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I'm at somewhat of a cross-roads related to this matter. Note that this mostly applies to immigrants from India or China. I'm from India. This applies irrespec

I'm at somewhat of a cross-roads related to this matter. Note that this mostly applies to immigrants from India or China. I'm from India. This applies irrespective of education level (I did my Bachelors in the US, just FYI) Currently I'm in the US on a student visa (currently during a period of that visa that permits me to work) that expires in a couple years. I cannot renew it. If I want to continue working in the US. My only option is an H1-B (work) visa. There is basically no other option to me. Okay, so let's say I do get the H1-B visa. Then, I have to work for a few more years on that visa, before I'm eligible to apply for a green card - which grants permanent resident status. Now, once I file that application, I'll be on a waitlist. Guess how much time it takes to get a greed card? Atleast 100 years. I'm not joking. Unless there's a policy change, there's no possibility. Even if there's no possibility of me getting a green card, I can still work. I can still buy a house, get married, have kids, etc. A lot of Indians and Chinese in the US currently are in this limbo period, where they don't have a green card. So they still continue to work, start a family. Because no other country will pay as well. But personally, I hate the uncertainty. While even getting a green card isn't a guarantee to get to stay in the country, not having a green card is much worse. A CBP officer has the authority to deny you entry at their discretion. If do deny entry, you are banned from entry for atleast 5 years. That's it. You're life in the US has vanished into thin air. While I love my current job, I trying to immigrate to Canada. You get a PR immediately if you quality based on a points system calculated using specific, meritocratic criteria. If I have a PR I feel I won't worry when I buy a house, plant roots, that my life won't be upended because I failed to follow my visa's restrictions.

