6 ms·

News.gmane.org is now news.gmane.io

88 points by mariuz 7y ago

clement_b 7y ago
.io is probably the worst choice you could go with if what you're looking for is long term stability. This tld is problematic and really, should not be used. https://gigaom.com/2014/06/30/the-dark-side-of-io-how-the-u-k-is-making-web-domain-profits-from-a-shady-cold-war-land-deal/ https://gigaom.com/2014/06/30/the-dark-side-of-io-how-the-u-...
- bdcravens 7y ago
  It may be questionable on value grounds, but I suspect it will be stable: "ICB gets to run .io “more or less indefinitely, unless we make a technical mistake,” Kane told me. (ICB has so far run a stable .io namespace. It should be noted that Kane is a respected veteran of the infrastructure scene, and has been entrusted by ICANN with one of the 7 so-called “keys to the internet”.)"
josteink 7y ago
With the current state of ICANN, it seems like migrating from .org is a good idea. If migrating to .io is a change for the better, I do not know. Why not something more traditional like .com or .net? Edit: Disregard completely. The guy evidently lost the domain through some mild incompetence, and never managed to restore it. Boy, does that have to suck.
- delfinom 7y ago
  That's not the reason if you actually were to read.
  - tomashubelbauer 7y ago
    Specifically this linked article https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to-news-gmane-org/ https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to...
  - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
    The site guidelines ask that we avoid doing this: Please don't comment on whether someone read an article. "Did you even read the article? It mentions that" can be shortened to "The article mentions that." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
    - delfinom 7y ago
      Don't try and get people to educate and improve themselves and instead let them babble mindlessly?
      - dang 7y ago
        That's a fine intention, but please achieve it by respectfully providing better information (for example, like thcz's sibling comment did). Don't do it by being rude and aggressive, which breaks the site guidelines (https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html) and contributes to damaging the container for everybody.
smitty1e 7y ago
How can we support this effort?
- icebraining 7y ago
  It seems he accepts offers to register missing mailing lists.
  - smitty1e 7y ago
    I meant "fund". Something like patreon at least to keep it going. Hate to see a great resource with a "single point of success".
    - icebraining 7y ago
      Seems he's not interested in cash donations: https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/15/news-gmane-org-is-now-news-gmane-io/#comment-36470 https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/15/news-gmane-org-is-no...
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
numlock86 7y ago
Anyone remember the discussion years ago when a lot of people on the web (including the early github community and alike) stood up against the "misuse" of TLDs like .io and .tv?
- RHSeeger 7y ago
  Personally, I still see it as a misuse. Those TLDs stand for countries and it doesn't feel right to me to use them for generic TLDs.
  - souterrain 7y ago
    Or, in the case of .io, a colony/possession/militarybase that has been depopulated of its people. (No, it is not the only place that has been depopulated in the name of colonialism.) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expulsion_of_the_Chagossians https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expulsion_of_the_Chagossians
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - bauerd 7y ago
    Are there any negative consequences to this "misuse"?
    - Symbiote 7y ago
      CCTLDs are useful for searching. I fairly often add "site:dk" to my Google searches. I know I'm excluding Danish sites using generic TLDs, or using Danish domain hacks¹, but it's usually good enough to get past the irrelevant results I didn't want. Search engines can also use the CCTLD as part of the signalling -- a .dk site is almost certainly related to Denmark. That doesn't work for .to, .nu, .cc and so on. (.IO is unusual, the only genuinely linked site I can see is the government's, at https://biot.gov.io/ https://biot.gov.io/ ) Google has a list of CCTLDs it considers "generic"², I don't know if they have workarounds for sites actually linked to these places. ¹ "A/S" is a type of company registration, so American Samoa ".as" is used, "nu" means "now" so there's some use of Niue ".nu". ² https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/182192#generic-domains https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/182192#generic-...
tinus_hn 7y ago
Is this just the nntp bridge or is the web archive returning as well?
lonelappde 7y ago
As I see it, Gmane is a stateless website/nntp server, plus a data archive of public data (copyright law notwithstanding, since Lars never worried about it like Yahoo Groups/Oath apparently worries about now). I don't think Lars was protective of his server software IP, right? And he didn't sell Gmane for money, right? Is there any reason there weren't 2 or 3 variations of it, run separately, as backups? When Lars agreed to hand it over, why not put out a call to the public to clone it? Isn't the point of NNTP in the first place: a decentralized news archive?
wonderment 7y ago
The previous article this one links to explains why: https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to-news-gmane-org/ https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to....
- jolmg 7y ago
  That's funny! And here I was expecting this to be related to the sale of .org.
  - Thorrez 7y ago
    That would be a funny reason to switch to .io because people have been complaining about .io as well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8587379 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8587379
orf 7y ago
Maybe name the company that's not responding and not updating the DNS record?
- jolmg 7y ago
  Why? It probably would come back to bite OP if it results in people reading their blog spamming or otherwise retaliating against the company.
- TimWolla 7y ago
  The 'Y' is mentioned in this blog post: https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2016/09/06/gmane-alive/ https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2016/09/06/gmane-alive/
- snthd 7y ago
  By making it possible to find, but not explicit it avoids low hanging outrage, which doesn't help anyone. If anyone contacts this company they need to assume good faith and be understanding - it's possible there are good reasons (the individuals health?) for the non-resposiveness. It's not like they've repurposed the domain for financial gain. I'm guessing C is cloudflare - in which case the situation is a bit ironic as the domain uses cloudflare DNS.

