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People say this a lot, but it never seems very actionable. How do you do find someone good that you trust? How do you find someone worth the time? The couple o

People say this a lot, but it never seems very actionable. How do you do find someone good that you trust? How do you find someone worth the time? The couple of times I've tried to find someone you end up making a lot of unreturned phone calls. Maybe I have an unfairly negative impression of therapists - I both think that it's incredibly valuable to introspect and have someone smart and thoughtful to work things out with, but also suspect a lot of therapists are neither of those things? CBT and growth mindset seems helpful, what's the process to actually find someone successfully? How many people actually are doing therapy vs. just recommending other people do it? It seems a lot more people are recommending it than actually doing it themselves (which would explain the vague advice).

Psyladine 7y ago
I go by recommendations, but I'm initially looking for chemistry - does this person jump to conclusions based on initial statements, is there an urgency in their tone (as in, getting to it rather than getting to know you), and most importantly, being able to verbalize their process and walk you through their methods. It shouldn't be smoke & mirrors or duplicitous, like asking you open ended questions and letting you blow off steam for 45 minutes, it should be a 'conversation' with them drawing you back to the central issues you identified & they've diagnosed. Like all relationships, it's predicated on trust, and that means finding the right professional. There are shops that make their retirement letting people talk about themselves for an hour once a week, and there are others genuinely engaged in the art of helping people heal themselves.
sounds 7y ago
I'm actually attending therapy, on a regular schedule, and struggled to find a good therapist. Shop around? You're inviting someone to perform online brain surgery on you. Fortunately, you can undo the operation if you don't like it (sort of). If you don't like what the therapist is doing, keep looking for a different therapist that works for you. I've heard a story where a therapist got upset with their client because the client said, during a therapy session, they were going to find someone else. Simple point of order: I don't need to tell my therapist if they're fired. I just walk away.
- climb_stealth 7y ago
  > I've heard a story where a therapist got upset with their client because the client said, during a therapy session, they were going to find someone else. That would be a clear sign of a bad therapist. There very much has to be room to discuss seeing someone else, and whether the therapy relationship is working.
  - sounds 7y ago
    Yes, obviously, that was my point. But an additional point is worth making, the kind of thing that a good therapist would help you see. > I don't need to tell my therapist if they're fired. I just walk away. I am stating that as clearly as I can there. If my therapist starts acting in a way that makes me uncomfortable, no more talk. No need to talk. I don't need my therapist's permission to walk away. I just. walk. away.
    - Faark 7y ago
      > I just. walk. away. Though you might want to get in contact with your insurance if they are paying for it, since having it on your record as aborted for no reason could cause issues when convincing them to pay the next one.
halbritt 7y ago
I've had a fair number of terrible therapists and a couple of good ones. The only real solution that I can think of is to try several. Generally, you know early on. To me, it's a worthwhile endeavor.
mraudiobook_com 7y ago
So true! I do a dbt skills group and as a RULE i am the only make, ever. Men just don't do therapy well.
Domenic_S 7y ago
"Find a therapist" is not vague or unactionable advice, any more than "find a doctor" or "find a mechanic" is vague or unactionable.
- kempbellt 7y ago
  Find a mechanic.... for your mind
fao_ 7y ago
> How do you do find someone good that you trust? How do you find someone worth the time? The couple of times I've tried to find someone you end up making a lot of unreturned phone calls. But it's the same with Doctors. Some doctors won't listen to your symptoms, some doctors might have old information, or brush you off. Would you put off going to a doctor because of those problems?
- fossuser 7y ago
  It's not really the same with doctors. With doctors there are places everyone goes where you can sign up and get a doctor which is relatively easy to schedule. From there for routine stuff there's less variability, you just do your routine checkup, and you'll be referred to experts if necessary. There's also a higher minimum standard to get an MD. It's both way easier to find one and easier to determine they're qualified/actually know what they're talking about (though obviously there's still variance in quality just not as bad). With therapists there's no clarity around any of this really.
  - fao_ 7y ago
    > There's also a higher minimum standard to get an MD. If you see a psychotherapist, they have to be certified as an MD and then they get therapist training.
    - staticautomatic 7y ago
      No. Psychologists can be psychotherapists. Psychiatrists can be psychotherapists too, but most aren't.
      - fao_ 7y ago
        Ahh, sorry yes you're right. 'Psychiatrist' was what I was after.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
zerkten 7y ago
It's challenging to give specific advice on this while respecting privacy. On a site like Reddit with PM you might be able to discern that someone has an issue, is located close to you, you know a therapist, and then create a throwaway account to PM them. These challenges are deeply personal, so finding the right person is challenging. There are lot of therapists with different qualifications and experience. People seem to study psychology, do whatever qualifications they need, and start as a therapist, but the experience part is a challenge. I don't think this challenge is much different from finding mentors. In fact, it's probably better because it's a discrete financial transaction and the conversations are protected. Finding mentors during your career, if you don't have them directly in your workplace, can be really problematic. You have few protections, and little ability to build up trust, until you've invested time building up trust. When it comes to men (probably the majority) on HN there are also a number of specific issues which affect take up of therapy. That's after the cost issues which affect everyone. If someone is in some countries they may have little, or no availability of certain kinds of therapy.
climb_stealth 7y ago
> How do you do find someone good that you trust? How do you find someone worth the time? In my experience the best way to find someone is through recommendations. Find someone with a good therapist, and contact the therapist for recommendations. They usually know other people in the field that work with a similar approach. I feel CBT only works with simple issues. For trauma and deep running issues I would suggest finding someone who looks into the root of issues and doesn't just try to change behaviours. See psychotherapy for example. Otherwise it depends on where you live as well. In Australia, and definitely for NSW: - look for a psychiatrist instead of a psychologist. With a psychologist you get 10 sessions for free by the government, but then you have to pay the full fee yourself. This ends up being around $150-$250 per session from what I have seen. With a psychiatrist the medicare safety net kicks in, and after $2000 of out of pocket expenses you get 85% of the session fees back. In my case I end up paying ~$40 for my $350 therapy sessions which makes a huge difference when therapy can be going for years. Happy to help out with recommendations in the NSW Australia area.
- fossuser 7y ago
  I'm in the bay area - this seems like the best option. The difficulty is either I don't know anyone my age that has one or it's still taboo for men to talk about so people don't. I'd guess it's a combination of both. The only people I've known personally who see a therapist are women (and from that small sample they don't want you to see their same person). I think men tend to rely entirely on their SO which is probably not a great thing for either party.
  - climb_stealth 7y ago
    > The only people I've known personally who see a therapist are women (and from that small sample they don't want you to see their same person). Which is fair enough. That's why I'm suggesting to not get their therapist's details to see the same person, but to get a recommendation from the therapist. Hopefully that would alleviate their concerns. AFAIK a good therapist will not see people who are too close to each other anyway as there can be a bias on the therapist's side due to the close relationship. For example doing both couple and individual therapy with the same therapist is not a good idea.

