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I registered an account just to comment on this. With all of the new interest in psychedelics over the past few years, so many people are jumping it without pre

I registered an account just to comment on this. With all of the new interest in psychedelics over the past few years, so many people are jumping it without preparation and without an idea of what they're risking. As far as drugs go psychedelics are generally very safe. They can have amazing therapeutic properties for some people. But don't do them without first doing as much research and preparation as possible, and without some idea of what you're getting into. Psychedelics break down walls in your brain, but some walls are there for a good reason. I had an intensely terrifying "bad trip" (on something much less potent than DMT) some time ago that I'm still trying to come to terms with. I had no idea that the human mind could suffer like that. The suffering, terror, and panic was really beyond anything I've ever experienced. Some people argue that there is no such thing as a "bad trip" -- only difficult ones that unearth negative thought processes and past trauma, and that you can utilize them to become a happier and better person. For a lot of people this is definitely true, but there are cases of psychedelics triggering long term anxiety, PTSD, DP/DR, etc. If you want to get into psychedelics -- and especially stuff like DMT -- do your homework. Ask yourself why you actually want to do it. If you decide to go through with it, respect the drug, start with low dosages, and follow harm reduction practices.

mmazing 7y ago
Yeah. 15+ years after a bad trip for me, I am still dealing with the effect it had on my life. It honestly had an entirely different effect than articles like this portray - it turned me from an easy going worry free 20 year old into a panic-attack riddled alcoholic (the only way I could get to sleep for many years.) I guess the good side of it was that all that anxiety made me quit smoking, quit drinking caffeine, and come to terms with the fact that I am indeed mortal. So in a certain way it has really focused my life into actually living it and not just going through the motions. I'm 95% better at this point, but yeah, not a good time in my case.
- pmoriarty 7y ago
  I really wish that both good and bad trip reports would be much more thorough in their reporting. Useful things to know to make sense of and draw useful conclusions from trip reports: 0 - whether there was any preparation (things like fasting, meditation, therapy, prayer, "clearing the space", etc) 1 - exactly what was taken and its purity, how the users knew they got the substance they were told they had, and whether they mixed drugs 2 - the dosage 3 - where they had the experience (whether it was done at a club, at a party, at a concert, in a city street, over dinner with one's parents, in nature, in therapy, at a friend's house, in a church, or in a shamanic ceremony will make a huge difference) 4 - who was with them (and whether these people were trained or at least experienced in guiding psychedelic trips) 5 - whether they had set any concrete, constructive intentions beforehand, or whether it was done on a whim, to "party" or to "get fucked up" 6 - what was their mindset and life circumstances beforehand (tired? depressed? anxious? struggling with a breakup, a divorce, or a death of a loved one? a history of abuse or trauma in their past?) 7 - how much they themselves had researched about what they were getting themselves in to, and in to mystical, psychedelic, shamanic, and non-ordinary states of consciousness in general and how different cultures and peoples have dealt with and made sense of them 8 - whether they used any strategies before or during the session to prevent or handle adverse effects (things such as ritual, dance or movement, chanting, singing, playing musical instruments, prayer or calling for help from their guides, friends, god(s), or their own inner source of strength or wisdom) 9 - whether and what kind of music was played during the experience (a well designed musical accompaniment can make a huge difference, and this is one of the critical means by which the MAPS psilocybin and MDMA studies maximized the chances of having a constructive experience) 10 - how or if they tried to integrate the experience afterwards 11 - whether they consulted therapists specializing in psychedelic integration afterwards 12 - whether they themselves or anyone in their family had a history of mental illness 13 - how much prior experience with psychedelics they had, and which psychedelics they had used 14 - whether they were on any psychoactive medications 15 - what their state of physical health was This is a lot to ask for, but without such details it's really hard to draw conclusions. That said, yes, it's possible to have really harrowing experiences, and some people come out scarred from them, having gotten nothing positive from the experience at all. But it is possible to prepare for psychedelic experiences in such a way as to minimize the risk of negative experiences, and if such experiences do happen to deal in constructive ways with them both during and after. Unfortunately, many people don't know how to do that, or choose not to. Something else to think about: Some people think they're "happy" or "normal", but they're really not, and just haven't been able to face their own dark sides, repressed past traumas, or the difficulties they have relating with others, and these things can come up during the trip or influence it. Then a common reaction is to fight these realizations or run away from them, to hold on tight and not let go, which all but guarantees a difficult experience. In contrast, the MAPS guidelines advise to squarely face the difficulties (including physical difficulties like pain or discomfort, and even annoyance at the music), to explore them, to not fight them, and to surrender and let go. That tends to lead to a freeing, blissful, constructive experience. One final thing: In an interview I once heard with a veteran psychedelic therapist, who'd overseen hundreds of psychedelics sessions, he said the people who had the toughest times with these substances were die hard theists or atheists with something to prove, because they both went in to the experience with an attitude of "I know what's going on!" They weren't able to just go with whatever was revealed to them.