sg47 7y ago
Now is the time to leave. 18 years in the US with a kid born here. I missed the boat in getting my priority date around the time when my friends were getting theirs (my company was laying off people in other departments and my application got audited). Didn't think it was a big deal at that time. Now, my friends are getting their citizenships and I'm still stuck on a visa. I'm at the whim of the Consul officer and the CBP officer every time I renew my visa or come back into the country. Heavily vested here assuming I'll get a green card but planning to apply for Canadian PR just in case. There's an easy way to game the system if one is in the right situation and is willing to risk it. Leave the country and work for the same company for a year as a manager. Come back on a L1 visa and boom you can apply in the EB-1 category and get your green card in a couple of years. I've quite a few friends who easily got their green cards working for TCS, Infosys, etc. Meanwhile, with a Masters degree and 16 years of experience, I'm at the mercy of immigration officers.
- bobfrost 7y ago
  18 years? That's scary. I'm surprised at the amount of confidence you have in the USCIS that you might get a greed card. If you are still on a visa, I don't see how soon you believe you can get a green card in a reasonable amount of time. I'm not sure you can use the EB-1 category even with an L-1 - unless you're at a very high level in your company. Even for that category, the waitlist is currently about 5 years.
  - sg47 7y ago
    Well, I just don't think about it. Pay being very high makes up for it. My priority date is 2 years behind the current priority date for EB2 so I'm hoping for a miracle. I cannot leave because we are so entrenched here and have lots of friends we don't want to leave behind. It doesn't have to be a L1. Even with a H1B, if you worked as a manager in India and come here with a manager title (even Project Manager), you can apply in EB1 as a multinational manager. It's a terrible loophole and one that's mercilessly exploited.
    - fuckyah 7y ago
      > exploited And then you wonder why the US is so strict?
- kamaal 7y ago
  >>Come back on a L1 visa and boom you can apply in the EB-1 category and get your green card in a couple of years. Those days are gone now. You go into EB-1 only if you get into the US on L1-A. They don't give L1-A's easily these days. For starters you need to be in director level positions to even qualify for L1-A's. Even then the waiting period for India EB-1 itself is growing and stands at 5+ years now. And it will only increase. >>I've quite a few friends who easily got their green cards working for TCS, Infosys, etc. Put the saddle on the right horse. People who come in from those companies often work for <$70K an year. Most are poor blokes who survive on ramen, and giving haircuts to each other so that they can save $8. The real deal is Cgnzt which even until recently filed L1-A's and EB-1's for thousands/lacs of people by cooking up documents. Often promoting some one with a BCom degree to a director, granting them a GC and then rolling back the promotion. Thousands to lacs have made it to GC and Passports this way. When I worked for a short time in the US, it was painful to see PhD students in Stanford struggle for little extra stay, while some one with a basic 2 year diploma land GCs in like an year. In fact even until recently the biggest incentive to work at Cgnzt was this. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-business/indians-rush-for-us-citizenship-before-trump-can-shut-doors/articleshow/73461275.cms https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-business/... 8.4 lac Indians got citizenship only last year. 5.8 lac got green cards. This is basically abuse max. Add this to manager's pets who routinely get their documents cooked to be Nobel Prize worthy talent and land GC's. Literally the wrongest possible people occupy the numbers these days. Add to this a large number of body shopping firms. There are several top level doctors, lawyers and scientists who don't even get B1's. In short we Indians bought this upon ourselves. Like everything else. We abuse things so much, so far and so blatantly it makes things impossible for the real people when they arrive at the scene. I'm one of those people who got burned badly due to all these politics at every level. I have largely given up, you just need to get very lucky early life to win at these things. Or cheat shamelessly.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
bobfrost 7y ago
Can't seem to edit although it's been <2h. Regret the typos. For people looking for data backing what I'm talking about, here's[1] something that everyone looks at to track timelines. This data is released monthly. Search for "EMPLOYMENT-BASED PREFERENCES" In that table you'll see China, India and Mexico specifically called out since they're the ones with such extreme wait times. EB-1 is extremely difficult to qualify for[2] so most people apply for EB-2. You can see currently applications from 2009 are being processed. That was more than a decade ago. Then consider the increase in applications each year since that year. That's where the 100 year figure comes from. [1]: https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/visa-bulletin/2020/visa-bulletin-for-february-2020.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/v... [2]: https://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/permanent-workers/employment-based-immigration-first-preference-eb-1 https://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/permanent-worker...
tathougies 7y ago
> Guess how much time it takes to get a greed card? Atleast 100 years. I'm not joking. Unless there's a policy change, there's no possibility. So my entire family migrated from India (not H1B though, so no idea what that process is like), and some are still migrating, and this is just ridiculous. Green cards and citizenship are issued quite regularly. I'm not going to say its fast, but it's not literally 100 years (can't tell if you were being sarcastic or not). My uncle got his a few years back, and got his citizenship this year. The system works, as long as there're no discrepancies.
- sg47 7y ago
  That's the current prediction because of the backlog. Family-based migration is different. On a H1B visa, if you get a priority date today, it'll take you a very long time to get your green card. Every year, the backlog moves by 1-2 months. i.e. in the last 6 months, I think the backlog went from processing applications from April 2009 to June 2009. Some months it doesn't move at all. I don't think you know how this system works. Of course, people exploit family-based migration which is more permissive and bring their extended family here but the situation is completely different for people on work-based visas.
- thansharp 7y ago
  My friend, there's a huge difference between family based green cards (FB categories) and employment based (EB). The wait times change from 1-10 years in the former [1] to 100 in the latter [2]. A normal indian cannot go through family, since they're not closely related to a citizen. I have close relatives who gave birth here (they're working on a H1-B). The mom and dad would make it quicker by waiting for the US citizen kid to become 18 and apply, than they applying. Heck, they can wait for the kid to turn 18, go to Iceland/Sri Lanka, give birth to the grandkid, and that grandkid can apply for the citizenship and that would be faster. :( [1] - friends and my roommate here in the bay [2] - my application
- thbr99 7y ago
  That's what's called chain migration. Just because your "uncle got a greencard" doesn't mean skilled immigrants get a greencard unlike your unskilled uncle. This is the kind of immigration that Trump wants to stop. You should not comment on things that you have no idea about.
toephu2 7y ago
On the flip side, if a U.S. citizen moves to India and wants to become a naturalized Indian citizen, just curious how long would that take?
- 0x8BADF00D 7y ago
  If you’re of Indian origin (i.e. parent or grandparent is from India) it’s relatively quick to get an OCI card, which will allow you to remain indefinitely in India as well as work there. You don’t get the right to vote under that status. Full blown citizenship is another matter, you’d have to give up your US citizenship, which still has its benefits. I can say with a great amount of certainty the US government cares a lot more for its citizens than other governments of the world, whose governments are usually outright hostile to their own citizenry/populace.
whack 7y ago
> Guess how much time it takes to get a greed card? Atleast 100 years. I'm not joking. Unless there's a policy change, there's no possibility. Not disputing how ridiculous your situation is, but you do have a couple other options. The most realistic one would be to save up all your money and apply for the eb5 investor visa. If you're making 6 figures, you should be able to save up the required million dollars in about 10-20 years, depending on how much you make, and how frugal you're willing to live. The other possibility is you marrying someone who isn't born in India. If you did that, you can use your partner's country of birth instead of your own, when waiting for the priority date. But obviously this isn't something you can plan for, and I wouldn't recommend letting this guide your life decisions. The last option is progressing your career to the point where you can mount a realistic eb1 application. I've heard anecdotally that it's very hard, but not as hard as people may think it is. If you work at it over a 10-20 year time frame, it may be very realistic.
- diebeforei485 7y ago
  EB-5 isn't too realistic either, considering the wait time between applying and actually receiving a green card is ~10 years.
  - whack 7y ago
    Can you clarify? The EB5 priority date for India is Sept-2018, so why would it take 10 years? https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/visa-bulletin/2020/visa-bulletin-for-february-2020.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/v...
    - diebeforei485 7y ago
      The visa bulletin is useful for past applicants, but is not generally helpful for current or recent applicants. The question current applicants should ask is: if I apply today, when will I get my green card? Last year, the State Department (which runs the bulletin and has all the numbers) said[1] 8.4 years for India EB-5 until visa number availability. It then takes around a year to actually get the physical green card. So, 10 years is a good estimate for someone applying today. 1. The last slide of https://iiusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/IIUSA-2019-EB5-Advocacy-Conference-Visa-Update-with-Charles-Oppenheim-1.pdf https://iiusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/IIUSA-2019-EB5-...

