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I thought the purpose of tax was to fund the government. Not to take stuff that other people wanted..... Property taxes are among the most economically efficie
by harryh 7y ago
I thought the purpose of tax was to fund the government. Not to take stuff that other people wanted.....
Property taxes are among the most economically efficient taxes that exist. They are an excellent way to fund the government.
- scarface74 7y agoHow are they "economically efficient"? It doesn't cost anymore to serve someone in a million dollar home than a $200K home. Besides that you get into situations where richer neigborhood have better services, better funded school systems, etc.
- harryh 7y agoBecause they don't discourage otherwise positive economic activity.
- scarface74 7y agoDo you feel the same way about the government taking private property via eminent domain to build a Walmart?
- harryh 7y agoNo.
- scarface74 7y agoWhat's the difference? Either way you're taking property for "positive economic activity". A Walmart can bring more jobs than a group of houses....
- tptacek 7y agoOne obvious difference is that property taxes are applied uniformly and predictably --- a whole industry exists to plan around them --- and eminent domain is not, so widespread application of ED would create uncertainty that would discourage positive activity.
- scarface74 7y agoWhat’s “predictable” about having to pay taxes on a property that you don’t know how much will appreciate? Someone who bought a house 30 years ago while they were working, paid it off and had enough in savings to pay their bills but not pay taxes on a house that went up 10x the rate of inflation couldn’t predict their tax bill. What happens when they can’t pay their taxes? The government takes it.
- tptacek 7y agoThis is an unserious argument. ED and property taxes aren't comparably unpredictable. An obvious illustration of this would be the fact that most places in the US don't have California's cap, and people manage tax planning just fine. If your real argument is, essentially, "taxation is theft", that's a coherent position, but since most people don't agree with the premise, you're not left with much to contribute to this particular discussion.
- scarface74 7y agoNo, I’m not saying that “taxation” is theft, but the undercurrent of raising property taxes on people who have been living in their houses for years is that the land could be better use by “more productive” tech bro’s than old people and if you raise the taxes enough, they would be forced to move. Those same tech bro’s would hate it if they were taxed on unrealized, illiquid wealth. But, yes there are plenty of jurisdictions that give property tax breaks to senior citizens.
- tptacek 7y agoThis is how property taxes work pretty much everywhere else, dense and sparse, tight housing market and loose. It doesn't seem to be causing a crisis anywhere, unlike California's policy, which is implicated in an actual housing shortage.
- harryh 7y agoIn addition to what tptacek said, taxes are paid with money which is an infinitely fungible commodity. Eminent domain confiscates a specific piece of property that cannot be precisely replaced.
- scarface74 7y agoMoney is a fungible commodity but a house isn’t. You can’t sell part of a house. If that’s where all of your wealth is. You
- harryh 7y agoYou can’t sell part of a house. Sure you can: https://point.com/how_it_works https://point.com/how_it_works
- scarface74 7y agoFair enough so we should also tax equity in private companies. That money could also be used for positive economic activity.....
- harryh 7y agoI'm glad you've come around to my p.o.v. on property taxes! The pros and cons of a mark to market capital gains tax are pretty far outside of the scope of this thread, so I will save my thoughts on them for another day.
- scarface74 7y agoIt’s the same concept. You want to tax illiquid unrealized wealth that may force people to sell the underlying illiquid asset to pay taxes.
- harryh 7y agoI already covered this way upthread. Property taxes aren't wealth taxes, they're consumption taxes.