  - floatinglotus 7y ago
    I want to reinforce what is said in this post. I did not not have respect for DMT and it floored me. I misused it several times to my own detriment and I really wish I hadn’t. It is not to be played with. This drug holds profound opportunities for personal growth and development. If you misuse it you are taking a huge risk.
- ada1981 7y ago
  Did you work with someone to help you integrate the trip? Rick Doblin helped me integrate a psychosis I had 20 years prior within about 5 minutes of meeting me.
  - Trasmatta 7y ago
    Thanks for this idea, I Googled Rick Doblin, which led me to MAPS, and now I've discovered there are two therapists in my home town that specialize in psychedelic integration. I'm going to contact them, I'm hoping that's exactly what I need to help me recover from my experience.
    - ada1981 7y ago
      Great. I’d be happy to talk to you one on one via FaceTime if you like as well. a@175g.com
      - Trasmatta 7y ago
        Thank you for the offer, I really appreciate it!
jl2718 7y ago
I had a near-death experience that I would describe similarly. Psychedelics scare me.
- proverbialbunny 7y ago
  It must be a terrible experience to have minutes to hours of thinking you're dieing and the suffering that comes from fighting that. My heart goes out to you. There is this movie called Revolver written by psychologists who try to show the audience their ego is not them. Some people took to the movie well and others... When Roger Ebert reviewed the movie he wrote, "Some of the acting is better than the film deserves. Make that all of the acting. Actually, the film stock itself is better than the film deserves. You know when sometimes a film catches fire inside a projector? If it happened with this one, I suspect the audience might cheer." Tripping reduces the ego. If you go too far, the ego disappears for a couple of seconds. But for those who mistakenly think their ego is them, when their ego starts to disappear, they think it is them that is dying. A good sitter will tell them they're not dying, and they'll relax and have a good trip, but sadly not everyone gets that treatment. The ego processes language and concepts. It understands words and it speaks words. It is tied to the inner dialog. When the processing of concepts, like the word 'self' and the concept of identity temporarily goes away, sometimes people mistake that for them.
  - jl2718 7y ago
    I don’t mean “I thought I was dying”. I mean that I actually was dying and the regular world turned off and another world turned on. At first it was dark and silent; no perception of any kind, absolutely nothing. I could talk but there was no echo, and then I slowly realized that I didn’t have to breathe, and then I began to panic and scream because I realized what was happening although I didn’t know why. Then transported to dream state, long vision quest kind of stuff that I’m still trying to process (10 years). Then back into nothing world, but this time it’s tearing and burning deep throughout my body, a seemingly impossible level of physical pain; mental anguish or fear of death not even registering anymore. Then I came back to consciousness in and out for a while during the rescue and eventually back to (mostly) normal. The mind’s potential for suffering is immense. The scale doesn’t go nearly as far in the other direction. I cannot imagine any possible pleasure within many orders of magnitude. I can see how this would stop addictions by eliminating the sense of all pleasure or minor discomfort. Its possible that this was part of ego dissolution and I just didn’t come completely to the point of acceptance of the pain, but I think about it a lot, and fully expect an eternity of that when I die.
proverbialbunny 7y ago
Just a heads up: 5-meo is not DMT. There are quite a few chemicals with DMT in their name like 4-aco (4-AcO-DMT), which is also not DMT. Also, when it comes to 5-meo you don't really "trip" per se, not in the traditional sense. You just kind of half pass out for about a minute. The potential for the risks you mention on 5-meo is nearly impossible, due to it not being a traditional kind of trip. Likewise, DMT you don't really trip in a traditional way either. For about 5 to 15 minutes, you're off in la la land. You can barely think straight let alone enough to explore your inner mind like you would do during a normal trip. For similar reasons, the risks you describe are most likely non existent for DMT. Though, DMT isn't exactly enjoyable for most, so there is that. I've seen a few studies and so far it seems to be that cannabis is most likely to cause the risks you're describing, including psychosis. While those risks are possible on LSD, magic mushrooms, and other drugs you trip on, the risk is far lower than in cannabis.
- Kiro 7y ago
  Not true for 5-MeO-DIPT. The trip lasts for hours.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- raducu 7y ago
  How about the possibility for HPPD, I think that's universal to all psychedelics?
  - proverbialbunny 7y ago
    It's so rare it isn't studied, so I can't say if 5-Meo can cause it. HPPD in theory is caused by a strong intense memory, and when something familiar to that memory occurs it brings that person back to that mental place. If this is what is going on, then you're going to have a hard time forming a strong memory to something when you're passed out or so out of it you're not paying attention to the setting around you. So, I imagine HPPD is not a thing in 5-Meo, but as I said there are not studies on it. HPPD is rare.

