3 ms·

They are probably excluded for not having any sort of symbolic communication system (writing, hieroglyphics, knot patterns, stuff like that).

by ars 7y ago

garmaine 7y ago
Or cities, monumental architecture, or unified government. The term "civilization" in this context is an academic category for historical societies, and its absence does not imply the pejorative "uncivilized."
a_bonobo 7y ago
There were at least message sticks: https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-australia-oceania/aboriginal-message-sticks-and-ancient-system-communication-001670 https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-australia-oce... >For instance, one of the message sticks in the Dandiiri Maiwar Exhibition at the Queensland Museum and Science centre is as follows: Bishop White of Carpentaria described how he delivered a message stick on behalf of an Aboriginal boy in Darwin to a boy in Daly Waters. Bishop White asked the boy from Darwin to explain the message. The boy read the message symbols which requested headbands and boomerangs from Daly Waters. The Bishop delivered the message stick and asked the recipient to tell him what the message was. The boy interpreted the message stick exactly as the boy from Darwin had explained it.
jacobush 7y ago
Which I understand, but it's also wrong. The dream songs are a symbolic communication and very stable at that, for millennia.
fit2rule 7y ago
Then this should be re-evaluated. They had no need for written communication systems, because they have (had) the most robust word of mouth, oral history of any human society. 40,000 years of oral traditions accurately reproduced over the generations. We 'civilised Europeans' can't even do 80 years. The argument can be made that the FNP of Australia are not only the longest running civilisation, but in terms of actual human activity, the most advanced. Longest-running, still in operation, mineral mines (20,000 years). They had cryptographic systems which not only kept the peace between 300 different languages, but enabled a massive trade network to flourish. Personally, I consider China young in comparison, and the West absolutely juvenile.

They are probably excluded for not having any sort of symbolic communication system (writing, hieroglyphics, knot patterns, stuff like that).

by ars 7y ago

They are probably excluded for not having any sort of symbolic communication system (writing, hieroglyphics, knot patterns, stuff like that).

garmaine 7y ago

Or cities, monumental architecture, or unified government. The term "civilization" in this context is an academic category for historical societies, and its absence does not imply the pejorative "uncivilized."

a_bonobo 7y ago

There were at least message sticks: https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-australia-oceania/aboriginal-message-sticks-and-ancient-system-communication-001670 https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-australia-oce... >For instance, one of the message sticks in the Dandiiri Maiwar Exhibition at the Queensland Museum and Science centre is as follows: Bishop White of Carpentaria described how he delivered a message stick on behalf of an Aboriginal boy in Darwin to a boy in Daly Waters. Bishop White asked the boy from Darwin to explain the message. The boy read the message symbols which requested headbands and boomerangs from Daly Waters. The Bishop delivered the message stick and asked the recipient to tell him what the message was. The boy interpreted the message stick exactly as the boy from Darwin had explained it.

jacobush 7y ago

Which I understand, but it's also wrong. The dream songs are a symbolic communication and very stable at that, for millennia.

fit2rule 7y ago

Then this should be re-evaluated. They had no need for written communication systems, because they have (had) the most robust word of mouth, oral history of any human society. 40,000 years of oral traditions accurately reproduced over the generations. We 'civilised Europeans' can't even do 80 years. The argument can be made that the FNP of Australia are not only the longest running civilisation, but in terms of actual human activity, the most advanced. Longest-running, still in operation, mineral mines (20,000 years). They had cryptographic systems which not only kept the peace between 300 different languages, but enabled a massive trade network to flourish. Personally, I consider China young in comparison, and the West absolutely juvenile.