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I learned couple of languages with the help of Duolingo. They claim t be the fastest way to learn a language. I recently realized is only valid if you don't wa

I learned couple of languages with the help of Duolingo. They claim t be the fastest way to learn a language. I recently realized is only valid if you don't want to put the work in. People who are not willing to put serious effort into learning a new language will find Duolingo useful. It's also useful if you come from similar language. E.g. you speak Italian and you want to learn Spanish (latin langauge). Or you're Czech and you want to learn Polish (slavic language, same grammar and compsition) But if you are serious about learning a language, Duolingo will only slow you down. You learn conversational stuff and progress often with big holes in the knowledge and understanding the core principles and structures of the language. For serious learners of a new language, keen to progress properly and fast Duolingo should be avoided.

Fnoord 7y ago
Duolingo works by means of repetition. The user can learn as much as they want. You need to define "serious learning" and "serious effort" if you want to make a well written critique. Which alternatives do you suggest? How much do they cost? How much time per month would you spend on these? Versus Duolingo? What is/are your end goal(s). In how many months would you reach your end goal(s)?
- michalu 7y ago
  Serious effort is when you drill the grammar and memorise tense and forms of words. You'll have a base to build on. Take English for example, difference between past simple vs. past continuous is easier explained once than randomly coming across on Duolingo never fully comprehending the principle. Therefore it's faster. And form someone coming from non-Germanic language this will take time to comprehend, kind of like when you first learned some math concepts as a child, some took a while to click. Now take words and their past forms, give, gave, given. In order to use it in a natural way, you first have to drill and memorise many words ... not possible on Duolingo as one lesson you work with a bunch of "gave" and suddenly several lessons you use "given" ... Yes, you can learn language in way that you go China and you're able to make primitive conversations. I know a lot of people speaking French that they learned conversational way and all of them struggle with grammar and despite being able to talk and communicate fluently their language is not enough for professional level or academic level. E.g. my girlfriend and I speak English, a language native to neither of us ... we can live a complete life together and we can talk but to a native speaker her mixing of tenses and grammar would sound like nonsense. This is the case with many of my foreign friends who learned English in a conversational way. Duolingo does the best what it's designed for. It's a way to learn for the lazy, so it is a game.
  - silicon2401 7y ago
    This is a very arbitrary definition of serious effort. I learned one language to the point of being reasonably fluent without ever "drilling". I just listened and spoke in class You also conveniently ignore the countless people (including adults) who reach fluency without even studying, instead just picking it up from immersion: work, media, etc. Duolingo is a specific tool. Like any tool, it's best for specific uses. Your judging its users as "lazy" is both baseless and unhelpful
    - andrewzah 7y ago
      What is "fluent" to you? I highly doubt anyone has ever become fluent in any language from a class. Classes are always behind, and teach textbook variants of a language. Useful, but won't make you "fluent". Immersion is still studying. Digesting actual native material ranges from hard to very difficult (i.e. dramas vs comedy shows, etc). Immersion + studying textbooks is 1000x better than gamified sources like duolingo, particularly for Chinese/Korean/Japanese. Also without knowing your native language and target language, the comparison is not useful. Spanish is quite easy for English speakers; good luck learning Cantonese without studying [for a very long time].
      - silicon2401 7y ago
        You come off attached to your existing conclusions: All duolingo users are lazy, and nobody can ever become fluent in a language from a class. You're free to believe these things if you want, but it will prevent us from having a constructive discussion. Cheers
        andrewzah 7y ago
        > All duolingo users are lazy Nope. Not everyone has a lot of time to dedicate to studying a language, which is fine. But duolingo is never going to give you any meaningful fluency. It's like saying "I want to get ripped by only doing body weight exercises for 5 mins/day". If your goal is just to say "Hi my name is X, where is the bathroom", then by all means use duolingo. > nobody can ever become fluent in a language from a class No class will ever teach you everything about a language, partly because there is way too much to teach, and partly because languages change all the time and classes can't keep up. Instead, classes give you a starting point to start reaching fluency, which begins once you start consuming native material and having conversations with real native speakers. Classes don't teach you slang, pop culture, casual expressions, and so on. Fluency is not making simple paragraphs or having a very basic, limited in scope & topic 10 min conversation. Language learning literature and other resources have lowered the bar for what "fluency" is, because nobody can sell a book or other resource by saying "use this book and learn french in 3-5 years". There is a lot of snake oil in this area, but people also want to believe in this notion that they can fluently speak a language with minimal effort.