mmazing 7y ago

Yeah. 15+ years after a bad trip for me, I am still dealing with the effect it had on my life. It honestly had an entirely different effect than articles like this portray - it turned me from an easy going worry free 20 year old into a panic-attack riddled alcoholic (the only way I could get to sleep for many years.) I guess the good side of it was that all that anxiety made me quit smoking, quit drinking caffeine, and come to terms with the fact that I am indeed mortal. So in a certain way it has really focused my life into actually living it and not just going through the motions. I'm 95% better at this point, but yeah, not a good time in my case.

pmoriarty 7y ago
I really wish that both good and bad trip reports would be much more thorough in their reporting. Useful things to know to make sense of and draw useful conclusions from trip reports: 0 - whether there was any preparation (things like fasting, meditation, therapy, prayer, "clearing the space", etc) 1 - exactly what was taken and its purity, how the users knew they got the substance they were told they had, and whether they mixed drugs 2 - the dosage 3 - where they had the experience (whether it was done at a club, at a party, at a concert, in a city street, over dinner with one's parents, in nature, in therapy, at a friend's house, in a church, or in a shamanic ceremony will make a huge difference) 4 - who was with them (and whether these people were trained or at least experienced in guiding psychedelic trips) 5 - whether they had set any concrete, constructive intentions beforehand, or whether it was done on a whim, to "party" or to "get fucked up" 6 - what was their mindset and life circumstances beforehand (tired? depressed? anxious? struggling with a breakup, a divorce, or a death of a loved one? a history of abuse or trauma in their past?) 7 - how much they themselves had researched about what they were getting themselves in to, and in to mystical, psychedelic, shamanic, and non-ordinary states of consciousness in general and how different cultures and peoples have dealt with and made sense of them 8 - whether they used any strategies before or during the session to prevent or handle adverse effects (things such as ritual, dance or movement, chanting, singing, playing musical instruments, prayer or calling for help from their guides, friends, god(s), or their own inner source of strength or wisdom) 9 - whether and what kind of music was played during the experience (a well designed musical accompaniment can make a huge difference, and this is one of the critical means by which the MAPS psilocybin and MDMA studies maximized the chances of having a constructive experience) 10 - how or if they tried to integrate the experience afterwards 11 - whether they consulted therapists specializing in psychedelic integration afterwards 12 - whether they themselves or anyone in their family had a history of mental illness 13 - how much prior experience with psychedelics they had, and which psychedelics they had used 14 - whether they were on any psychoactive medications 15 - what their state of physical health was This is a lot to ask for, but without such details it's really hard to draw conclusions. That said, yes, it's possible to have really harrowing experiences, and some people come out scarred from them, having gotten nothing positive from the experience at all. But it is possible to prepare for psychedelic experiences in such a way as to minimize the risk of negative experiences, and if such experiences do happen to deal in constructive ways with them both during and after. Unfortunately, many people don't know how to do that, or choose not to. Something else to think about: Some people think they're "happy" or "normal", but they're really not, and just haven't been able to face their own dark sides, repressed past traumas, or the difficulties they have relating with others, and these things can come up during the trip or influence it. Then a common reaction is to fight these realizations or run away from them, to hold on tight and not let go, which all but guarantees a difficult experience. In contrast, the MAPS guidelines advise to squarely face the difficulties (including physical difficulties like pain or discomfort, and even annoyance at the music), to explore them, to not fight them, and to surrender and let go. That tends to lead to a freeing, blissful, constructive experience. One final thing: In an interview I once heard with a veteran psychedelic therapist, who'd overseen hundreds of psychedelics sessions, he said the people who had the toughest times with these substances were die hard theists or atheists with something to prove, because they both went in to the experience with an attitude of "I know what's going on!" They weren't able to just go with whatever was revealed to them.
- floatinglotus 7y ago
  I want to reinforce what is said in this post. I did not not have respect for DMT and it floored me. I misused it several times to my own detriment and I really wish I hadn’t. It is not to be played with. This drug holds profound opportunities for personal growth and development. If you misuse it you are taking a huge risk.
ada1981 7y ago
Did you work with someone to help you integrate the trip? Rick Doblin helped me integrate a psychosis I had 20 years prior within about 5 minutes of meeting me.
- Trasmatta 7y ago
  Thanks for this idea, I Googled Rick Doblin, which led me to MAPS, and now I've discovered there are two therapists in my home town that specialize in psychedelic integration. I'm going to contact them, I'm hoping that's exactly what I need to help me recover from my experience.
  - ada1981 7y ago
    Great. I’d be happy to talk to you one on one via FaceTime if you like as well. a@175g.com
    - Trasmatta 7y ago
      Thank you for the offer, I really appreciate it!

