4 ms·

No rights, full liability would be a bad deal too.

kerkeslager 7y ago
A bad deal for whom? It's a bad deal for corporations, but I do not care. Lack of liability is the cause of a ton of problems in our society. Just to pick two stories of corporate sociopathy: Probably the reason people at State Farm are unconcernd about forging signatures[1] is that they know that the worst case scenario is that State Farm loses some business and maybe gets a fine: they are unlikely to go to jail for forgery or to have fines exacted from their personal bank accounts. Similarly, when Practice Fusion literally killed people[2], their execs had little to fear: nobody went to jail, nobody was fined: shareholders who had no visibility into the decision paid the fines. When banks tanked the economy with irresponsible lending most were bailed out and gave their workers bonuses, while the people who were unable to pay their mortgages were ignored. A little more liability for destructive behavior would be great for most people. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22177812 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22177812 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22165946 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22165946
- anticensor 7y ago
  > they are unlikely to go to jail for forgery Forgery is criminal regardless of private or official document is concerned. Even in a military setting, forgery of business-related documents are illegal. > A little more liability for destructive behavior would be great for most people. Why not full rights, full liability? Replace imprisonment and death by temporary and permanent suspension of company (including re-establishment of a sequel organisation out of a subset of stakeholders) respectively; and voila.
  - kerkeslager 7y ago
    That's an optimistic theory, but read the link I posted and decide for yourself if you think anybody is going to end up in jail for it. It seems like you're just picking out one aspect of each of my posts to disagree with. Do you have any disagreement with my overall point?

A bad deal for whom? It's a bad deal for corporations, but I do not care. Lack of liability is the cause of a ton of problems in our society. Just to pick two stories of corporate sociopathy: Probably the reason people at State Farm are unconcernd about forging signatures[1] is that they know that the worst case scenario is that State Farm loses some business and maybe gets a fine: they are unlikely to go to jail for forgery or to have fines exacted from their personal bank accounts. Similarly, when Practice Fusion literally killed people[2], their execs had little to fear: nobody went to jail, nobody was fined: shareholders who had no visibility into the decision paid the fines. When banks tanked the economy with irresponsible lending most were bailed out and gave their workers bonuses, while the people who were unable to pay their mortgages were ignored. A little more liability for destructive behavior would be great for most people. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22177812 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22177812 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22165946 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22165946

anticensor 7y ago
> they are unlikely to go to jail for forgery Forgery is criminal regardless of private or official document is concerned. Even in a military setting, forgery of business-related documents are illegal. > A little more liability for destructive behavior would be great for most people. Why not full rights, full liability? Replace imprisonment and death by temporary and permanent suspension of company (including re-establishment of a sequel organisation out of a subset of stakeholders) respectively; and voila.
- kerkeslager 7y ago
  That's an optimistic theory, but read the link I posted and decide for yourself if you think anybody is going to end up in jail for it. It seems like you're just picking out one aspect of each of my posts to disagree with. Do you have any disagreement with my overall point?