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The early versions of counter-strike had a famous bunny-hopping bug where you could cover 40% more ground than simply walking (jumping had a bug where the X and

• Vax45 7y ago
  On the opposite spectrum of simple exploits by jumping, we have Tribes. In the original game, people quickly realized you can exploit the physics engine by jumping, allowing you to quickly traverse the terrain. It became known as "skiing". The devs, rather than patching it, incorporated skiing into Tribes 2 and has been a staple ever since. And also, while Counter Strike has become a massive success and has thousands of players today. Tribes (while it was successful at the time) has become a niche game that quickly weeds out newcomers and hardly anyone plays it anymore. Not saying that there's a correlation, I just find it amusing.
  • alharith 7y ago
    Just to make this technically correct, people still bunny hop in CS all the time, it just doesn't get you anywhere any faster.
    • silvester23 7y ago
      If done right, it gives you a modest speed-up but it's only possible for a short time and also requires some luck without hacks.
    • levosmetalo 7y ago
      It doesn't make you slower either. And shooting at a jumping target is still a bit more difficult than shoot at the linearly moving target.
  • hnick 7y ago
    Warframe has a similar story. It's covered in the NoClip documentary on YouTube. Never played that game but it was a good watch.
    • willis936 7y ago
      I clocked in over a thousand hours in warframe. I can only imagine that the video talks about coptering. Honestly coptering removal is one of the reasons I left. It just took joy out of the game.
  • sbarre 7y ago
    Learning to ski well in Tribes was one of the most satisfying things to learn in an FPS back in the day. If you knew how to really ski well, and had the map mastery to apply it well, it almost felt like cheating sometimes because new players had almost no hope of keeping up. I'm sure in today's world it would get patched out.
  • lasagnaphil 7y ago
    It's just a bummer that Tribes: Ascend (the last installment of Tribes) went downhill quickly and became dead. No other FPS game can match the sheer joy of shooting other players with projectile weapons while skiing midair at 200km/h...
    • bovermyer 7y ago
      Tribes: Ascend was really good. It was a labor of love for the developers who worked on it. Sadly, it was abandoned and taken over by cheaters. Also, it was never as moddable as the original Tribes was, and since there were no private servers, there was no way for the community to pick up the slack after Hi Rez abandoned it.
    • blaser-waffle 7y ago
      exploding CD's, or going heavy and randomly shooting mortars at an enemy base. fun times.
• ta999999171 7y ago
  Play UrbanTerror - that monotony is replaced by wall jumps & power sliding around corners (while still keeping very rigorous/"hardcore" play!!).
  • EamonnMR 7y ago
    Urban terror is an extremely fun shooter. Imo, an action game's goal is to make you feel cool, and almost never have I felt as cool as when I'm double-tapping helmeted players from across the map with the 92g. Of course that was a decade ago now, they've sort of shot themselves in the foot by promising a new experience (Urban Terror HD) and delivering very little since.
• peterlk 7y ago
  This is a soapbox that I really enjoy standing on. I think there is a large number of game developers who have forgotten that the point of a game is to be fun. There is room in the world for hyper-realistic real-time raytracing games. But not a lot of room. To any game developers reading this, my request to you is to please optimize for fun, especially at the expense of polish.
  • montagg 7y ago
    Fun is different things to different people. It’s common for many gamers to believe that fun for them is fun for everyone, but balancing fun for multiple parties in a multiplayer game, where losing has to be fun, too, involves a lot of tradeoffs. Inevitably, there will be some mechanic or feature that works against the long-term health of the game, despite being fun for some, and it’s either the game or the mechanic. One of them has to go. A good designer, though, should also be examining why that mechanic was fun, and how the same dynamics that led to it can be recreated in a way that’s fun for both the player and their opponent. Or even a different game built on different assumptions where those dynamics are accepted. There’s often a lot more that goes into removing something like bunny hopping than just a desire for polish. To any player out there angry at the removal of their favorite mechanic, my request is to consider the whole game and the enjoyment of all the people who play it, even at the expense of the thing that’s fun for you.