sg47 7y ago

Now is the time to leave. 18 years in the US with a kid born here. I missed the boat in getting my priority date around the time when my friends were getting theirs (my company was laying off people in other departments and my application got audited). Didn't think it was a big deal at that time. Now, my friends are getting their citizenships and I'm still stuck on a visa. I'm at the whim of the Consul officer and the CBP officer every time I renew my visa or come back into the country. Heavily vested here assuming I'll get a green card but planning to apply for Canadian PR just in case. There's an easy way to game the system if one is in the right situation and is willing to risk it. Leave the country and work for the same company for a year as a manager. Come back on a L1 visa and boom you can apply in the EB-1 category and get your green card in a couple of years. I've quite a few friends who easily got their green cards working for TCS, Infosys, etc. Meanwhile, with a Masters degree and 16 years of experience, I'm at the mercy of immigration officers.

bobfrost 7y ago
18 years? That's scary. I'm surprised at the amount of confidence you have in the USCIS that you might get a greed card. If you are still on a visa, I don't see how soon you believe you can get a green card in a reasonable amount of time. I'm not sure you can use the EB-1 category even with an L-1 - unless you're at a very high level in your company. Even for that category, the waitlist is currently about 5 years.
- sg47 7y ago
  Well, I just don't think about it. Pay being very high makes up for it. My priority date is 2 years behind the current priority date for EB2 so I'm hoping for a miracle. I cannot leave because we are so entrenched here and have lots of friends we don't want to leave behind. It doesn't have to be a L1. Even with a H1B, if you worked as a manager in India and come here with a manager title (even Project Manager), you can apply in EB1 as a multinational manager. It's a terrible loophole and one that's mercilessly exploited.
  - fuckyah 7y ago
    > exploited And then you wonder why the US is so strict?
kamaal 7y ago
>>Come back on a L1 visa and boom you can apply in the EB-1 category and get your green card in a couple of years. Those days are gone now. You go into EB-1 only if you get into the US on L1-A. They don't give L1-A's easily these days. For starters you need to be in director level positions to even qualify for L1-A's. Even then the waiting period for India EB-1 itself is growing and stands at 5+ years now. And it will only increase. >>I've quite a few friends who easily got their green cards working for TCS, Infosys, etc. Put the saddle on the right horse. People who come in from those companies often work for <$70K an year. Most are poor blokes who survive on ramen, and giving haircuts to each other so that they can save $8. The real deal is Cgnzt which even until recently filed L1-A's and EB-1's for thousands/lacs of people by cooking up documents. Often promoting some one with a BCom degree to a director, granting them a GC and then rolling back the promotion. Thousands to lacs have made it to GC and Passports this way. When I worked for a short time in the US, it was painful to see PhD students in Stanford struggle for little extra stay, while some one with a basic 2 year diploma land GCs in like an year. In fact even until recently the biggest incentive to work at Cgnzt was this. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-business/indians-rush-for-us-citizenship-before-trump-can-shut-doors/articleshow/73461275.cms https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-business/... 8.4 lac Indians got citizenship only last year. 5.8 lac got green cards. This is basically abuse max. Add this to manager's pets who routinely get their documents cooked to be Nobel Prize worthy talent and land GC's. Literally the wrongest possible people occupy the numbers these days. Add to this a large number of body shopping firms. There are several top level doctors, lawyers and scientists who don't even get B1's. In short we Indians bought this upon ourselves. Like everything else. We abuse things so much, so far and so blatantly it makes things impossible for the real people when they arrive at the scene. I'm one of those people who got burned badly due to all these politics at every level. I have largely given up, you just need to get very lucky early life to win at these things. Or cheat shamelessly.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

bobfrost 7y ago

Can't seem to edit although it's been <2h. Regret the typos. For people looking for data backing what I'm talking about, here's[1] something that everyone looks at to track timelines. This data is released monthly. Search for "EMPLOYMENT-BASED PREFERENCES" In that table you'll see China, India and Mexico specifically called out since they're the ones with such extreme wait times. EB-1 is extremely difficult to qualify for[2] so most people apply for EB-2. You can see currently applications from 2009 are being processed. That was more than a decade ago. Then consider the increase in applications each year since that year. That's where the 100 year figure comes from. [1]: https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/visa-bulletin/2020/visa-bulletin-for-february-2020.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/v... [2]: https://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/permanent-workers/employment-based-immigration-first-preference-eb-1 https://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/permanent-worker...