88 points by mariuz 7y ago

.io is probably the worst choice you could go with if what you're looking for is long term stability. This tld is problematic and really, should not be used. https://gigaom.com/2014/06/30/the-dark-side-of-io-how-the-u-k-is-making-web-domain-profits-from-a-shady-cold-war-land-deal/ https://gigaom.com/2014/06/30/the-dark-side-of-io-how-the-u-...

bdcravens 7y ago
It may be questionable on value grounds, but I suspect it will be stable: "ICB gets to run .io “more or less indefinitely, unless we make a technical mistake,” Kane told me. (ICB has so far run a stable .io namespace. It should be noted that Kane is a respected veteran of the infrastructure scene, and has been entrusted by ICANN with one of the 7 so-called “keys to the internet”.)"

josteink 7y ago

With the current state of ICANN, it seems like migrating from .org is a good idea. If migrating to .io is a change for the better, I do not know. Why not something more traditional like .com or .net? Edit: Disregard completely. The guy evidently lost the domain through some mild incompetence, and never managed to restore it. Boy, does that have to suck.

delfinom 7y ago
That's not the reason if you actually were to read.
- tomashubelbauer 7y ago
  Specifically this linked article https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to-news-gmane-org/ https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to...
- TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
  The site guidelines ask that we avoid doing this: Please don't comment on whether someone read an article. "Did you even read the article? It mentions that" can be shortened to "The article mentions that." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - delfinom 7y ago
    Don't try and get people to educate and improve themselves and instead let them babble mindlessly?
    - dang 7y ago
      That's a fine intention, but please achieve it by respectfully providing better information (for example, like thcz's sibling comment did). Don't do it by being rude and aggressive, which breaks the site guidelines (https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html) and contributes to damaging the container for everybody.

smitty1e 7y ago

How can we support this effort?

icebraining 7y ago
It seems he accepts offers to register missing mailing lists.
- smitty1e 7y ago
  I meant "fund". Something like patreon at least to keep it going. Hate to see a great resource with a "single point of success".
  - icebraining 7y ago
    Seems he's not interested in cash donations: https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/15/news-gmane-org-is-now-news-gmane-io/#comment-36470 https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/15/news-gmane-org-is-no...

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

numlock86 7y ago

Anyone remember the discussion years ago when a lot of people on the web (including the early github community and alike) stood up against the "misuse" of TLDs like .io and .tv?

RHSeeger 7y ago
Personally, I still see it as a misuse. Those TLDs stand for countries and it doesn't feel right to me to use them for generic TLDs.
- souterrain 7y ago
  Or, in the case of .io, a colony/possession/militarybase that has been depopulated of its people. (No, it is not the only place that has been depopulated in the name of colonialism.) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expulsion_of_the_Chagossians https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expulsion_of_the_Chagossians
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- bauerd 7y ago
  Are there any negative consequences to this "misuse"?
  - Symbiote 7y ago
    CCTLDs are useful for searching. I fairly often add "site:dk" to my Google searches. I know I'm excluding Danish sites using generic TLDs, or using Danish domain hacks¹, but it's usually good enough to get past the irrelevant results I didn't want. Search engines can also use the CCTLD as part of the signalling -- a .dk site is almost certainly related to Denmark. That doesn't work for .to, .nu, .cc and so on. (.IO is unusual, the only genuinely linked site I can see is the government's, at https://biot.gov.io/ https://biot.gov.io/ ) Google has a list of CCTLDs it considers "generic"², I don't know if they have workarounds for sites actually linked to these places. ¹ "A/S" is a type of company registration, so American Samoa ".as" is used, "nu" means "now" so there's some use of Niue ".nu". ² https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/182192#generic-domains https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/182192#generic-...

tinus_hn 7y ago

Is this just the nntp bridge or is the web archive returning as well?

lonelappde 7y ago

As I see it, Gmane is a stateless website/nntp server, plus a data archive of public data (copyright law notwithstanding, since Lars never worried about it like Yahoo Groups/Oath apparently worries about now). I don't think Lars was protective of his server software IP, right? And he didn't sell Gmane for money, right? Is there any reason there weren't 2 or 3 variations of it, run separately, as backups? When Lars agreed to hand it over, why not put out a call to the public to clone it? Isn't the point of NNTP in the first place: a decentralized news archive?

wonderment 7y ago

The previous article this one links to explains why: https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to-news-gmane-org/ https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2020/01/06/whatever-happened-to....

jolmg 7y ago
That's funny! And here I was expecting this to be related to the sale of .org.
- Thorrez 7y ago
  That would be a funny reason to switch to .io because people have been complaining about .io as well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8587379 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8587379

orf 7y ago

Maybe name the company that's not responding and not updating the DNS record?

jolmg 7y ago
Why? It probably would come back to bite OP if it results in people reading their blog spamming or otherwise retaliating against the company.
TimWolla 7y ago
The 'Y' is mentioned in this blog post: https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2016/09/06/gmane-alive/ https://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/2016/09/06/gmane-alive/
snthd 7y ago
By making it possible to find, but not explicit it avoids low hanging outrage, which doesn't help anyone. If anyone contacts this company they need to assume good faith and be understanding - it's possible there are good reasons (the individuals health?) for the non-resposiveness. It's not like they've repurposed the domain for financial gain. I'm guessing C is cloudflare - in which case the situation is a bit ironic as the domain uses cloudflare DNS.