    • hmm123 7y ago
      Well said. Good example of this illustrated through a classic CS:S montage video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNvDUO42Hys https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNvDUO42Hys
    • jiofih 7y ago
      I don’t know if you played CS at the time, but there wasn’t a single soul who didn’t enjoy bunny hopping or had mastering it as a goal Besides the standard bomb maps, and the fun game dynamics created by this “bug”, there were hundreds of servers running surf_ maps and others that relied on hopping mechanics. The update threw a massive community in a tar pit.
• adreamingsoul 7y ago
  You would enjoy Urban Terror.
• twic 7y ago
  > Anyways, I think the author should try Overwatch -- it's one of the few contemporary widely played FPSs that doesn't take realism too seriously. Cries in Team Fortress 2
  • cjslep 7y ago
    The amazing community of TF2 is unmatched by Overwatch. From nope.avi to DWL1993's various remixes, they were an integral part of internet meme culture of the late 2000's and early 2010's.
    • krige 7y ago
      Overwatch already seems to have faded from collective consciousness. TF2 still flares up every now and then.
      • blaser-waffle 7y ago
        Apex legends, Rust (the game), PUBG and other "battle royale" games fight for it's marketshare. TF2 has been around long enough to have the weight of history.
        • ascagnel_ 7y ago
          TF2 has also accumulated a decent amount of design cruft -- I'm not a fan of the cosmetics added post-release that alter the silhouettes of the classes, plus the alternate weapons dramatically change how some classes play/must be played against.
        • sushid 7y ago
          OWL and OW itself is still going strong albeit “faded” as you’ve stated. But I’d put Rust in that bucket as well PUBG Is circling around the drain as well. Apex is still doing very well ofc. Escape from Tarkov is the new trending game and the market leaders are still Fortnite CSGO and League.
• hbosch 7y ago
  Bunny hopping is still there in CS:GO, just harder to hit multiple jumps. And, in reference to the thread, CS:GO is the best shooter you can play in 2020. :)
  • Insanity 7y ago
    And if you really like bunny hopping, there's also the dedicated maps/servers to it. Although they seem to be more popular on CS:S than on CS:GO last time I played. (Few years back)
• wingerlang 7y ago
  Where did you get the idea that it was removed since 1.3? bhopping was the main thing I found enjoyable to do and I’ve only played 1.5+. Definitely I was there until 1.6 which is the latest version.
  • rangibaby 7y ago
    Pre-CS1.3 bunnyhopping worked the same as Quake. People soon figured out CS-style bunnyhopping, and it’s hard enough that Valve didn’t bother nerfing it again
• arkh 7y ago
  What modern FPS lack are modability and LAN mode without an internet connection. I would extend this to most multiplayer games. Edit: and recording actions so you can do some hi-def video recording later.
  • aloisdg 7y ago
    I organize LAN for my friend group (from 10 to 16 people). We play mostly CS:GO and UT2004. We tried Xonotic but it didn't catch on. Sometimes we play OverWatch, but the 6 players limit hurt. Also Aoe2 and War3 when we are in a RTS mood. I would love to find a fun car game (something in the vein of Burnout 3). I tried to introduce SuperTuxCard, but my picky friends didn't like it. We are not into moba, nor battle royal game. Any recommendations worth looking?
    • eiffel31 7y ago
      You could try Natural Selection (the HL1 mod) if you like movement-based FPSs (with RTS elements in it).
    • patrickk 7y ago
      Perhaps Reflex Area is for you. There's also this Reddit thread with some ideas: https://www.reddit.com/r/ArenaFPS/comments/a1hm63/arenafps_for_lan_party/ https://www.reddit.com/r/ArenaFPS/comments/a1hm63/arenafps_f...
