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your success is the mostly the result of a massive amount of luck and privilege you've received. just imagine that you had an accident that reduced your brai

by zzzeek 7y ago

your success is the mostly the result of a massive amount of luck and privilege you've received. just imagine that you had an accident that reduced your brain capacity by 20%... you could then have worked three times harder but sadly not achieved the same success. While your hard work is an element of your success, it is not at all the foundation of it. It's more akin to a chef putting the correct seasoning on a fully prepared dish. It's definitely needed, but it's not the basis.

refurb 7y ago
That seems like a pointless argument. Sure, I'm successful because I wasn't run over by car when I was 12.
- Psyladine 7y ago
  Yeah, you are. So when you're talking to someone who lost a beautiful person in their life because someone else decided they were fine driving after a night out of drinking, you can realize how arbitrary and random life really is.
  - friendlybus 7y ago
    Sorry for your loss. Being alive is a pre-requisite for success, but doesn't make it guaranteed.
    - Psyladine 7y ago
      The fact there is no guarantee makes it inherently luck based.
- zzzeek 7y ago
  it seems like you missed the argument entirely. hard work means nothing if you are not fortunate enough to have the foundation with which to work upon. the person with 20% less brain capacity can do way more work than you, and not get anywhere, which proves that there is no linear relationship between hard work and success. something else has to be present for "hard work" to lead towards success. There are some people working much harder than you at their job at McDonalds, and they will not be as successful as you. Your hard work did not create your success, your circumstances did most of the work in making the conditions right, just like human evolution would not have happened if there weren't a perfectly conditioned Earth present that took billions of years to create. Your hard work was just one of many prerequisites for your success to occur (and of course, many people don't need to work very hard at all to be successful, due to their circumstances as well), and additionally, your capacity, desire, and stamina for such hard work are also things that you were lucky enough to have.
  - refurb 7y ago
    Your hard work did not create your success Yes, but without hard work, your unlikely to be successful. I don’t disagree that both play a role, but some people like to claim success is 100% luck, which I definitely disagree with.
  - friendlybus 7y ago
    A person with 20% less brain capacity would be aiming at a different form of success, with different tools. Dragging his place down to lower situations doesn't change the life changing potential of properly applied hard work. We are not victims of our circumstances.
    - AstralStorm 7y ago
      We aren't victims. But we are rather hemmed in by circumstances and budget with the exception of top 0.5%. Feel like working 8h today? No? Too bad. Need rest for mental reasons? Sorry you're out of holidays. Want to work on rocket science? Unfortunately no positions are open and the longer you're out, the less likely you will get in. That if you even studied the right things. Or maybe you feel like being a fireman but failing the physicals? Perhaps a doctor? But you need those 6 years of education plus actual knowledge. And this have to weather those years. If you're not rich, you get to work some trash job in the meantime hoping it won't affect you or the studies. Etc. And do not even get me started on social network you cannot begin to choose unless you have copious free time.
      - zzzeek 7y ago
        everyone is hemmed in by their circumstances. Steve Jobs got pancreatic cancer, and all his billions could do nothing to prevent his death. We are all in the same boat, it's just some of us don't really see it.
        friendlybus 7y ago
        He turned down treatment early on that he later regretted. It's true he would die eventually anyway. Life and death can be used to describe anything that lives including the individual.

by zzzeek 7y ago

refurb 7y ago

That seems like a pointless argument. Sure, I'm successful because I wasn't run over by car when I was 12.

Psyladine 7y ago
Yeah, you are. So when you're talking to someone who lost a beautiful person in their life because someone else decided they were fine driving after a night out of drinking, you can realize how arbitrary and random life really is.
- friendlybus 7y ago
  Sorry for your loss. Being alive is a pre-requisite for success, but doesn't make it guaranteed.
  - Psyladine 7y ago
    The fact there is no guarantee makes it inherently luck based.
zzzeek 7y ago
it seems like you missed the argument entirely. hard work means nothing if you are not fortunate enough to have the foundation with which to work upon. the person with 20% less brain capacity can do way more work than you, and not get anywhere, which proves that there is no linear relationship between hard work and success. something else has to be present for "hard work" to lead towards success. There are some people working much harder than you at their job at McDonalds, and they will not be as successful as you. Your hard work did not create your success, your circumstances did most of the work in making the conditions right, just like human evolution would not have happened if there weren't a perfectly conditioned Earth present that took billions of years to create. Your hard work was just one of many prerequisites for your success to occur (and of course, many people don't need to work very hard at all to be successful, due to their circumstances as well), and additionally, your capacity, desire, and stamina for such hard work are also things that you were lucky enough to have.
- refurb 7y ago
  Your hard work did not create your success Yes, but without hard work, your unlikely to be successful. I don’t disagree that both play a role, but some people like to claim success is 100% luck, which I definitely disagree with.
- friendlybus 7y ago
  A person with 20% less brain capacity would be aiming at a different form of success, with different tools. Dragging his place down to lower situations doesn't change the life changing potential of properly applied hard work. We are not victims of our circumstances.
  - AstralStorm 7y ago
    We aren't victims. But we are rather hemmed in by circumstances and budget with the exception of top 0.5%. Feel like working 8h today? No? Too bad. Need rest for mental reasons? Sorry you're out of holidays. Want to work on rocket science? Unfortunately no positions are open and the longer you're out, the less likely you will get in. That if you even studied the right things. Or maybe you feel like being a fireman but failing the physicals? Perhaps a doctor? But you need those 6 years of education plus actual knowledge. And this have to weather those years. If you're not rich, you get to work some trash job in the meantime hoping it won't affect you or the studies. Etc. And do not even get me started on social network you cannot begin to choose unless you have copious free time.
    - zzzeek 7y ago
      everyone is hemmed in by their circumstances. Steve Jobs got pancreatic cancer, and all his billions could do nothing to prevent his death. We are all in the same boat, it's just some of us don't really see it.
      - friendlybus 7y ago
        He turned down treatment early on that he later regretted. It's true he would die eventually anyway. Life and death can be used to describe anything that lives including the individual.