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We need a word (like "Godwin's Law" or "whataboutism") to shove in people's faces when they spam the response threads with "everyone is doing it" and "are you s

We need a word (like "Godwin's Law" or "whataboutism") to shove in people's faces when they spam the response threads with "everyone is doing it" and "are you surprised?" when a tweet or news item like "BigCo or BigGov is doing Bad Thing X." No we're not surprised but we didn't know, I want them to stop, and fuck you, your comment is not adding to the conversation.

mlyle 7y ago
It's a valid argument, though. I'll put it in different words to show. "This is useful for legitimate reasons and is an industry standard practice --- even though it has rife potential for abuse, too."
- freeone3000 7y ago
  It being a "standard industry practice" doesn't really affect the utility of the trade-off. "Kindle tracks every page turn in order to determine how long you have left in the book" would be a statement of the trade-off, and how much abuse there is and the worthwhileness would be a potential topic of discussion, but "industry standard practice" doesn't really have much bearing. If it's wrong for one person to do it, it's wrong for everyone, even if all people are doing it.
  - mlyle 7y ago
    > It being a "standard industry practice" doesn't really affect the utility of the trade-off. It doesn't affect the utility of the trade-off, but all else being equal we usually accept what exists now. Fighting what already defacto exists is hard-- either as lone consumers, where we're tilting at windmills to little effects... or as regulators, where we risk unintended consequences. > "Kindle tracks every page turn in order to determine how long you have left in the book" would be a statement of the trade-off Nah, Kindle tracks all these actions so that developers can improve ux and understand how the device is being used. Wonder how often people turn pages by mistake? Look for quick pairs of page forward with page backward. Then maybe you can think about touch sensitivity. How much will be people be annoyed if you remove the buttons? See what proportion of users exclusively, mostly, or don't use buttons. > If it's wrong for one person to do it, it's wrong for everyone, even if all people are doing it. It's wrong for anyone to abuse the information. If we have an industry of people using the information ethically, and then one bad actor misuses the information, we need to consider that background. Do we take measures solely against misuse, or do we attempt to stop the collection to have more certainty in stopping the misuse?
- wnoise 7y ago
  "This is useful for legitimate reasons" is an entirely different argument than "industry standard practice", which is just marketing speak for "everyone does it". The first is valid, the second is not.
  - mlyle 7y ago
    Was already argued / responded to here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22185382 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22185382 You could have addressed that instead of parroting the same point. :P

mlyle 7y ago

It's a valid argument, though. I'll put it in different words to show. "This is useful for legitimate reasons and is an industry standard practice --- even though it has rife potential for abuse, too."

freeone3000 7y ago
It being a "standard industry practice" doesn't really affect the utility of the trade-off. "Kindle tracks every page turn in order to determine how long you have left in the book" would be a statement of the trade-off, and how much abuse there is and the worthwhileness would be a potential topic of discussion, but "industry standard practice" doesn't really have much bearing. If it's wrong for one person to do it, it's wrong for everyone, even if all people are doing it.
- mlyle 7y ago
  > It being a "standard industry practice" doesn't really affect the utility of the trade-off. It doesn't affect the utility of the trade-off, but all else being equal we usually accept what exists now. Fighting what already defacto exists is hard-- either as lone consumers, where we're tilting at windmills to little effects... or as regulators, where we risk unintended consequences. > "Kindle tracks every page turn in order to determine how long you have left in the book" would be a statement of the trade-off Nah, Kindle tracks all these actions so that developers can improve ux and understand how the device is being used. Wonder how often people turn pages by mistake? Look for quick pairs of page forward with page backward. Then maybe you can think about touch sensitivity. How much will be people be annoyed if you remove the buttons? See what proportion of users exclusively, mostly, or don't use buttons. > If it's wrong for one person to do it, it's wrong for everyone, even if all people are doing it. It's wrong for anyone to abuse the information. If we have an industry of people using the information ethically, and then one bad actor misuses the information, we need to consider that background. Do we take measures solely against misuse, or do we attempt to stop the collection to have more certainty in stopping the misuse?
wnoise 7y ago
"This is useful for legitimate reasons" is an entirely different argument than "industry standard practice", which is just marketing speak for "everyone does it". The first is valid, the second is not.
- mlyle 7y ago
  Was already argued / responded to here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22185382 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22185382 You could have addressed that instead of parroting the same point. :P