Psyladine 7y ago

I go by recommendations, but I'm initially looking for chemistry - does this person jump to conclusions based on initial statements, is there an urgency in their tone (as in, getting to it rather than getting to know you), and most importantly, being able to verbalize their process and walk you through their methods. It shouldn't be smoke & mirrors or duplicitous, like asking you open ended questions and letting you blow off steam for 45 minutes, it should be a 'conversation' with them drawing you back to the central issues you identified & they've diagnosed. Like all relationships, it's predicated on trust, and that means finding the right professional. There are shops that make their retirement letting people talk about themselves for an hour once a week, and there are others genuinely engaged in the art of helping people heal themselves.

sounds 7y ago

I'm actually attending therapy, on a regular schedule, and struggled to find a good therapist. Shop around? You're inviting someone to perform online brain surgery on you. Fortunately, you can undo the operation if you don't like it (sort of). If you don't like what the therapist is doing, keep looking for a different therapist that works for you. I've heard a story where a therapist got upset with their client because the client said, during a therapy session, they were going to find someone else. Simple point of order: I don't need to tell my therapist if they're fired. I just walk away.

climb_stealth 7y ago
> I've heard a story where a therapist got upset with their client because the client said, during a therapy session, they were going to find someone else. That would be a clear sign of a bad therapist. There very much has to be room to discuss seeing someone else, and whether the therapy relationship is working.
- sounds 7y ago
  Yes, obviously, that was my point. But an additional point is worth making, the kind of thing that a good therapist would help you see. > I don't need to tell my therapist if they're fired. I just walk away. I am stating that as clearly as I can there. If my therapist starts acting in a way that makes me uncomfortable, no more talk. No need to talk. I don't need my therapist's permission to walk away. I just. walk. away.
  - Faark 7y ago
    > I just. walk. away. Though you might want to get in contact with your insurance if they are paying for it, since having it on your record as aborted for no reason could cause issues when convincing them to pay the next one.

halbritt 7y ago

I've had a fair number of terrible therapists and a couple of good ones. The only real solution that I can think of is to try several. Generally, you know early on. To me, it's a worthwhile endeavor.

mraudiobook_com 7y ago

So true! I do a dbt skills group and as a RULE i am the only make, ever. Men just don't do therapy well.

