3 ms·

Those that can do, those that can't, teach, and those that can't teach get tenure. This is an extremely ignorant and insulting statement. Further, you have ju

by tensor 16y ago

Those that can do, those that can't, teach, and those that can't teach get tenure. This is an extremely ignorant and insulting statement. Further, you have just asserted that the worlds best minds, and many of histories great figures, are all incapable fools. I hope you realize how this statement makes you look.

fleitz 16y ago
I would posit that "worlds best minds, and many of histories great figures" are revered for what they did and not what they taught, nor their positions of tenure. Did Einstein have tenure or a teaching position when he discovered relativity? Point out to me those revered figures of history known primarily for their teaching or tenure positions. The worthlessness of the university system is exemplified by people like the Admissions Dean of MIT who was able to perform magnificently at her job sans the appropriate degree. The degree obviously being so unimportant to MIT to even bother checking that she had it for some 30 odd years. http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/us/27mit.html http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/us/27mit.html The statement is insulting only to those who hold their degree / teaching position as part of their identity which is supposed to be some kind of proxy for them knowing / being able to do something. I greatly respect the capable, the intelligent, and the driven, what I don't think is that having a teaching position / tenure is a great proxy for knowing that.
- tensor 16y ago
  You do realize that you cannot get tenure without publishing many, many, relevant pieces of work, right? You also realize that to teach something you need to really understand it, correct? On the other hand, you can certainly apply knowledge without understanding it. Your statement is insulting to anyone who values knowledge, teaching it, and pursuing it. Perhaps you are not a native english speaker, but your statement is very easy to read as implying that only those who cannot do [what? research? engineering?] teach, and only those who are lousy teachers get tenure. It is an indefensible position and your obvious hostility towards modern academia is unjustified. For one academics don't necessarily want to teach. But as a society we deemed that we will in essence force them to. Why? We need good teachers and goodness knows industry won't waste money on it, let alone have any sort of quality control. So we force these people who have devoted their lives to research to also teach. As for tenure, it is often attacked as something protecting poor researchers. I think this notion is very much overblown. In modern times you cannot even get tenure before you are 35 or 40. If you look at those with tenure, the majority continue to do good work for the remainder of their careers. That aside, the main purpose of tenure is actually to protect the pursuit of knowledge. It exists to prevent management from dictating what people may research. It is to allow researchers to pursue risky or unpopular approaches. Academics do what they do because they primarily enjoy research. Insinuating that they are incapable of doing this simply because they also teach and are granted the protection of tenure is very insulting.
dmor 16y ago
the worlds best minds aren't those with tenure

by tensor 16y ago

fleitz 16y ago

I would posit that "worlds best minds, and many of histories great figures" are revered for what they did and not what they taught, nor their positions of tenure. Did Einstein have tenure or a teaching position when he discovered relativity? Point out to me those revered figures of history known primarily for their teaching or tenure positions. The worthlessness of the university system is exemplified by people like the Admissions Dean of MIT who was able to perform magnificently at her job sans the appropriate degree. The degree obviously being so unimportant to MIT to even bother checking that she had it for some 30 odd years. http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/us/27mit.html http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/us/27mit.html The statement is insulting only to those who hold their degree / teaching position as part of their identity which is supposed to be some kind of proxy for them knowing / being able to do something. I greatly respect the capable, the intelligent, and the driven, what I don't think is that having a teaching position / tenure is a great proxy for knowing that.

tensor 16y ago
You do realize that you cannot get tenure without publishing many, many, relevant pieces of work, right? You also realize that to teach something you need to really understand it, correct? On the other hand, you can certainly apply knowledge without understanding it. Your statement is insulting to anyone who values knowledge, teaching it, and pursuing it. Perhaps you are not a native english speaker, but your statement is very easy to read as implying that only those who cannot do [what? research? engineering?] teach, and only those who are lousy teachers get tenure. It is an indefensible position and your obvious hostility towards modern academia is unjustified. For one academics don't necessarily want to teach. But as a society we deemed that we will in essence force them to. Why? We need good teachers and goodness knows industry won't waste money on it, let alone have any sort of quality control. So we force these people who have devoted their lives to research to also teach. As for tenure, it is often attacked as something protecting poor researchers. I think this notion is very much overblown. In modern times you cannot even get tenure before you are 35 or 40. If you look at those with tenure, the majority continue to do good work for the remainder of their careers. That aside, the main purpose of tenure is actually to protect the pursuit of knowledge. It exists to prevent management from dictating what people may research. It is to allow researchers to pursue risky or unpopular approaches. Academics do what they do because they primarily enjoy research. Insinuating that they are incapable of doing this simply because they also teach and are granted the protection of tenure is very insulting.

dmor 16y ago

the worlds best minds aren't those with tenure