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I'm not familiar with 5G infrastructure at all really, but a friend of mine brought up that they were worried about China beating the US to 5G deployment becaus

by dom2 7y ago

I'm not familiar with 5G infrastructure at all really, but a friend of mine brought up that they were worried about China beating the US to 5G deployment because if China did so, other counties would be more likely to use Chinese tech to setup their own 5G networks. This in turn would pose security issues as there seems to be concern over whether or not China could be trusted not to use their tech as spyware. Is anyone familiar with the issue who can speak more on this?

frequentnapper 7y ago
the issue is much bigger than just spyware. If a nation allows Huawei or any Chinese company to build its future tech infrastructure such as 5G, they are basically signing over their national security and interests over to the Chinese govt. E.g. your nation has someone who speaks out against the Chinese govt or something as dumb as making fun of the Chinese president. Hand him over or else we flick a switch here and the power grid in your city X goes down and there's nothing you can do about it. Why do yo think China is pushing Huawei so hard and vowing trade punishment against any nation in the EU or elsewhere if they stop Huawei? They want to control the future of those nations. This will give China every leverage they can get in terms of trade, compliance, security, etc. basically making each of these nations a vassal state to China.
- rusk 7y ago
  Makes sense to me ... I just cant get over how people are being labelled cranks for voicing what are pretty common sense concerns. I guess in the public mindset wireless network != critical infrastructure.
- cesarb 7y ago
  > Hand him over or else we flick a switch here and the power grid in your city X goes down and there's nothing you can do about it. The issue in your scenario is not who built the infrastructure, but who has remote access to it. Why would the manufacturer of (for instance) the PLCs controlling a substation have remote access to it? Wouldn't they be isolated in their own subnetwork, firewalled so that only a few hosts in the substation operator's network can reach it?
  - rusk 7y ago
    You do understand that this is managed infrastructure, right? Logging in and managing it remotely is literally part of the deal. It’s not even a secret.
mping 7y ago
I'm not familiar, but it was US's own NSA that was caught red handed. China has an aura of non compliance and state sponsored hacking but I trust them as much as the US.
- henryfjordan 7y ago
  I wouldn't trust the US govt (where I live) with my personal secrets, but I would trust them to protect the trade secrets of a business based in the US (yay corporatism!) I don't think China cares about my personal secrets nearly as much as the US does, but they are pretty actively engaging in state-sponsored corporate espionage.
  - noja 7y ago
    > I wouldn't trust the US govt with my personal secrets > I would trust them to protect the trade secrets of a business Would you trust a US business to protect your personal secrets more than the US government? Why?
    - henryfjordan 7y ago
      You misunderstand a bit. If I were Coca-cola, I would trust that the NSA would never ever reveal my secret recipe. But at the same time I wouldn't trust them not to read the private messages of my employees for other juicy stuff. America cares more about corporate rights than human rights.
      - ptx 7y ago
        That's nice for the American company, but why should companies and individuals in the rest of the world trust this American private/public conglomeration with their data? Foreigners have no rights under American law, from what I gather.
        henryfjordan 7y ago
        They shouldn't? I don't think I ever made that point. I was only speaking to the motivations of each Government. If I don't trust my own gov't to respect my private data, why would I tell anyone else to trust them? Foreigners have basically all the same rights as citizens under US law. Maybe you're thinking of the NSA's mandate to only collect foreign-bound US internet traffic, not domestic?
JohnFen 7y ago
> This in turn would pose security issues as there seems to be concern over whether or not China could be trusted not to use their tech as spyware. That's not special to China. No nation can be trusted in that way.

by dom2 7y ago

frequentnapper 7y ago

the issue is much bigger than just spyware. If a nation allows Huawei or any Chinese company to build its future tech infrastructure such as 5G, they are basically signing over their national security and interests over to the Chinese govt. E.g. your nation has someone who speaks out against the Chinese govt or something as dumb as making fun of the Chinese president. Hand him over or else we flick a switch here and the power grid in your city X goes down and there's nothing you can do about it. Why do yo think China is pushing Huawei so hard and vowing trade punishment against any nation in the EU or elsewhere if they stop Huawei? They want to control the future of those nations. This will give China every leverage they can get in terms of trade, compliance, security, etc. basically making each of these nations a vassal state to China.

rusk 7y ago
Makes sense to me ... I just cant get over how people are being labelled cranks for voicing what are pretty common sense concerns. I guess in the public mindset wireless network != critical infrastructure.
cesarb 7y ago
> Hand him over or else we flick a switch here and the power grid in your city X goes down and there's nothing you can do about it. The issue in your scenario is not who built the infrastructure, but who has remote access to it. Why would the manufacturer of (for instance) the PLCs controlling a substation have remote access to it? Wouldn't they be isolated in their own subnetwork, firewalled so that only a few hosts in the substation operator's network can reach it?
- rusk 7y ago
  You do understand that this is managed infrastructure, right? Logging in and managing it remotely is literally part of the deal. It’s not even a secret.

mping 7y ago

I'm not familiar, but it was US's own NSA that was caught red handed. China has an aura of non compliance and state sponsored hacking but I trust them as much as the US.

henryfjordan 7y ago
I wouldn't trust the US govt (where I live) with my personal secrets, but I would trust them to protect the trade secrets of a business based in the US (yay corporatism!) I don't think China cares about my personal secrets nearly as much as the US does, but they are pretty actively engaging in state-sponsored corporate espionage.
- noja 7y ago
  > I wouldn't trust the US govt with my personal secrets > I would trust them to protect the trade secrets of a business Would you trust a US business to protect your personal secrets more than the US government? Why?
  - henryfjordan 7y ago
    You misunderstand a bit. If I were Coca-cola, I would trust that the NSA would never ever reveal my secret recipe. But at the same time I wouldn't trust them not to read the private messages of my employees for other juicy stuff. America cares more about corporate rights than human rights.
    - ptx 7y ago
      That's nice for the American company, but why should companies and individuals in the rest of the world trust this American private/public conglomeration with their data? Foreigners have no rights under American law, from what I gather.
      - henryfjordan 7y ago
        They shouldn't? I don't think I ever made that point. I was only speaking to the motivations of each Government. If I don't trust my own gov't to respect my private data, why would I tell anyone else to trust them? Foreigners have basically all the same rights as citizens under US law. Maybe you're thinking of the NSA's mandate to only collect foreign-bound US internet traffic, not domestic?

JohnFen 7y ago

> This in turn would pose security issues as there seems to be concern over whether or not China could be trusted not to use their tech as spyware. That's not special to China. No nation can be trusted in that way.