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I get it. It's hard to maintain hardware forever but the current trend of making hardware obsolete is just wasteful. These companies need to find a business mod

I get it. It's hard to maintain hardware forever but the current trend of making hardware obsolete is just wasteful. These companies need to find a business model for old hardware. I'm open to paying a maintenance fee that would give me critical updates after a certain point in time. Maybe 5%/yr of the original cost after 5 years. Sending working hardware to the dump is not a long term fix.

cushychicken 7y ago
This comment makes me think you didn't read the linked article. No hardware is being made obsolete, or getting sent to the dump.
- alasdair_ 7y ago
  >No hardware is being made obsolete, or getting sent to the dump. I assume this is in response to Sonos' program where they brick perfectly-usable devices (which then get sent to the dump) to prevent re-use after you take part in a trade-in program. https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20191231/07584043658/sonos-wasteful-recycle-mode-bricks-perfectly-usable-tech.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20191231/07584043658/sonos...
  - McTossOut 7y ago
    Oh, good, an outright lie. This is how a $2B company behaves - before they've turned a profit? If anything in the last 6 years, Google/Apple have made significant headway standardizing the 'Cast' workflow. If the hardware could, "receive, forward, and playback" sound from a network 5 years ago, it should be able to do so until the link is obsolete, every AP I've encountered supports all the way back to 802.11a from 15 years ago, and in the worst case you just bridge your APs. Apps are apps, networks are networks, if they're anticipating getting pushed out of this niche by the "ecosystem proprietors", Sonos is stupid and should realize that they just can't do anything about it and focus on their product development, pricing, their horrid marketing / website and not pissing away their multi-million dollar TV ad expenditure over the years on bad press. What happens if consumers turn on the music industry should they start tuning their EQ out of the box for fart noises, screaming, and 20 year old Asian women punching gak? What if it becomes economical to fill your whole house with water, maybe they should develop underwater speakers asap! Clean up your act, Sonos.
- Polylactic_acid 7y ago
  The link is dead for me but what I assumes it says is that they aren't instantly killing these products but they won't update them which means eventually the API on the other end will change and these devices won't work anymore. Speakers are a product that should in theory last an extremely long time. The surround sound system in my grandmas house is some bose system from at least 25 years ago and it still functions perfectly fine because it relies on no software updates or external APIs. Do you think these sonos speakers will still be fully functional in 20 years?
  - Marsymars 7y ago
    > Do you think these sonos speakers will still be fully functional in 20 years? I expect the ones with audio inputs ports will still be usable as speakers in 20 years.
- WheelsAtLarge 7y ago
  I guess I went too broad with my comment about this blog. They are saying that they will maintain them as much as possible. This means that the updates will eventually end and they will stop working. I have dumb speakers that are 10 years old that work great and will continue to work but Sonos will stop working because of a lack of software but they are still in working order. My point is that we need a way to conserve resources rather than sending them to the trash. It's not just Sonos. Hardware manufacturer's business model is to make their products obsolete so we replace them. And it's only going to get worse with the wave of IoT gadgets that are coming in the future. It can't work forever.
Hamuko 7y ago
Don't worry, they're RESPONSIBLE and SUSTAINABLE. https://www.sonos.com/en/sustainability https://www.sonos.com/en/sustainability
ocdtrekkie 7y ago
It'd be nice if more hardware had like a "logic board upgrade" capability, but the business incentive just isn't there. Obviously most of the value in high end audio is the audio components, and those are probably not obsolete. If you buy a smart TV, most of the value is in the display panel which is probably not obsolete. But old processors, old software platforms, etc. tend to doom a lot of these types of hardware, and I'd love to just replace the "computer part" of them. But the only way I could see that making financial sense for these businesses who'd rather just sell you the whole thing again, is if there was some sort of financial penalty/tax for bricking hardware. (I am currently lamenting that my 2016 TV, only around three years old, can't get the CBS All Access app, even though it got Disney+. Apparently CBS and LG thinks only people who bought TVs since 2018 want to watch Picard.)
- dv_dt 7y ago
  At least with the TV, you can likely just add an external device pretty easily. Though I would love a TV with a device bay that was designed to supply a third party module power and an HDMI port - fewer wires to route would be a selling feature for me..
  - MisterTea 7y ago
    If you open a modern TV it's just an lcd display with a small motherboard that has an Arm SoC with an integrated AV switcher and tuner built in. It's a crime that cant be replaced with something more useful.
  - jzwinck 7y ago
    Commercial TVs used in airports and museums often have device bays that can interact with at least power and HDMI, sometimes much more. The problem is they are quite expensive. Partly due to fewer being sold, but also engineering the modular bus, fancy connectors, etc. Some of the plug-in boards are as expensive as a whole consumer TV. Part of what we get now is simply the result of our desire to buy a massive 60 inch screen for under a grand, a 95% price reduction in less than 20 years.
    - 7y ago
Polylactic_acid 7y ago
Its just the next phase of capitalism. Once you have sold your product to the entire target market where do you expand from there? You have to remove the previous products so you can sell it again.
lysium 7y ago
I get it if I wanted new features. I don’t get it if I just want to stream music, the very reason why I bought a Sonos speaker in the first page. Threatening to just discontinue this service for no reason is just not cool. I see my mistake to have bought an all-in-one package instead of an external streaming device.
ISL 7y ago
It might also be sufficient if manufacturers open-sourced devices (designs, firmware, software) at end of life.
- bogle 7y ago
  Even if they left some of it as binary blobs and cut off the older systems from the Sonos ecosystem I'd be happy with this solution. I need the speakers to talk to each other so I can play throughout the house over wifi but as I have a Sonos Bridge to my old hi-fi I don't need them to talk to the internet themselves.