• Fuzzwah 7y ago
  As a die hard Quakeworld fan, the relatively boring movement physics of CS was one of the things that put me off. I'm not mentioning this to be a jerk, just that I totally understand how the movement can make someone addicted to a game. Side note, when id software handed off maintenance of Quake 2 to Threewave, Zoid added full air control ala QW to Q2. Suddenly I loved the game. Alas, Q2ers almost rioted and it was changed back.
• Jestar342 7y ago
  It was a quake engine bug, which followed into GoldSrc, the engine developed for Half-Life, and thus Counter-Strike. Quake-like games embraced bunny-hopping because I guess they were already pretty "unrealistic" whilst Counter-Strikes entire schtick was about the "realism" that it brought to the scene. And bunny-hopping wasn't removed until 1.4, where they added a movement penalty every time you jump. It was softened in 1.5 after a lot of discord from the player base.
  • willis936 7y ago
    This “realism” argument is not convincing. Quake is an arena shooter. It’s core mechanics are around moving quickly. If there’s a bug that aids that then leave it. CS is about strategic positioning, managing economy, and teamwork. Having a bug that gives an advantage to movement, which isn’t something people play CS for, is not fun.
    • Jestar342 7y ago
      I think you misread my post.
      • willis936 7y ago
        I think I meant to reply to this post. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22221048 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22221048
• socialdemocrat 7y ago
  Ah cool to see another old school game which likes Overwatch. My FPS shooter experience has really been dominated by Doom 2 and Unreal Tournament. Then there was a major break and some Halo playing which I also kind of enjoyed. But when it comes to keeping things simple and enjoyable Overwatch really brought things back for me. For somebody who does not have time to invest tons of time into gaming and don't really care anymore, I love that in Overwatch there is no messing around with picking up weapons. Just learn the weapons your character comes with. The cartoony look of overwatch makes the worlds a lot easier to navigate. Too much realism makes it hard to pick out enemies, objectives etc. Also too realistic weapons, limits the variety of strategies one can employ. I care more about internal consistency than absolute realism. Fortnite does not do it for me. You got these sort of realistic weapons but then then people can build walls hand houses in record time, in the middle of a fight. It just seems really dumb. Although this seems acceptable to me in Minecraft, but against I guess it is the internal consistency. The graphics and everything in Minecraft suggests there is nothing odd about building a wall in the middle of a fight.
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• screye 7y ago
  This is something I love about Dota. So many of its "features" started out as bugs. Apart from proper game-breaking bugs (fountain hooks, bottle crow), everything else stays mostly untouched. A vast majority of hero balance often came down to limitations of the WC3 engine, that were carried on into Source2 because they had now become hero defining traits.
• t4nkd 7y ago
  I was very much a part of this community at the time and engaged in a lot of discussions around this "feature". Part of the issue is that there were degrees of bunny hopping (as in being able to do it extremely well and consistently) and script assisted bunny hops were also becoming a thing. This was also around the advent of aimbotting finally reaching the half-life engine and there was a real discussion about turning new players away from the game because of these "pro features". Ultimately it wasn't part of the intended game design, despite being a bit of a fun imaginary minigame within the greater 5v5, and I agree it was the best choice for all the mods around that time (CS wasn't the only one you could bhop in). To add to this anecdote though, knife scraping on a wall when the round is down to 1v1 was almost always universally "come knife fight me" and for the many times I've seen players arrange this duel I rarely see either try to "cheat" and shoot the other.
  • deleted 7y ago
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• dadarepublic 7y ago
  I hate to say it but bunny-hopping exploits still exists in CS - although in a less extreme form. Super hard to do manually now so many people that do it are using scripts to accomplish the same feats. Don’t ask me how I know this.