Domenic_S 7y ago

"Find a therapist" is not vague or unactionable advice, any more than "find a doctor" or "find a mechanic" is vague or unactionable.

kempbellt 7y ago
Find a mechanic.... for your mind

fao_ 7y ago

> How do you do find someone good that you trust? How do you find someone worth the time? The couple of times I've tried to find someone you end up making a lot of unreturned phone calls. But it's the same with Doctors. Some doctors won't listen to your symptoms, some doctors might have old information, or brush you off. Would you put off going to a doctor because of those problems?

fossuser 7y ago
It's not really the same with doctors. With doctors there are places everyone goes where you can sign up and get a doctor which is relatively easy to schedule. From there for routine stuff there's less variability, you just do your routine checkup, and you'll be referred to experts if necessary. There's also a higher minimum standard to get an MD. It's both way easier to find one and easier to determine they're qualified/actually know what they're talking about (though obviously there's still variance in quality just not as bad). With therapists there's no clarity around any of this really.
- fao_ 7y ago
  > There's also a higher minimum standard to get an MD. If you see a psychotherapist, they have to be certified as an MD and then they get therapist training.
  - staticautomatic 7y ago
    No. Psychologists can be psychotherapists. Psychiatrists can be psychotherapists too, but most aren't.
    - fao_ 7y ago
      Ahh, sorry yes you're right. 'Psychiatrist' was what I was after.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

zerkten 7y ago

It's challenging to give specific advice on this while respecting privacy. On a site like Reddit with PM you might be able to discern that someone has an issue, is located close to you, you know a therapist, and then create a throwaway account to PM them. These challenges are deeply personal, so finding the right person is challenging. There are lot of therapists with different qualifications and experience. People seem to study psychology, do whatever qualifications they need, and start as a therapist, but the experience part is a challenge. I don't think this challenge is much different from finding mentors. In fact, it's probably better because it's a discrete financial transaction and the conversations are protected. Finding mentors during your career, if you don't have them directly in your workplace, can be really problematic. You have few protections, and little ability to build up trust, until you've invested time building up trust. When it comes to men (probably the majority) on HN there are also a number of specific issues which affect take up of therapy. That's after the cost issues which affect everyone. If someone is in some countries they may have little, or no availability of certain kinds of therapy.

climb_stealth 7y ago

> How do you do find someone good that you trust? How do you find someone worth the time? In my experience the best way to find someone is through recommendations. Find someone with a good therapist, and contact the therapist for recommendations. They usually know other people in the field that work with a similar approach. I feel CBT only works with simple issues. For trauma and deep running issues I would suggest finding someone who looks into the root of issues and doesn't just try to change behaviours. See psychotherapy for example. Otherwise it depends on where you live as well. In Australia, and definitely for NSW: - look for a psychiatrist instead of a psychologist. With a psychologist you get 10 sessions for free by the government, but then you have to pay the full fee yourself. This ends up being around $150-$250 per session from what I have seen. With a psychiatrist the medicare safety net kicks in, and after $2000 of out of pocket expenses you get 85% of the session fees back. In my case I end up paying ~$40 for my $350 therapy sessions which makes a huge difference when therapy can be going for years. Happy to help out with recommendations in the NSW Australia area.

fossuser 7y ago
I'm in the bay area - this seems like the best option. The difficulty is either I don't know anyone my age that has one or it's still taboo for men to talk about so people don't. I'd guess it's a combination of both. The only people I've known personally who see a therapist are women (and from that small sample they don't want you to see their same person). I think men tend to rely entirely on their SO which is probably not a great thing for either party.
- climb_stealth 7y ago
  > The only people I've known personally who see a therapist are women (and from that small sample they don't want you to see their same person). Which is fair enough. That's why I'm suggesting to not get their therapist's details to see the same person, but to get a recommendation from the therapist. Hopefully that would alleviate their concerns. AFAIK a good therapist will not see people who are too close to each other anyway as there can be a bias on the therapist's side due to the close relationship. For example doing both couple and individual therapy with the same therapist is not a good idea.