong. He says "I tend to judge situations only from my perspective" -- and then proceeds to write this very public post completely from only his own perspective. In another context we could call that lack of insight but for the narcissist it's a feature, not a bug.
  - monkeypizza 7y ago
    What would you have him do, though? Voluntarily posting about it to try to improve seems like the best choice. If he hadn't posted at all and just continued being a narcissist, that'd also have been wrong. It's not right to set up a judgement system where someone has no correct action at all.
  - AndrewKemendo 7y ago
    Like other disorders NPD lies on a spectrum. From a clinical perspective (I'm not a clinician but have been treated by them btw) my understanding is that untreatable NPD presents as basically no remorse and no introspection at all. What would be called a "sociopath" which isn't itself a diagnosis. So while yes I totally understand what you're talking about, that the attention seeking of the post itself could be considered narcissistic I am taking it at face value and saying there might be a possibility of some rehab. So my suggestion og talking with a mental health provider is the right option here.
    - Domenic_S 7y ago
      Im not saying he’s attention seeking although that could be the case. I’m saying the form and content of his post shows his inability to see his world from the perspective of other people - the people affected by his narcissism - which is like I said before a feature of the disorder and the reason it is so treatment-resistant. None of this is to say I don’t think he should see a professional - he absolutely should.

tenpoundhammer 7y ago

I agree with this one hundred percent. However, I would add that in my interpretation the users was likely talking about trending towards having narcissistic traits, and they weren't necessarily referring to NPD. For a little context, my mother is the most narcissistic person I've ever met and she constantly told the people around her, "I like myself just the way I am I have nothing to change". She was emotionally and psychologically abusive and ruined every relationship she ever had, if there was ever a person that needed to change it was her. So anyone that thinks to themselves that they may be too narcissistic is way further ahead than a lot of people on the more extreme end of narcissistic personality traits. I think other hallmarks of being narcissistic, which these are things she also did, accusing others of being narcissistic, creating and believing elaborate scenarios where other people are ruining your life or goals, consistently villainizing groups of people, the inability to maintain personal relationships, and most of all deflecting all responsibility for negative circumstances. I think you could do any or all of this stuff and still not have NPD but a life long pattern of these things are a good indicator. I'm not a licensed psychologist or therapist just trying to share a bit of my experience.

hosh 7y ago
I think there are better definitions that more precisely define certain traits: Jerk -- that view that you are surrounded by idiots, don't have anything worth saying, and does not deserve respect. See: https://aeon.co/essays/so-you-re-surrounded-by-idiots-guess-who-the-real-jerk-is https://aeon.co/essays/so-you-re-surrounded-by-idiots-guess-... Asshole -- a kind of disconnection with relating to other people, by being "untouchable" by the feelings and concerns of other people. Paradoxically, there is often a great yearning to connect inspite of that isolation. The best book I have seen on this subject is specific to the masculine archetypes, in the book, Trickster, Magician, and the Grieving Man by Glen Mavis. People with Borderline Personality Disorder can get confused for narcissism. The way to differentiate is that people with BPD have an incredible fear of being rejected or abandoned.