tathougies 7y ago

> Guess how much time it takes to get a greed card? Atleast 100 years. I'm not joking. Unless there's a policy change, there's no possibility. So my entire family migrated from India (not H1B though, so no idea what that process is like), and some are still migrating, and this is just ridiculous. Green cards and citizenship are issued quite regularly. I'm not going to say its fast, but it's not literally 100 years (can't tell if you were being sarcastic or not). My uncle got his a few years back, and got his citizenship this year. The system works, as long as there're no discrepancies.

sg47 7y ago
That's the current prediction because of the backlog. Family-based migration is different. On a H1B visa, if you get a priority date today, it'll take you a very long time to get your green card. Every year, the backlog moves by 1-2 months. i.e. in the last 6 months, I think the backlog went from processing applications from April 2009 to June 2009. Some months it doesn't move at all. I don't think you know how this system works. Of course, people exploit family-based migration which is more permissive and bring their extended family here but the situation is completely different for people on work-based visas.
thansharp 7y ago
My friend, there's a huge difference between family based green cards (FB categories) and employment based (EB). The wait times change from 1-10 years in the former [1] to 100 in the latter [2]. A normal indian cannot go through family, since they're not closely related to a citizen. I have close relatives who gave birth here (they're working on a H1-B). The mom and dad would make it quicker by waiting for the US citizen kid to become 18 and apply, than they applying. Heck, they can wait for the kid to turn 18, go to Iceland/Sri Lanka, give birth to the grandkid, and that grandkid can apply for the citizenship and that would be faster. :( [1] - friends and my roommate here in the bay [2] - my application
thbr99 7y ago
That's what's called chain migration. Just because your "uncle got a greencard" doesn't mean skilled immigrants get a greencard unlike your unskilled uncle. This is the kind of immigration that Trump wants to stop. You should not comment on things that you have no idea about.

toephu2 7y ago

On the flip side, if a U.S. citizen moves to India and wants to become a naturalized Indian citizen, just curious how long would that take?

0x8BADF00D 7y ago
If you’re of Indian origin (i.e. parent or grandparent is from India) it’s relatively quick to get an OCI card, which will allow you to remain indefinitely in India as well as work there. You don’t get the right to vote under that status. Full blown citizenship is another matter, you’d have to give up your US citizenship, which still has its benefits. I can say with a great amount of certainty the US government cares a lot more for its citizens than other governments of the world, whose governments are usually outright hostile to their own citizenry/populace.

whack 7y ago

> Guess how much time it takes to get a greed card? Atleast 100 years. I'm not joking. Unless there's a policy change, there's no possibility. Not disputing how ridiculous your situation is, but you do have a couple other options. The most realistic one would be to save up all your money and apply for the eb5 investor visa. If you're making 6 figures, you should be able to save up the required million dollars in about 10-20 years, depending on how much you make, and how frugal you're willing to live. The other possibility is you marrying someone who isn't born in India. If you did that, you can use your partner's country of birth instead of your own, when waiting for the priority date. But obviously this isn't something you can plan for, and I wouldn't recommend letting this guide your life decisions. The last option is progressing your career to the point where you can mount a realistic eb1 application. I've heard anecdotally that it's very hard, but not as hard as people may think it is. If you work at it over a 10-20 year time frame, it may be very realistic.

diebeforei485 7y ago
EB-5 isn't too realistic either, considering the wait time between applying and actually receiving a green card is ~10 years.
- whack 7y ago
  Can you clarify? The EB5 priority date for India is Sept-2018, so why would it take 10 years? https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/visa-bulletin/2020/visa-bulletin-for-february-2020.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/v...
  - diebeforei485 7y ago
    The visa bulletin is useful for past applicants, but is not generally helpful for current or recent applicants. The question current applicants should ask is: if I apply today, when will I get my green card? Last year, the State Department (which runs the bulletin and has all the numbers) said[1] 8.4 years for India EB-5 until visa number availability. It then takes around a year to actually get the physical green card. So, 10 years is a good estimate for someone applying today. 1. The last slide of https://iiusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/IIUSA-2019-EB5-Advocacy-Conference-Visa-Update-with-Charles-Oppenheim-1.pdf https://iiusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/IIUSA-2019-EB5-...