Fnoord 7y ago

Duolingo works by means of repetition. The user can learn as much as they want. You need to define "serious learning" and "serious effort" if you want to make a well written critique. Which alternatives do you suggest? How much do they cost? How much time per month would you spend on these? Versus Duolingo? What is/are your end goal(s). In how many months would you reach your end goal(s)?

michalu 7y ago
Serious effort is when you drill the grammar and memorise tense and forms of words. You'll have a base to build on. Take English for example, difference between past simple vs. past continuous is easier explained once than randomly coming across on Duolingo never fully comprehending the principle. Therefore it's faster. And form someone coming from non-Germanic language this will take time to comprehend, kind of like when you first learned some math concepts as a child, some took a while to click. Now take words and their past forms, give, gave, given. In order to use it in a natural way, you first have to drill and memorise many words ... not possible on Duolingo as one lesson you work with a bunch of "gave" and suddenly several lessons you use "given" ... Yes, you can learn language in way that you go China and you're able to make primitive conversations. I know a lot of people speaking French that they learned conversational way and all of them struggle with grammar and despite being able to talk and communicate fluently their language is not enough for professional level or academic level. E.g. my girlfriend and I speak English, a language native to neither of us ... we can live a complete life together and we can talk but to a native speaker her mixing of tenses and grammar would sound like nonsense. This is the case with many of my foreign friends who learned English in a conversational way. Duolingo does the best what it's designed for. It's a way to learn for the lazy, so it is a game.
- silicon2401 7y ago
  This is a very arbitrary definition of serious effort. I learned one language to the point of being reasonably fluent without ever "drilling". I just listened and spoke in class You also conveniently ignore the countless people (including adults) who reach fluency without even studying, instead just picking it up from immersion: work, media, etc. Duolingo is a specific tool. Like any tool, it's best for specific uses. Your judging its users as "lazy" is both baseless and unhelpful
  - andrewzah 7y ago
    What is "fluent" to you? I highly doubt anyone has ever become fluent in any language from a class. Classes are always behind, and teach textbook variants of a language. Useful, but won't make you "fluent". Immersion is still studying. Digesting actual native material ranges from hard to very difficult (i.e. dramas vs comedy shows, etc). Immersion + studying textbooks is 1000x better than gamified sources like duolingo, particularly for Chinese/Korean/Japanese. Also without knowing your native language and target language, the comparison is not useful. Spanish is quite easy for English speakers; good luck learning Cantonese without studying [for a very long time].
    - silicon2401 7y ago
      You come off attached to your existing conclusions: All duolingo users are lazy, and nobody can ever become fluent in a language from a class. You're free to believe these things if you want, but it will prevent us from having a constructive discussion. Cheers
      - andrewzah 7y ago
        > All duolingo users are lazy Nope. Not everyone has a lot of time to dedicate to studying a language, which is fine. But duolingo is never going to give you any meaningful fluency. It's like saying "I want to get ripped by only doing body weight exercises for 5 mins/day". If your goal is just to say "Hi my name is X, where is the bathroom", then by all means use duolingo. > nobody can ever become fluent in a language from a class No class will ever teach you everything about a language, partly because there is way too much to teach, and partly because languages change all the time and classes can't keep up. Instead, classes give you a starting point to start reaching fluency, which begins once you start consuming native material and having conversations with real native speakers. Classes don't teach you slang, pop culture, casual expressions, and so on. Fluency is not making simple paragraphs or having a very basic, limited in scope & topic 10 min conversation. Language learning literature and other resources have lowered the bar for what "fluency" is, because nobody can sell a book or other resource by saying "use this book and learn french in 3-5 years". There is a lot of snake oil in this area, but people also want to believe in this notion that they can fluently speak a language with minimal effort.