3 ms·

I don't even understand what life means without economic growth anymore.. no new companies, no new technologies, no new anything. Nothing to strive towards, no

I don't even understand what life means without economic growth anymore.. no new companies, no new technologies, no new anything. Nothing to strive towards, no chance to escape the station of life you were born in. Its like growth is THE civilization level goal we've had since forever. We need to move from A to B. What do we even do without a place to go? What will happen to civilization without a goal we can all organize around in elaborate structures called societies and clubs and companies and move to? Maybe if i was younger i would have answers, or that question wouldn't even matter but not anymore. (OP if you have any thoughts on it i'd love to hear them)

lisper 7y ago
No (economic) growth != no change. The main thing we need to get past is the assumption that is currently woven deeply into our financial system that debt is sustainable because the next generation will be more productive than the last. That kind of growth has to end somewhere. That does not mean that we can't keep inventing new stuff.
murftown 7y ago
Not OP, but read your comment and felt inspired to respond. I understand your mindset - in a sense, the absence of growth implies death, all life needs growth, etc. However, growth is not a purely-quantitative, 1-dimensional value. There are an infinite number of possible futures that all constitute growth relative to here and now. Which aspects will do most of the growth? Will there be more humans? more relationships? more industry? more data? more meaning? There are an infinite number of things that can grow, and even within a single vertical, multiple ways to grow. Therefore, any specific growth we undergo has an "opportunity cost" of whatever other ways we could have grown. Not to mention, most kinds of growth require some destruction, so in addition to potential value, you lose the immediate value of whatever you destroy. Therefore, in my view, the 2 ways we need to grow the most are: - Get smarter in the ways that would enable us to accurately predict good ways to grow. This helps us do the following better: - Build up the -potential- to grow, or at least remain alive, in dimensions that, right now, to us, seem good or necessary. - Learn how to know when, and how, to unleash that -potential-. Does that make sense? And does it relate?

lisper 7y ago

No (economic) growth != no change. The main thing we need to get past is the assumption that is currently woven deeply into our financial system that debt is sustainable because the next generation will be more productive than the last. That kind of growth has to end somewhere. That does not mean that we can't keep inventing new stuff.

murftown 7y ago

Not OP, but read your comment and felt inspired to respond. I understand your mindset - in a sense, the absence of growth implies death, all life needs growth, etc. However, growth is not a purely-quantitative, 1-dimensional value. There are an infinite number of possible futures that all constitute growth relative to here and now. Which aspects will do most of the growth? Will there be more humans? more relationships? more industry? more data? more meaning? There are an infinite number of things that can grow, and even within a single vertical, multiple ways to grow. Therefore, any specific growth we undergo has an "opportunity cost" of whatever other ways we could have grown. Not to mention, most kinds of growth require some destruction, so in addition to potential value, you lose the immediate value of whatever you destroy. Therefore, in my view, the 2 ways we need to grow the most are: - Get smarter in the ways that would enable us to accurately predict good ways to grow. This helps us do the following better: - Build up the -potential- to grow, or at least remain alive, in dimensions that, right now, to us, seem good or necessary. - Learn how to know when, and how, to unleash that -potential-. Does that make sense? And does it relate?