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I am sorry you are so misinformed. Lithium is a common abundant resource and battery packs are easily recycled but more importantly there is a financial incent

by mcot2 7y ago

I am sorry you are so misinformed. Lithium is a common abundant resource and battery packs are easily recycled but more importantly there is a financial incentive to do so. Manufacturing technology for cells is improving rapidly. Much faster than the pace of innovation in Hydrogen fuel cells. Most are focusing on reducing Cobalt and other techniques to reduce or eliminate chemicals and energy used in wet electrode processes. Hydrogen is pretty much DOA for cars. This is a good video on the subject: https://youtu.be/f7MzFfuNOtY https://youtu.be/f7MzFfuNOtY

edhelas 7y ago
"common abundant" > Even though 365 years of reserve supply sounds very comforting, the point of the EV and stationary storage revolutions is that current demand will shoot up, way up, if these revolutions do happen. The 100 Gigafactories scenario could come true. And if that happens, the 365-year supply would be less than a 17-year supply (13.5 million tons of reserves divided by 800,000 = 16.9 years). https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/is-there-enough-lithium-to-maintain-the-growth-of-the-lithium-ion-battery-m https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/is-there-enough... Is 17 years "common and abundant" ? > But very little recycling goes on today. In Australia, for example, only 2–3% of Li-ion batteries are collected and sent offshore for recycling, according to Naomi J. Boxall, an environmental scientist at Australia’s Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organisation (CSIRO). The recycling rates in the European Union and the US—less than 5%—aren’t much higher. https://cen.acs.org/materials/energy-storage/time-serious-recycling-lithium/97/i28 https://cen.acs.org/materials/energy-storage/time-serious-re...
Amarok 7y ago
Perhaps lithium battery manufacture is improving rapidly because we're investing more on it. And your video has one huge logical fallacy "assuming energy comes only from Green and renewable sources" If that's the case then hydrogen is the most environmentally friendly choice even with the loss of energy, which is also improving.
Hypx 7y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battery_recycling#Lithium_ion_batteries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battery_recycling#Lithium_ion_... Li-ion batteries are very poorly recycled if at all. There is poor financial incentive to recycle batteries, and in fact you lose more money than you get back for many components. Pace of hydrogen fuel cell innovation is moving at warp speed: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cars/news/fuel-cell-powertrains-could-cheap-petrol-five-years-says-bmws/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cars/news/fuel-cell-powertrains-... We could see FCEVs no more expensive than ICEVs. > Hydrogen is pretty much DOA for cars. This is a good video on the subject: https://youtu.be/f7MzFfuNOtY https://youtu.be/f7MzFfuNOtY It's a nonsense youtube video, citing claims that are a decade out of date.

by mcot2 7y ago

edhelas 7y ago

"common abundant" > Even though 365 years of reserve supply sounds very comforting, the point of the EV and stationary storage revolutions is that current demand will shoot up, way up, if these revolutions do happen. The 100 Gigafactories scenario could come true. And if that happens, the 365-year supply would be less than a 17-year supply (13.5 million tons of reserves divided by 800,000 = 16.9 years). https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/is-there-enough-lithium-to-maintain-the-growth-of-the-lithium-ion-battery-m https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/is-there-enough... Is 17 years "common and abundant" ? > But very little recycling goes on today. In Australia, for example, only 2–3% of Li-ion batteries are collected and sent offshore for recycling, according to Naomi J. Boxall, an environmental scientist at Australia’s Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organisation (CSIRO). The recycling rates in the European Union and the US—less than 5%—aren’t much higher. https://cen.acs.org/materials/energy-storage/time-serious-recycling-lithium/97/i28 https://cen.acs.org/materials/energy-storage/time-serious-re...

Amarok 7y ago

Perhaps lithium battery manufacture is improving rapidly because we're investing more on it. And your video has one huge logical fallacy "assuming energy comes only from Green and renewable sources" If that's the case then hydrogen is the most environmentally friendly choice even with the loss of energy, which is also improving.

Hypx 7y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battery_recycling#Lithium_ion_batteries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battery_recycling#Lithium_ion_... Li-ion batteries are very poorly recycled if at all. There is poor financial incentive to recycle batteries, and in fact you lose more money than you get back for many components. Pace of hydrogen fuel cell innovation is moving at warp speed: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cars/news/fuel-cell-powertrains-could-cheap-petrol-five-years-says-bmws/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cars/news/fuel-cell-powertrains-... We could see FCEVs no more expensive than ICEVs. > Hydrogen is pretty much DOA for cars. This is a good video on the subject: https://youtu.be/f7MzFfuNOtY https://youtu.be/f7MzFfuNOtY It's a nonsense youtube video, citing claims that are a decade out of date.