cushychicken 7y ago

This comment makes me think you didn't read the linked article. No hardware is being made obsolete, or getting sent to the dump.

alasdair_ 7y ago
>No hardware is being made obsolete, or getting sent to the dump. I assume this is in response to Sonos' program where they brick perfectly-usable devices (which then get sent to the dump) to prevent re-use after you take part in a trade-in program. https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20191231/07584043658/sonos-wasteful-recycle-mode-bricks-perfectly-usable-tech.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20191231/07584043658/sonos...
- McTossOut 7y ago
  Oh, good, an outright lie. This is how a $2B company behaves - before they've turned a profit? If anything in the last 6 years, Google/Apple have made significant headway standardizing the 'Cast' workflow. If the hardware could, "receive, forward, and playback" sound from a network 5 years ago, it should be able to do so until the link is obsolete, every AP I've encountered supports all the way back to 802.11a from 15 years ago, and in the worst case you just bridge your APs. Apps are apps, networks are networks, if they're anticipating getting pushed out of this niche by the "ecosystem proprietors", Sonos is stupid and should realize that they just can't do anything about it and focus on their product development, pricing, their horrid marketing / website and not pissing away their multi-million dollar TV ad expenditure over the years on bad press. What happens if consumers turn on the music industry should they start tuning their EQ out of the box for fart noises, screaming, and 20 year old Asian women punching gak? What if it becomes economical to fill your whole house with water, maybe they should develop underwater speakers asap! Clean up your act, Sonos.
Polylactic_acid 7y ago
The link is dead for me but what I assumes it says is that they aren't instantly killing these products but they won't update them which means eventually the API on the other end will change and these devices won't work anymore. Speakers are a product that should in theory last an extremely long time. The surround sound system in my grandmas house is some bose system from at least 25 years ago and it still functions perfectly fine because it relies on no software updates or external APIs. Do you think these sonos speakers will still be fully functional in 20 years?
- Marsymars 7y ago
  > Do you think these sonos speakers will still be fully functional in 20 years? I expect the ones with audio inputs ports will still be usable as speakers in 20 years.
WheelsAtLarge 7y ago
I guess I went too broad with my comment about this blog. They are saying that they will maintain them as much as possible. This means that the updates will eventually end and they will stop working. I have dumb speakers that are 10 years old that work great and will continue to work but Sonos will stop working because of a lack of software but they are still in working order. My point is that we need a way to conserve resources rather than sending them to the trash. It's not just Sonos. Hardware manufacturer's business model is to make their products obsolete so we replace them. And it's only going to get worse with the wave of IoT gadgets that are coming in the future. It can't work forever.

Hamuko 7y ago

Don't worry, they're RESPONSIBLE and SUSTAINABLE. https://www.sonos.com/en/sustainability https://www.sonos.com/en/sustainability

ocdtrekkie 7y ago

It'd be nice if more hardware had like a "logic board upgrade" capability, but the business incentive just isn't there. Obviously most of the value in high end audio is the audio components, and those are probably not obsolete. If you buy a smart TV, most of the value is in the display panel which is probably not obsolete. But old processors, old software platforms, etc. tend to doom a lot of these types of hardware, and I'd love to just replace the "computer part" of them. But the only way I could see that making financial sense for these businesses who'd rather just sell you the whole thing again, is if there was some sort of financial penalty/tax for bricking hardware. (I am currently lamenting that my 2016 TV, only around three years old, can't get the CBS All Access app, even though it got Disney+. Apparently CBS and LG thinks only people who bought TVs since 2018 want to watch Picard.)

dv_dt 7y ago
At least with the TV, you can likely just add an external device pretty easily. Though I would love a TV with a device bay that was designed to supply a third party module power and an HDMI port - fewer wires to route would be a selling feature for me..
- MisterTea 7y ago
  If you open a modern TV it's just an lcd display with a small motherboard that has an Arm SoC with an integrated AV switcher and tuner built in. It's a crime that cant be replaced with something more useful.
- jzwinck 7y ago
  Commercial TVs used in airports and museums often have device bays that can interact with at least power and HDMI, sometimes much more. The problem is they are quite expensive. Partly due to fewer being sold, but also engineering the modular bus, fancy connectors, etc. Some of the plug-in boards are as expensive as a whole consumer TV. Part of what we get now is simply the result of our desire to buy a massive 60 inch screen for under a grand, a 95% price reduction in less than 20 years.
  - 7y ago

Polylactic_acid 7y ago

Its just the next phase of capitalism. Once you have sold your product to the entire target market where do you expand from there? You have to remove the previous products so you can sell it again.

lysium 7y ago

I get it if I wanted new features. I don’t get it if I just want to stream music, the very reason why I bought a Sonos speaker in the first page. Threatening to just discontinue this service for no reason is just not cool. I see my mistake to have bought an all-in-one package instead of an external streaming device.

ISL 7y ago

It might also be sufficient if manufacturers open-sourced devices (designs, firmware, software) at end of life.

bogle 7y ago
Even if they left some of it as binary blobs and cut off the older systems from the Sonos ecosystem I'd be happy with this solution. I need the speakers to talk to each other so I can play throughout the house over wifi but as I have a Sonos Bridge to my old hi-fi I don't need them to talk to the internet themselves.