jl2718 7y ago

I had a near-death experience that I would describe similarly. Psychedelics scare me.

proverbialbunny 7y ago
It must be a terrible experience to have minutes to hours of thinking you're dieing and the suffering that comes from fighting that. My heart goes out to you. There is this movie called Revolver written by psychologists who try to show the audience their ego is not them. Some people took to the movie well and others... When Roger Ebert reviewed the movie he wrote, "Some of the acting is better than the film deserves. Make that all of the acting. Actually, the film stock itself is better than the film deserves. You know when sometimes a film catches fire inside a projector? If it happened with this one, I suspect the audience might cheer." Tripping reduces the ego. If you go too far, the ego disappears for a couple of seconds. But for those who mistakenly think their ego is them, when their ego starts to disappear, they think it is them that is dying. A good sitter will tell them they're not dying, and they'll relax and have a good trip, but sadly not everyone gets that treatment. The ego processes language and concepts. It understands words and it speaks words. It is tied to the inner dialog. When the processing of concepts, like the word 'self' and the concept of identity temporarily goes away, sometimes people mistake that for them.
- jl2718 7y ago
  I don’t mean “I thought I was dying”. I mean that I actually was dying and the regular world turned off and another world turned on. At first it was dark and silent; no perception of any kind, absolutely nothing. I could talk but there was no echo, and then I slowly realized that I didn’t have to breathe, and then I began to panic and scream because I realized what was happening although I didn’t know why. Then transported to dream state, long vision quest kind of stuff that I’m still trying to process (10 years). Then back into nothing world, but this time it’s tearing and burning deep throughout my body, a seemingly impossible level of physical pain; mental anguish or fear of death not even registering anymore. Then I came back to consciousness in and out for a while during the rescue and eventually back to (mostly) normal. The mind’s potential for suffering is immense. The scale doesn’t go nearly as far in the other direction. I cannot imagine any possible pleasure within many orders of magnitude. I can see how this would stop addictions by eliminating the sense of all pleasure or minor discomfort. Its possible that this was part of ego dissolution and I just didn’t come completely to the point of acceptance of the pain, but I think about it a lot, and fully expect an eternity of that when I die.

proverbialbunny 7y ago

Just a heads up: 5-meo is not DMT. There are quite a few chemicals with DMT in their name like 4-aco (4-AcO-DMT), which is also not DMT. Also, when it comes to 5-meo you don't really "trip" per se, not in the traditional sense. You just kind of half pass out for about a minute. The potential for the risks you mention on 5-meo is nearly impossible, due to it not being a traditional kind of trip. Likewise, DMT you don't really trip in a traditional way either. For about 5 to 15 minutes, you're off in la la land. You can barely think straight let alone enough to explore your inner mind like you would do during a normal trip. For similar reasons, the risks you describe are most likely non existent for DMT. Though, DMT isn't exactly enjoyable for most, so there is that. I've seen a few studies and so far it seems to be that cannabis is most likely to cause the risks you're describing, including psychosis. While those risks are possible on LSD, magic mushrooms, and other drugs you trip on, the risk is far lower than in cannabis.

Kiro 7y ago
Not true for 5-MeO-DIPT. The trip lasts for hours.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
raducu 7y ago
How about the possibility for HPPD, I think that's universal to all psychedelics?
- proverbialbunny 7y ago
  It's so rare it isn't studied, so I can't say if 5-Meo can cause it. HPPD in theory is caused by a strong intense memory, and when something familiar to that memory occurs it brings that person back to that mental place. If this is what is going on, then you're going to have a hard time forming a strong memory to something when you're passed out or so out of it you're not paying attention to the setting around you. So, I imagine HPPD is not a thing in 5-Meo, but as I said there are not studies on it. HPPD is rare.