• Sholmesy 7y ago
  > The early versions of counter-strike had a famous bunny-hopping bug where you could cover 40% more ground than simply walking (jumping had a bug where the X and Y coordinates were individually calculated, so if you moved in both directions at the same time you would cover sqrt(2) ground) "Admin he's doing it sideways" Great example of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRCeSpQUgbc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRCeSpQUgbc
• ryanmercer 7y ago
  The bunny hopping thing was an interesting time. Later, Battlefield 2142 had you spawn in via drop pods which you had extremely limited control over so you could try to land behind cover, it was discovered if you rapidly moved the mouse you could move farther. If you had a mouse that you could change the DPI on the fly you could crank it and actually travel across an entire map. Enter the pod surfing advantage. With some skill you could basically land wherever you wanted to within feet, dropping behind enemy lines gave you an insane advantage. You could actually drop at the very back of an enemy controlled area, behind their most distant respawn and just waste the other team. You could also use pod surfing to reach elevated positions that you could not get to otherwise. You could just sit in your sniper perch laying waste to unsuspecting people below. Better you could get up there, then have a teammate land as resupply or as a medic and effectively stay there the rest of the map dealing death. The clan I played with was very good at pod surfing, any time a guy would get in one of those positions I'd steer over to them and drop health or resupply depending on what they needed and then I'd just suicide and respawn elsewhere until they needed resupply again and I'd kamikaze and head surf back to them. Sometimes we'd organize sessions with another clan that was similarly adept at pod surfing and we'd either go play on their server or they'd come to ours and stuff would get ridiculous. Poor unsuspecting randoms would join the server and be like 'what the hell is even going on?!'. I think of all the FPS I've played, BF 2142 was probably the bulk of my most memorable FPS experiences, thanks entirely to that bug. I joined that clan because they saw me pod surfing on their server and extended an invite. I played with them for 3 BF games total before we all sorta went our own ways. Fairly quickly servers with active mods would ban you for it and eventually they implemented something to seriously nerf pod surfing but man, it was fun while it lasted.
• Svperstar 7y ago
  I was heavily into CS starting in 1999. The mad dash at the beginning was fun to some players but being forced to bunny hop to be competitive got old really fast.
• markandrewj 7y ago
  This was a mechanic that was in the original Half Life games, it comes from GoldSrc (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GoldSrc https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GoldSrc), the original Half Life engine, being a heavily modified Quake World engine. It's funny you mention Overwatch, because many of the old Quake players are now playing Overwatch competitively. In Quake this kind of movement is a part of the gameplay, but for Counter Strike, many of the maps were not designed with the intention of this kind of movement being used. The result was people were able to do things like get into the skybox. Even though you can't bunny hop in Counter Strike like you could back then, there are still movement tricks, and maps specifically made for practicing movement. At the time there was also TFC, which was more willing to sacrifice 'realism' for game play, but Team Fortress had also existed previously for Quake World as well. All of that said, right now the most played game is Fortnite, and it definitely does not put realism first.
  • Moru 7y ago
    Oh, how we worked on our quake jumping skills, trying to get from the long passage over to a hill on the other side of some water. Q2DM1: The Edge. We also played a lot of actionquake later. We made maps especially for jumping with this technique but I can't remember ever calling it bunnyjumping. Funny, yesterday my daughter found how to move faster in some game by pressing strafe and forward at the same time. Had some fun to explain how that works with math in programming :-)
    • markandrewj 7y ago
      You might of heard the term 'strafe jumping' used in place of 'bunny jumping', they are actually different things, but depending on the game you played the term might of been used interchangeably. "The main difference between the two is that Bunny Hopping requires the player to release the forward movement key immediately upon strafing." https://quake.fandom.com/wiki/Bunny_Hopping https://quake.fandom.com/wiki/Bunny_Hopping In other words, if you were playing Q1/Quake World, to gain speed, you would jump and only press left and right. To keep going straight you would flick your mouse in the opposite direction that you were pressing on the keyboard. Although there are a bunch of other small tricks. In Quake 3 you would be required to press forward and left/right, unless you were playing something like CPMA. You also had more air control in something like Q1/Quake World. It is pretty interesting from a gaming and programming perspective :). Also, not about mechanics, but Q2 CTF was really fun at the time :D
• Izkata 7y ago
  Another such bug (though probably from a different FPS) is rocket jumps - which made it into a live-action TV show, The Librarians: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_wvUP6R20A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_wvUP6R20A